Re-Applying After Being Separated

Hello Everyone,

It's been a while but I'm back and I'm here with a new question. Since I was separated back in 2013 from USNA, I have continued my education and graduated from college and am currently in graduate school. However, part of me still wants to go back to USNA and finish what I started. I have re-applied 3 times and been rejected all three times. Now I am reapplying for a fourth time and I am not sure if I should. I even wrote a letter to the Secretary of the Navy asking for him to intervene. He had the Superintendent look into it and since I wasn't in good standing morally, mentally, or physically, there is a low chance that I would be readmitted.

However, I have read in the new that the Navy is retaining people despite being out of body fat standards or giving them more time to get into standards. I have gotten myself into those standards and below actually. (Being on a strict budget and on your own does help you loose weight out of necessity)

Anyway, am I stupid for wanting to go back or for trying to for the 4th time? What should I say to the Board? Does anyone know of any other former Midshipmen who were re-instated after committing an Honor Offense?

AquaRain said:

Hello Everyone,

It's been a while but I'm back and I'm here with a new question. Since I was separated back in 2013 from USNA, I have continued my education and graduated from college and am currently in graduate school.

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Considering you have a bachelors degree, why not seek admission to OCS or another commissioning program? Given your age and degree, you won't be re-admitted to USNA. Remember, the goal is a commission. Good luck!

AquaRain, I recall your history of posts here, and you should take a moment to applaud yourself for moving on with your life and getting your degree. You have gotten up, dusted yourself off, presumably learned from your mistake and progressed as an adult. Very good stuff.

You have to ask yourself if you really want to serve in the Navy as an officer - or - you just can't believe it's over with USNA? The OCS route would be a fine alternative to explore, and is designed for your age and education. One of my USNA company officers had to leave another SA involuntarily. He went back to school for his degree, got his commission via OCS, and was one of my best company officers, because he knew how to counsel wayward midshipmen. His insight was invaluable.

I understand there is something in you that wants to go back, but IMHO, that relationship is over. Like a special girlfriend or boyfriend, there are those that are "the ones who got away."

The easing of physical standards has no bearing on your situation, as you were not separated for that reason, as I recall. It's the actions you chose at that time that led to separation.

I recommend making a deal with yourself. One more time, and that's it. Or, one letter to SECNAV, taking your last shot, and know there is no more to be done. You make a clean break. In cases like this, when asked to make an exception, the granting authority looks at regulations, the specifics of the case, past practice and determines the impact of the precedent an exception may set. The case has to be exceptional enough in every way to merit the exception. The SECNAV would most assuredly task it to USNA Supe for background, comment and recommendation. What do you think USNA will say? Unless there has been a gross miscarriage of justice, I suspect there will be no change.

Time to look forward, not back. Just from your history of returning to this, you seem to be a bit stuck. ALL of us have regrets about choices, decisions, unfinished "stuff" in our past.

Finally - and I am not asking you what your code is - if you were assigned a certain code on your USNA separation paperwork, it is not productive to pursue this.
https://www.navycs.com/military-re-codes.html

I am looking to apply to OCS and I am working on the process and have been for quite a while. My discharge code was RE-3K and getting a waiver to apply to OCS took 18 months. Trust me I have put in the time to OCS. I'm just afraid I won't be selected for it.

If that happens, what should I do? I don't mind enlisting at all and going to Officer route that way but not going for direct Officer again would bother me.

I made a deal with myself after the third try and that did not work out but it's hard to let go of something you wanted for so long. The decision has just cost me so much and I would do nearly anything to go back and fix it. Family, friends, my reputation. It was hard to loose it all and be alone. And while yes I did finish my degree and I am working towards a commission, it's not quite the same as graduating from USNA.

Having your family disown you, ex-friends pour drinks on you because they're officers and you're their waiter, yeah it sucks and destroys your ego to some degree and makes you question, nearly everything you have done and will do.

But alas, I have built myself up to be strong and better than I was at USNA. At least I think I have. I don't cheat, I don't lie, and I work hard to get my work done correctly and ask for help when need be.

I know as may times as I reapply, I won't be put back into the Brigade, but it's a matter of just letting go of the whole thing. I feel like I can't sometimes because for the people who meant the most to me, without the Academy, I mean nothing to them.

And I've made new friends and found a new and better family, but still, the ghost of regret is there. I guess that's what I'm trying to say and what I'm trying to do in re-applying but will it all be in vain?

Cross that bridge when you come to it.

You have been doing pretty well as captain of your own ship, having had to take the helm when a storm of your own making drove you off-course.

Trust in yourself and believe that it is ok to have a version of your life that does not involve USNA, or OCS, if that doesn't happen. It may not even include uniformed service. You have free will and the ability to direct your own thoughts and actions. If you can't stop thinking about something, to my mind, it's because you won't. Spend some time thinking about why it is hard to let go, and what are your open paths to a successful, productive, healthy, balanced life.

If you have a higher power you believe in, go there for help. Determining when chasing a dream crosses the line to unhealthy preoccupation is something only you can determine.

Aqua, your problem is not bilging out of USNA, it is giving a rat's ass what bad friends and miserable family think. You have evened the scales of life by dusting yourself off and getting on with life and becoming a success. You have got better friends and a new family, you say, and are ready to move into military leadership and are going through the best route open, OCS. What are you beating yourself up for? USNA is like a bad girlfriend in your past and you keep moping and moaning thinking you will never find such great sex again. I can assure you that life has far greater pleasures before you that you would never have gotten had you stayed at USNA.

At the risk of being the ancient mariner, let me give you a personal example only in my case it was being a Naval Aviator. That was the only reason I even went to the Academy and the only thing that kept me going after a "vigorous" Plebe year and numerous bouts with the academic department. Studies were very painful and I earned every lousy tenth of point of my miserable GPA but it was all worth it to get into an F-4. After 4 years of living in a government monastery, I looked at Pensacola as Party City, lived life high and late everyday and promptly bilged out of flying with no chance of a turnback. My life was over as far as I was concerned and I was sent to a destroyer. I cannot tell you how bitter and low I was realizing the blame all lay on only me. I can also say that now from a 45 year prospective that my life at that point changed for better in all the biggest things of man's life. I had a very exciting, short navy career as a riverine sailor in Vietnam seeing combat with only one other member of my company classmates, met the woman of my life and had 3 absolutely fabulous kids, became successful in business and now am enjoying being a drain on society as a retired gomer. I can honestly say NONE of that would have happened had my dreams of an ejection seat come true. I would not trade it for anything and neither will you. Keep running, Dude,------forward.

Spud said:

Aqua, your problem is not bilging out of USNA, it is giving a rat's *** what bad friends and miserable family think. You have evened the scales of life by dusting yourself off and getting on with life and becoming a success. You have got better friends and a new family, you say, and are ready to move into military leadership and are going through the best route open, OCS. What are you beating yourself up for? USNA is like a bad girlfriend in your past and you keep moping and moaning thinking you will never find such great sex again. I can assure you that life has far greater pleasures before you that you would never have gotten had you stayed at USNA.

At the risk of being the ancient mariner, let me give you a personal example only in my case it was being a Naval Aviator. That was the only reason I even went to the Academy and the only thing that kept me going after a "vigorous" Plebe year and numerous bouts with the academic department. Studies were very painful and I earned every lousy tenth of point of my miserable GPA but it was all worth it to get into an F-4. After 4 years of living in a government monastery, I looked at Pensacola as Party City, lived life high and late everyday and promptly bilged out of flying with no chance of a turnback. My life was over as far as I was concerned and I was sent to a destroyer. I cannot tell you how bitter and low I was realizing the blame all lay on only me. I can also say that now from a 45 year prospective that my life at that point changed for better in all the biggest things of man's life. I had a very exciting, short navy career as a riverine sailor in Vietnam seeing combat with only one other member of my company classmates, met the woman of my life and had 3 absolutely fabulous kids, became successful in business and now am enjoying being a drain on society as a retired gomer. I can honestly say NONE of that would have happened had my dreams of an ejection seat come true. I would not trade it for anything and neither will you. Keep running, Dude,------forward.

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I will sir. And being a Riverine is no small accomplishment.

Just looked at all previous posts by Aquarain--fascinating--and exactly why my kids call this my "crack forum". Aquarain, after briefing myself on your previous posts I join the chorus in saying MOVE FORWARD! Everyone has past experiences that make them squirm--it's called LIFE! Unlike those above, I say get on with a teaching position in a civilian environment.

Strongly agree with nodiva. I actually remember some of your previous posts, Aquarain. If I recall correctly, you were pretty vocal in your disgust and disdain for nearly everyone associated with the NA. Move Forward is great advice and perhaps you need some additional professional guidance to help you sort through these feelings. Best of luck.

I am moving on I promise. I'm not going to reapply to USNA. I am moving on in my life towards better things both in the military and out. Thanks for the support.

Aqua, the quote below from Ralph Waldo Emerson is my parting gift to you. I have carried it on a tattered scrap in my wallet for over 35 years. I have used it to counsel junior officers who didn't get promoted or who got helos not jets; best friends going through divorce; sponsor mids struggling with love life, dark days at USNA or family issues; family members working through the five stages of grief, which I suspect you are still doing, after you "lost" USNA. I read it at my Navy retirement ceremony. It may help.

"Be grateful for each new day. A new day that you have never lived before. Twenty-four new, fresh, unexplored hours to use usefully and profitably. We can squander, neglect or use it.

Finish every day and be done with it. You have done what you could; some blunders and absurdities crept in; forget them as soon as you can. Tomorrow is a new day. You shall begin it well and serenely and with too high a spirit to be encumbered with your old nonsense."

Thank you Capt MJ for your kind words. I sincerely appreciate them. I suppose you are right that I am still in grief regarding my separation from USNA. I thought I would have gotten over this by now but it's hard to sometimes.

It wasn't only my dream but my parents dream as well. Immediately after I was in denial but It wasn't until after I got home, I realized what I had done. I was angry at myself for nearly a year and I tried bargaining to try to get myself back in along with trying to get my life together as an independent adult with no support. Depression came with my final year of college because I saw a lot of my ex peers and what could have been. Now I think I'm in the phase of acceptance, where I accept that I have to go forward and that going back isn't realistic or healthy.

I know for a lot of you reading this, it's application season and you're getting letters of rejection, acceptance or for NAPS/Foundation School. If you're accepted or sent to NAPS/Foundation School, congratulations. You've accomplished something few people get to do in their lives which is serve their country.

For those of who you who aren't accepted, it's ok.
At first you may think it's not ok or someone will tell you it's not. The people who stop being your friend or even loving you, being a significant other or even family, should love your irregardless of the circumstances or where you go to college. If they don't, then they really aren't worth it.

It's ok to be sad. Trust me. After you invest, hours, days, years and tons of money into training for a being hopefully accepted into a service academy and not having it happen, you have the right to cry, punch things, or do both (And yes you can eat ice cream/cake/fill in the blank guilty pleasure)

But you can't do this forever.

You have to get up and keep going. Just because this didn't workout, does not mean you're a bad person or not worth being here.

YOU ARE WORTH BEING HERE.

Do things that make you happy. Make a list. I'm serious. MAKE A LIST. You're good at sports, art, cooking, taking care of people,ect. Don't let someone else standards lead to you hating yourself. You don't have to do that.

You don't need to do that.

If you want to reapply to USNA or another SA, do it. You may get in the next time or or you may not. After 3 tries, I say stop. Usually the third time is the charm but there are other ways to be commissioned. You can go to ROTC and be a normal college student. You get to have a life and be a freshman, sophomore junior, and senior. Not do chow calls, not wake up at the crack of dawn unless you want to, not have 'mandatory fun', it's a good thing and trust me once you hit the Fleet you and USNA grads are on the same level.

Same with OCS. Full college experience like a normal person then 10 weeks of pain and chaos but you're in the zone when you hit the Fleet and you've been trained by enlisted Sailors and Marines that you will be leading. LEADING! That's a big deal. You are training to lead them into situations that may or may not be deadly. If you're going to lead them well, wouldn't you want to be trained by them and held to a standard of excellence.

Any commissioning program is great, the Academy is not the end all be all.

If you really want to serve, you'll make it happen.

Even enlisting is a great way to give back. You will be there doing the HARD WORK and learning how things work on both sides of the military coin if you want to transition from Enlisted to Officer.

Ok in closing for anyone who's reading this who's in the same boat as me or may be soon due to Academic/PT/Honor/Conduct Boards or was in the past and like me is having a tough time letting go, I just want to say: I AM SORRY THIS HAPPENED TO YOU.

I know people who are reading this may wonder why I'm saying that but see above for why I'm saying this: time, effort, and money was put into a dream that didn't come true due to one or various circumstances. For many ex-Mids/ex-Cadets, what comes next is a huge "?" and it's scary.

Very scary.

But know this, one day, things will get better. One day they will.

In the present, figure out what you're good at and use your skills to help you start over. Make a plan, write a schedule, ensure that you have some sort of financial stability, and place to go.

Make sure you have those things so you can have a smooth start as a civilian if leaving the Academy is rocky.

From there, work. There's no easier way to put this but you have to work on everything. Starting with yourself. Work to find employment, get back into school, or enlist. Waivers for enlisting take a while so in the meantime, work or go to school.

Keep yourself busy. Get away from social media. Give yourself a chance to breathe, to cry, to eat too many doughnuts and cry again. It's ok but don't do this forever.

Find yourself. Your own identity separate from your parents and your SA.

I think this is the hardest part because it takes the most time. You need to carve out an identity that isn't "Midshipman" or "Cadet". You need to be "You".

It get's better I promise. Just take one day, one meal, one minute as it comes.

If anyone needs more help or advice, I'll be happy to PM.

Murlisik said:

Hi AquaRain,
I am a Mom of a Mid and I would like to ask you to PM me. My Mid is going thru some difficulties at USNA and I, of course, am at loss. I wanted to see what was the reason that you got separated.
Hope to hear from you.

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@AquaRain hasn’t been on here since 2016. You most likely won’t get a PM from them.

Additionally a new member has to have a certain amount of posts, and an amount of time pass, before PM privileges are granted.

Hang in there! Contribute for a while and see what you can garner. Lots of discussion already about struggling Mids, and how to support (use the search tool).

BTW, this was an interesting zombie thread!! Wonder how things turned out for OP

Got it, thank you for your reply!

Murlisk
You should be able to find support on the USNA parents and mom’s Facebook pages
Hang in there and Best of luck to your Mid!

shock-n-awe said:

Murlisk
You should be able to find support on the USNA parents and mom’s Facebook pages
Hang in there and Best of luck to your Mid!

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also message a mentor in your state parent group. They are a great support.

If you would rather stay anon, do your required posts here, and then you can PM. Pretty much everything has ‘been there, done that’ kind of stuff here on the forums. And there is tremendous help/advice/info/support.

Know that you, and your Mid, are not alone. Struggling is common. Reach out if you need support. Hang in there!

Murlisik said:

Got it, thank you for your reply!

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Murlisik said:

Got it, thank you for your reply!

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5 posts, registered user for a week, give some flex for the system/server to update, and you will be DM-capable.

Aqua Rain had a series of issues that may or may not apply to other mids. I hope he/she (maintaining anonymity) has found happiness and success.

Most of the "old timers" on this forum have lots of experience with issues mids go through, either as a former mid, parent of a mid, senior officer at USNA, etc. Being perfectly honest, these are probably better sources of advice and information than a mid who separated nearly a decade ago. We stay on these boards year after year in order to help folks like you. Do reach out.