Any improvements?

kinnem said:
I should probably stay away from this post, but...

frogwoman said:
I for one would love to know what goes into the admissions thought process. My DD unfortunately got that TWE email this morning and we are completely dumbfounded. She exceeded all of the criteria they were looking for from the SAT scores, GPA, athletics, medically qualified, was invited to STEM, got into NASS,
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I'm sure your daughter is a fine young woman, but this is a competition and it's possible for very fast runners to still lose any given race. NASS and STEM participation have nothing to do with appointments BTW, since you're looking for their reasoning.

has 3 generations of family members in the navy with a grandfather who was a Rear Admiral in the Navy and served with Nimitz in WWII and received Navy's distinguished metal of honor for helping control malaria, a grandfather who was a navy seal during the vietnam war and her father who served 9 years so our family has a long history, which the navy is huge on tradition.
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I'm glad to see she had such examples to inspire her, but these are their accomplishments, not hers. Do legacy's get some points? Probably. Does it guarantee them an appointment? No.

She wants to serve her country and do physics or engineering. Her BGO said she was his top candidate and would bet his car on her getting in,
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That's great and I'm sure she was HIS top candidate. But he doesn't sit on the admissions boards.

and yet she got that damn TWE this morning and is devastated. The damn generic TWE says to reapply next year after she makes improvements on her application............ Honestly, none of the above can get much higher than they already are. I shake my head. Makes no sense............. Yes, I understand there are many qualified candidates and congratulations to all. I read about the amazing candidates and I am in aw on what tremendous bunch of kids that are out there and super impressed.
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I certainly understand her disappointment and yours. Truly I do. Take some time to grieve and then, after the dust has settled, reconsider re-applying, or not if that's the path she chooses.

I wish you all nothing but the best.
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Thank you... You are right on all accounts which I cannot deny. It's just frustrating to see all the advertising for STEM and NASS and to be part of a team with a permanent career, so on and so on, and yet as we go through this process come to realize how few spots there really are for the "typical" applicant. I am just venting because I can't call up Admin and say "WTH"! Lol....
 
frogwoman said:
Old Navy BGO said:
SCubb said:
If you seasoned hands say “its really, really complicated and admissions really is doing the best they can”, then I’ll certainly believe it. But it’s hard to imagine there aren’t improvements to be made.
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1) IT IS a unique (except for other Service Academies) process. The Ivy's don't have to deal with Medical, CFA or nominations.
I've been involved for over 15 years, and I do think it is a pretty good system.

2) Every system has room for improvement, and I know that USNA Admissions continuously adjusts its process. However, keep in mind,
I wouldn't expect that instant gratification of candidates is a high priority.

3) Most of the problems are self created, the process itself is pretty simple -submit the best application you can, as promptly as possible (both USNA and Nominations), and let the system work. I see a lot of angst created by this Forum, as candidates and parents try to figure out exactly how the decision is made. Again, after 15+ years, I still haven't figured it out.

time2 said:
None of us actually work in SA admissions, so not sure of the value of soliciting opinions/suggestions from us about the process.
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The issue is that most of the people here don't know enough about the process or internal workings at USNA Admissions to make informed suggestions. Most of the people here focus on their own experience, and as I often say here, one data point doesn't make a trend. There are alot of forces at play in the Admissions process. That said, if there is truly a suggestion that can improve the process, fire away ...there are several BGO's onboard here, and we have a process for making suggestions to Admissions.
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I for one would love to know what goes into the admissions thought process. My DD unfortunately got that TWE email this morning and we are completely dumbfounded. She exceeded all of the criteria they were looking for from the SAT scores, GPA, athletics, medically qualified, was invited to STEM, got into NASS, has 3 generations of family members in the navy with a grandfather who was a Rear Admiral in the Navy and served with Nimitz in WWII and received Navy's distinguished metal of honor for helping control malaria, a grandfather who was a navy seal during the vietnam war and her father who served 9 years so our family has a long history, which the navy is huge on tradition. She wants to serve her country and do physics or engineering. Her BGO said she was his top candidate and would bet his car on her getting in, and yet she got that damn TWE this morning and is devastated. The damn generic TWE says to reapply next year after she makes improvements on her application............ Honestly, none of the above can get much higher than they already are. I shake my head. Makes no sense............. Yes, I understand there are many qualified candidates and congratulations to all. I read about the amazing candidates and I am in aw on what tremendous bunch of kids that are out there and super impressed.
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First, I’m sorry your DD and your family are dealing with this and completely understand. As I’ve posted before, we were in your exact position last year only in April. My DS settled down to evaluate his best plan B and then used the TWE as motivation to improve on what others said was an excellent package, making him in their eyes a top candidate. To say I am proud of his 9 months of total dedication, academically, physically and emotionally, would be an understatement. His first comment to me on Feb 6 after speaking with our MOC and being told of his appointment was “Not getting in last year was the best thing that ever happened to me.” I was awestruck at his maturity.
Good luck with plan B! Have DD follow up with Admissions counselor. Enjoy watching your DD grow from this experience, have a great freshman year at a “regular” school and look forward to Class of 2024!
 
frogwoman said:
Thank you... You are right on all accounts which I cannot deny. It's just frustrating to see all the advertising for STEM and NASS and to be part of a team with a permanent career, so on and so on, and yet as we go through this process come to realize how few spots there really are for the "typical" applicant. I am just venting because I can't call up Admin and say "WTH"! Lol....
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I figured you were and we all certainly need to at times like this. As AROTC-dad said in an earlier post plan B can sometimes be plan A+. I know I was heartbroken when my son, who I knew would make a fine Marine Officer did not receive an NROTC scholarship. Nevertheless he went to his #1 college, enrolled in NROTC without a scholarship, earned a scholarship during his college career, and is serving as a Marine officer today. This isn't to say that your daughter should follow the NROTC path, although that is an option. I simply mean it to say that if your daughter wants to commission as a naval officer, then today's TWE means only that it's not via USNA this year. Good luck to you.
 
When the heat of reaction passes, you're going to know that it's going to be alright. Any one with her skills, strength and achievement is going to forge the path they need. This is part of her journey. It's going to shape her as she goes where she is meant to be. In the moment, it sucks! You love her and want to shield such a good kid from a disappointment that makes no sense. Been there! I am praying for you both right now. It gets better. Mine was shocked at having to take an unexpected path -- and is grateful now.
 
I cannot even put into words how happy it makes me to see people that I got to ‘know’ last year, who received a TWE, getting their appointments this year as a re-applicant!! They are the best stories. And none of them said the year was a waste.

It hurts for a minute. Hugs. A TWE doesn’t mean NO, but rather ‘not yet’. If that’s what she chooses!!
 
Well stated Kinnem.

It's unfortunate that not every qualified candidate can get in, but its a competition and someone has to be the runner up. Sometimes I have so many great candidates its hard to distinguish --alm0st a photo finish. However, how you respond to adversity and defeat often defines you.

We all have room for improvement, and if an unsuccessful candidate really wants to attend USNA and they are truly competitive, I would encourage them to reapply. Take a breath, meet with the BGO and perhaps talk to Admissions, evaluate where improvements can be made, pursue Plan B with vigor, reapply and show Admissions they made the wrong choice this year.

A couple things to note:
> It's been demonstrated time and time again that being a legacy will not get you into USNA.
> BGO's should never make statements about competitiveness. We only see a handful of candidates, rarely the full slate for even a congressional district, let alone the state.
 
I'm sure one of the BGOs can give you a real answer but I'm sure it varies across the country and is at least a function of population density if nothing else.
 
ders_dad said:
Typically, how many schools are BGOs assigned to?
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Depends on the number of schools and number of BGO's. In my state , there are only a handful of BGO's, hundreds of schools, and large geographical areas Instead of spreading the BGO's too thin trying to maintain relationships with all the schools, the Area Coordinator assigns each BGO to a few schools (usually the larger schools in the State) located near the BGO, but also a specific BGO to candidates who attend other schools. It's really left to the AC to decide how to cover their state.
 
I have six schools assigned to me and pick up some other candidates from a variety of smaller nearby schools and the occasional homeschooler.
 
Flea said:
Looks like we will be waiting together, my DD will be applying for 2024 and I am not a patient person at all. :D I have learned so much from this forum and the advice is invaluable. I used to lurk every now and then but recently I have found myself checking several times/day hoping to read more good news from these amazing candidates who want it so badly. I can’t imagine what my life will be like next year when my own DD will be waiting. :eek:
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kinnem said:
@SCubb If it helps, they say it's harder on the parents than on the kids.
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@Flea , Now, after going thru this process along with my DS, I understood the meaning of what @kinnem is saying. While my son (or I rather say I ) was waiting to hear from the West Point, one day over the dinner my son end up telling me "dad.. you need to learn waiting". That day I learned something :hammer:
 
I’d vote “giving the BGOs a paid vacation anywhere they want to go”.

Not pandering here...

DS was alone last year when he got the TWE. After a bit he thought he was under control and he called the 1st person he wanted to know: his BGO. This lovely man came to the phone all excited as he thought DS had good news to share but was able to quickly shift gears and guide DS through a difficult moment, even respectfully allowing for DS’ sadness. He’s stayed in touch although DS has another BGO this year, encouraging positive morale.

If this is the role model DS has chosen, I’m good with Papa Navy and all that comes with it.

Maybe not putting this as eloquently as I ought, but I’m voting that the BGOs are the best part of the USNA admissions process.
 
5centsmom said:
I’d vote “giving the BGOs a paid vacation anywhere they want to go”.

Not pandering here...

DS was alone last year when he got the TWE. After a bit he thought he was under control and he called the 1st person he wanted to know: his BGO. This lovely man came to the phone all excited as he thought DS had good news to share but was able to quickly shift gears and guide DS through a difficult moment, even respectfully allowing for DS’ sadness. He’s stayed in touch although DS has another BGO this year, encouraging positive morale.

If this is the role model DS has chosen, I’m good with Papa Navy and all that comes with it.

Maybe not putting this as eloquently as I ought, but I’m voting that the BGOs are the best part of the USNA admissions process.
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:thumb:
 
frogwoman said:
Old Navy BGO said:
SCubb said:
If you seasoned hands say “its really, really complicated and admissions really is doing the best they can”, then I’ll certainly believe it. But it’s hard to imagine there aren’t improvements to be made.
Click to expand...

1) IT IS a unique (except for other Service Academies) process. The Ivy's don't have to deal with Medical, CFA or nominations.
I've been involved for over 15 years, and I do think it is a pretty good system.

2) Every system has room for improvement, and I know that USNA Admissions continuously adjusts its process. However, keep in mind,
I wouldn't expect that instant gratification of candidates is a high priority.

3) Most of the problems are self created, the process itself is pretty simple -submit the best application you can, as promptly as possible (both USNA and Nominations), and let the system work. I see a lot of angst created by this Forum, as candidates and parents try to figure out exactly how the decision is made. Again, after 15+ years, I still haven't figured it out.

time2 said:
None of us actually work in SA admissions, so not sure of the value of soliciting opinions/suggestions from us about the process.
Click to expand...

The issue is that most of the people here don't know enough about the process or internal workings at USNA Admissions to make informed suggestions. Most of the people here focus on their own experience, and as I often say here, one data point doesn't make a trend. There are alot of forces at play in the Admissions process. That said, if there is truly a suggestion that can improve the process, fire away ...there are several BGO's onboard here, and we have a process for making suggestions to Admissions.
Click to expand...


I for one would love to know what goes into the admissions thought process. My DD unfortunately got that TWE email this morning and we are completely dumbfounded. She exceeded all of the criteria they were looking for from the SAT scores, GPA, athletics, medically qualified, was invited to STEM, got into NASS, has 3 generations of family members in the navy with a grandfather who was a Rear Admiral in the Navy and served with Nimitz in WWII and received Navy's distinguished metal of honor for helping control malaria, a grandfather who was a navy seal during the vietnam war and her father who served 9 years so our family has a long history, which the navy is huge on tradition. She wants to serve her country and do physics or engineering. Her BGO said she was his top candidate and would bet his car on her getting in, and yet she got that damn TWE this morning and is devastated. The damn generic TWE says to reapply next year after she makes improvements on her application............ Honestly, none of the above can get much higher than they already are. I shake my head. Makes no sense............. Yes, I understand there are many qualified candidates and congratulations to all. I read about the amazing candidates and I am in aw on what tremendous bunch of kids that are out there and super impressed.
Click to expand...

@frogwoman that makes no sense at all. the only thing she can improve in 1 year is her age
 
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