Air Guard with ROTC contract

J

JamieG

5-Year Member
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Jun 16, 2013
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Hey, I know that ANG does not have SMP, but I heard that if you are in ANG you still become non-deployable status once you contract with the ROTC.

Goals/Priorities:
I really want to use an AFROTC scholarship to pay for school and have a career in the Air Force, but I have seen how ROTC SMP cadet's time in the ARNG counts toward total service time for pay and retirement which is really attractive to me. Right now I am leaning toward doing AROTC and SMP, but my heart is definitely in the Air Force.
 
Are you already in the ANG?

Do you want to only go ANG and not ADAF?

Have you checked out this site? http://www.goang.com/About

If you are not in ANG, remember that if you are just entering college, the retirement benefits are 24 yrs away in either scenario. Yes, you would have 4 more yrs with ANG, but there are so many hurdles in front of you just to commission I would not place that into the equation at all.

SFT selection
Commissioning
O4 promotion

I would also look into other things regarding this decision. ADAF typically uses TA for Masters, not sure, but I believe ANG uses the GI Bill only.

Also what type of career are you looking for in either ADAF or ANG. Want to fly, it can be a harder route from a selection purpose.

As far as choosing AROTC because of SMP, and the fact you are looking 20 yrs down the road already, it is hard to stay on the path for 20 yrs when in the 1st place it was not in your heart. 10-15 yrs now from now you will have a family, and weekend warriors can still be called up for deployments...hard to hang for 10 more yrs. until retirement, if you don't want to be in it now. Life is funny...it tends to get in the way of the plans you made at 17.

OBTW, I would check out with a recruiter regarding retirement. I think they are a points and yr system. IOTW, those 4 yrs as a weekend warrior might not be as much as you think. I don't think it will be the same amount as the ADAF with 24 yrs. (50% for 20, and 2.5% for every yr after = 60% of base pay). It might be that the 4 yrs equals 1 yr. since you are only accruing @ 3 months of AD time during those 4 yrs.
~~~ No flaming, just assumptions. ANG accumulate 2 days for each 1 day, thus 4 days a month = 2 months +, 2 weeks, will equal 1 more month. Multiply by 4 yrs and you are at @ 1 yr., or an additional 2.5%.
 
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Okay before I reply here is a little bit about me.

1. I am a 24 year old male. I am entering college as a freshman this fall where I will study Aerospace Engineering as part of a 3+2 program where I do 3 years at Franciscan University of Steubenville and 2 years at Notre Dame. The reason I am entering so late in life is because I have devoted the last 5 years of my life to doing ministry and works of charity in my area.
2. The things I have done have included feeding the poor, volunteering at the homeless shelter(my dad was one of the facilitators), assistant youth group minister, led and taught a chastity group for homeschooled teenagers(2 years), started 2 groups to minister to young adults and college students, led retreats and ministry training days, Emceed large church events of 250+ people, coordinated a large diocesan wide ministry called Freedom To Worship in the diocese of St. Petersburg.
3. This past December I discerned that I need to leave ministry and go back to school for engineering. I was accepted into both my first and second choices for college(2 private universities, AMU and FUS) and offered partial academic scholarships. I have a 3.8 unweighted HS GPA and a 4.3 weighted GPA. I have done sports most of my life and I emphasize physical fitness. Currently I can max out the PFT in pushups and sit-ups, but I am still working on the 2 mile run, but I have the intention of getting a perfect 300 on the test for ROTC.
4. I have had a number of jobs since I was 19 ranging from working at hourly wage at Chick-Fil-A to working full time in a call center sales job that pays around 52k/year to even working in a small company as an advertising salesman with my own office and lots of perks.

I have a good amount of life experience for someone entering college as a freshman. I know what I want in life and my goals are not premature although my plans may be nieve which is why I am here asking questions. I am huge on goal setting and strategically planning on how to accomplish those goals. I am hoping that the members of this forum can help me do this.

Pima said:
Are you already in the ANG?
No, I am currently a civilian.

Do you want to only go ANG and not ADAF?
I desire to do Active Duty in either the Air force or Army. The reason I mentioned doing ANG/reserves is because if I go the Army ROTC route and do SMP I plan on accepting the GFRD scholarship because of the great financial benefit, but that would force me into the guard/reserves for 8 years. I would prefer to do active duty, but I am not opposed to the guard/reserves. In the end I am trying to do whatever is best for my family. I intend on getting married either at graduation or during my year before graduation/commissioning.

Have you checked out this site? http://www.goang.com/About
Yes, I have spent the last two weeks doing a lot of research, but I have certain questions I have not found answers to which is why I am seeking your help.

If you are not in ANG, remember that if you are just entering college, the retirement benefits are 24 yrs away in either scenario. Yes, you would have 4 more yrs with ANG, but there are so many hurdles in front of you just to commission I would not place that into the equation at all.

SFT selection
Commissioning
O4 promotion
I understand that. The possibility of doing a full 20 year active duty career is very exciting to me. Whether or not that is the road I end up going down really depends on two things. 1. Whether or not I choose the active duty route initially. 2. Whatever is the best situation for my family when I am 4 years into active duty and I have to make that decision. Like I said I am a planner so when I am 4 years out of school I want to have those extra 4 years for retirement if I do decide to make the military a career. I do not see commissioning as a pass fail situation. If I choose to pursue a commission I will make it happen, and my goal will be to make it happen with the highest honors that I can. When I give myself to something I give everything I have to it. For example, I have never dated girls before now because I never found someone I would marry. I finally have found someone and I have already known her and been friends for 4 years. I know I can give my all to her so I am open to pursuing that relationship.

I would also look into other things regarding this decision. ADAF typically uses TA for Masters, not sure, but I believe ANG uses the GI Bill only.
I had a friend who did AFROTC and he was able to use his GI bill immediately after commissioning and spent his first 2 years pursuing his masters on the GI bill while also working full time active duty.

Also what type of career are you looking for in either ADAF or ANG. Want to fly, it can be a harder route from a selection purpose.
Although I would love to fly I don’t see it as a good option for my family. I am not entirely closed to it, but it would only be an option if I was intending on doing 20 years+ in the ADAF. I am studying Aerospace Engineering so I expect to do something somewhat related to that skillset. I know most engineers in the military do some type of project management which is exciting to me, but I am an open book in this regard as long as I am doing something that uses my skillset.

As far as choosing AROTC because of SMP, and the fact you are looking 20 yrs down the road already, it is hard to stay on the path for 20 yrs when in the 1st place it was not in your heart. 10-15 yrs now from now you will have a family, and weekend warriors can still be called up for deployments...hard to hang for 10 more yrs. until retirement, if you don't want to be in it now. Life is funny...it tends to get in the way of the plans you made at 17.
The only reason I said AROTC is not in my heart is because I would have to choose reserves/guard and not do active duty and a 20 year career. If active duty was a realistic option for my goals/priorities I would be just as pulled toward Army as I am Air Force. I spoke to an Army Colonel for 40 minutes the other day who had studied Mechanical Engineering for his undergrad and retired after 20 years. We spoke about my options and I am very open to the Army as well as the Air Force.

OBTW, I would check out with a recruiter regarding retirement. I think they are a points and yr system. IOTW, those 4 yrs as a weekend warrior might not be as much as you think. I don't think it will be the same amount as the ADAF with 24 yrs. (50% for 20, and 2.5% for every yr after = 60% of base pay). It might be that the 4 yrs equals 1 yr. since you are only accruing @ 3 months of AD time during those 4 yrs.
~~~ No flaming, just assumptions. ANG accumulate 2 days for each 1 day, thus 4 days a month = 2 months +, 2 weeks, will equal 1 more month. Multiply by 4 yrs and you are at @ 1 yr., or an additional 2.5%.
I have already confirmed that your time in ANG drilling would indeed count fully toward your retirement. So at 20 years active I would be able to retire with 60% retirement instead of 50%. As well as my pay would always be rated as being in the military for 4 years longer. When I commission as an O1 I will be paid as an O1 with 4 years. This doesn’t make a huge difference until O3+ but it does make a difference after that.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your reply. What I am really looking for is an answer to my question “Hey, I know that ANG does not have SMP, but I heard that if you are in ANG you still become non-deployable status once you contract with the ROTC.” My assumption is that you do not become non-deployable but I saw someone else say you do so I just wanted confirmation.

Thanks!
 
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I am guessing the tests are to get you to a 10 post min to PM people. When you get to the pm ability, feel free to pm me for a website forum you might want to visit. It is against the regs here to link other forums.

As far as your response here goes (forgive me if it disjointed, because you have 2 different things going on in your reply regarding the quote portions):

1. AFROTC maybe frustrating at the age of 24, and a 100. Your maturity level even 5 yrs later will be at a different level than the avg 22 yo.

2. ANG is like the Army, they hire their own. That includes officers wanting to do Palace Chase for ADAF. You will need their approval to go ADAF.

3. ANG like SMP has cadets in ROTC. The biggie here is that for AFROTC you must be selected for SFT to become a POC and contract. Chances are strong being an ANG cadet, you will get it, but, still AFROTC boards decides this, not ANG.
~~~~ NO SFT = NO POC. Commissioning is out the window.

4. Have you talked to anyone regarding O4 promotion rates at the ANG you will join? Have you compared those numbers to ADAF O4 boards?
~The fact is O4 is not a given in the ADAF, and no O4 = no retirement usually.

5. Sequestration is not just this yr. The budget cuts will be going for 10 yrs
~ Have you talked to both Army and AF about how they will handle this. Last I knew, AF did their hard cuts for personnel @2 yrs ago. The Army because they were in the thick of it still need to trim personnel. I will leave that to posters like Marist, Clarkson, Jcleppe to answer how the AD world is dealing with it for newly minted O1s.

6. GF. You are serious with someone right now, before you move forward, discuss this with her.
~ Not every girl wants to give her career to follow you around the world for your career. Not every girl understands that going ANG can mean deployment for months to areas like Iraq (Gulf 1, II, Haiti, etc).
~~~ People plan MILITARY laughs. If you enter thinking it will pay for college and you will be weekend warrior, you could find yourself making a deal with the devil. I had a friend learn that very quickly during Desert Storm, as a young mother of 2.

7. TA vs GI Bill
~ ADAF uses the TA for their Masters because it runs concurrent withe their commitment and pays for 75% of the tuition. The new GI Bill allows them to use it for their kids college education. As a planner, TA is a better option since it is concurrent.
~~ Something to look into as an engineering major because you will want a Grad degree for career planning.

8. Retirement pay.
~ Assumption you make O4, but not O5, because you didn't have the points for promotion.
~~~ I am too lazy to look up DFAS.mil for O5 and 20 compared to O4 and 24, but my guess is that O5s AD make more than the O4s with 24.

I know you want an answer to your question of:
JamieG said:
My assumption is that you do not become non-deployable but I saw someone else say you do so I just wanted confirmation.
Click to expand...

Here is the only answer anyone should ever give to that question.

SERVICE BEFORE SELF!

If that unit is called up, and your AFSC is deemed critical than you will go because the AF mission comes first.
 
Hi Jamie;

The answer to your original question regarding deployable status as a member of the Air National Guard while in AFROTC is: YOU ARE DEPLOYABLE and remain deployable during your college years. Unlike the Army ROTC and SMP program when your status changes and you become non-deployable for a portion of your college years.

Please verify with your ANG Recruiter and AFROTC Enrollment officer that you can do both (ANG membership and AFROTC membership) simultaneously.

A possible option: ANG during college, apply for OTS (Officer Training School) your senior year. If accepted to OTS and you successfully complete, you are on to Active Duty Air Force.

Second option: apply for commissioned position with ANG your senior year. They would send you to their commissioning school in Knoxville TN (McGhee Tyson Airbase), which is optimized (accelerated training, shorter than OTS) for prior enlisted folks. You would then attend training (pilot, navigator, MX Officer, Logistics, etc.) on active duty, returning to local ANG unit once training is completed. More of a part-time gig, but if a pilot/navigator/wizzo, you can put in many additional days/trips and get up to 3/4 time pay while building up your hours to fly for one of the major airlines (Delta-United-American, etc.). I personally know of many ANG part-time pilots who are full-time civilian pilots with the major carriers and got their start this way.

FYI: It is virtually impossible to convert from commissioned ANG to active duty. Last time I saw that happen was 2002 (I believe the regulation has since been updated which effectively shut down this pipeline).

Hope this info helps you.

I am retired ANG (8 years active duty enlisted, 4 years part-time reserves enlised, 11 years part-time (and some full-time deployed) ANG commissioned years (MX squadron commander, executive officer, OIC MX branch).
 
OBTW, I have to say this because you have 2 threads going (SMP and ANG).

I think your decision is more about attending the college program at the 2 schools in different states, than anything else. I respect that, don't get me wrong!

However, I also wonder if this is more like new car shopping...who is going to give me the best deal for me without thinking about the cost it will be owning it for 8, 9, 10 yrs before you can bolt at the 1st opportunity.

Just saying, one branch may offer you the easier route, but will it make you happy? You say you are a planner, as such, place that into your equation.

Please don't read my post as antagonistic, or pro ADAF vs ANG, or pro AF vs Army it isn't.

Their lifestyles are completely different. I would go in debt for 10 yrs to a reasonable amount, before I signed on a dotted line for 4 yrs., especially if I would be 29 at commissioning.
 
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