President Trump's national security adviser resigns.

Or even when his term expires which is far far more likely. No one has been tossed out yet and unless there is something truly egregious I doubt anyone will.
 
EDelahanty said:
Pence will not lie for Trump. He knows he needs to maintain credibility in the event Trump is constitutionally removed from office.
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I think the GOP should start thinking along those lines, at least privately for now. Pence will appear as a national savior, even to the political left, the longer this nightmare continues. The base of the political right will be upset, at least initially, but they'll get over it with time. Individuals come-and-go, but institutions (including the US) should outlast them.
 
Day-Tripper said:
I think the GOP should start thinking along those lines, at least privately for now. Pence will appear as a national savior, even to the political left, the longer this nightmare continues. The base of the political right will be upset, at least initially, but they'll get over it with time. Individuals come-and-go, but institutions (including the US) should outlast them.
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I absolutely agree, Day-Tripper. I have very few points of policy agreement with Mike Pence. But I think he's a stable, rational man who believes in American institutions and doesn't want to destroy them. Right now, comparatively, that's enough.
 
NTWLF ONE said:
....and Flynn was a self proclaimed "registered Democrat"....could you imagine the outrage if he was a Republican....:)
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And there in lies the problem...a Republican hiring and trusting a Democrat.
So much for working with the other party.

Sorry, just couldn't let that one get by.

Now, I need to go get my popcorn...:popcorn1:
 
Well Flynn supported President Trump from the start so I don't think he shouldn't have hired him because he was a Democrat.
By the way Flynn wasn't the one that told the president to express his intentions of working with Russia.
 
NTWLF ONE said:
....and Flynn was a self proclaimed "registered Democrat"....could you imagine the outrage if he was a Republican....:)
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Nobody cares whether or not General (retd) Michael Flynn was a registered democrat, republican or independent. He was the nominated-National Security Adviser whom conspired with the government of Russia against the sitting American government, then lied about it. This is beyond dispute.

His ties to Russia seem to be stronger than his ties to the United States. Instead of being concerned with US national security he was tweeting about phony Hillary-related pizza-shop child molesters or something. He is a disgrace to the US Army an the USA. His departure from the US government is nothing but good news. He will spend the remainder of life in shame. Deservedly so.

Imagine, say, the reaction of Republican Party if it was proven that the Obama campaign of 2008 was actively engaging with Iran or North Korea or China or....Russia? Telling foreign agents of hostile powers to ignore George W Bush, maybe asking for intelligence that could be used against John McCain in the election, promising reversing sanctions or some other kind of reward. Imagine.

Just imagine the OUTRAGE that Fox News-Talk Radio-Drudge Report industrial complex?

It would have been warranted.

As it should be now.

American patriotism is dead. Killed. Just another phony "wedge" issue.

It's over. Turn out the lights.
 
Day-Tripper those were some very powerful words, seems this issue vexed you a lot. Do not worry you are not a lone, I actually had so much respect for him for his service and accomplishments and he was a role model to me and many others, but now he betrayed the American people. Although I don't believe he did it intentionally, and was probably drinking some wine and some Russian diplomat brought it up and he went along promising them he will work to make sure those sanctions will be removed.
 
Day-Tripper said:
Nobody cares whether or not General (retd) Michael Flynn was a registered democrat, republican or independent. He was the nominated-National Security Adviser whom conspired with the government of Russia against the sitting American government, then lied about it. This is beyond dispute.
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Can you point me to the Warren Commission report on the events so that I can be as convinced as you are that it is "beyond dispute?"
 
Sledge said:
Can you point me to the Warren Commission report on the events so that I can be as convinced as you are that it is "beyond dispute?"
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Flynn had phone conversations with the Russian ambassador before he actually took office. Not in dispute.
Flynn repeatedly stated he did not discuss sanctions against Russia, until it was revealed he did (which was illegal). He then "walked back" his previous assertions. Not in dispute.
Flynn apologized to VP Pence for misleading him. Not in dispute.
Flynn was asked to resign by the POTUS, per the Sean Spicer & Paul Ryan & others. Not in dispute.
Flynn was said to have lost the trust of the POTUS, per Sean Spicer. Not in dispute.

There has been no "Warren Commission" - yet.

When history is written General Michael Flynn will regarded as a heroic figure. Russian history, that is.
 
America is now basically a European nation.

Once great, powerful & respected (if not always loved). Not any longer. Materially rich, to be sure, with high standards of living. But not much else. An empty, hollow nation. Passionless. Like religion has become.

Love of country, patriotism, now is passe, something to be sneered at. A cynical joke. Something to be used only to in politics. (Did I serve in the military, pols will be asked. No, but look at my awesome US flag pin! Lee Greenwood loves me!)

A country permanently divided, never to be united for any future cause or issue or event. Never again.

Ethics, civics, honesty - might as well remove those words from the dictionary. They're for "losers" who can't "counter punch".

Future 4th of July celebrations? Memorial Day observances? Excuses to get drunk. Nothing more.
 
What is most distressing about the month-old Trump presidency, it's abhorrence of the free press & the truth & it's murky alliance (or subservience) with the Kremlin is that 40-50% of Americans think it's just fine.

I wonder how long it'll be before the Democrats get wise & start reaching out to China for a similar arrangement, which their supporters will probably be fine with. Why not? Who cares?

We crossed the Rubicon.

2016-2017 will be regarded as a pivotal point when some future Edward Gibbon chronicles the demise of the US.
 
I've been reading along with this and finally have to add about 1 1/2 cents worth.

It is being reported, we are reading how the American people are in dismay, how the country and gov't is in turmoil, how people are now so discouraged they don't know what to do........blah blah blah.

You remember the great silent majority that voted for President Trump and won the election for him, the ones they forgot to poll, the ones that just went about their daily business and voted for who they wanted in to be in Washington. I think the press and others are forgetting/ignoring that they exist again. Don't ask or report on middle/rural America and what they think.

You remember the blithering idiots that said they would leave the country they love if Trump was elected. They're still here, still complaining and running their mouths. Still getting press time.

People act as if no other president as appointed anyone to their cabinet that has turned out to be a bad choice.

Remember how people were yelling that you can't replace Obamacare immediately, you have to take some time. Now those same people are yelling, we need to know what your going to do.....

Jeeze, in this world of instant gratification and peoples overwhelming feelings of self importance, I don't know how some people keep from just walking off a cliff.
 
Day-Tripper said:
America is now basically a European nation.

Once great, powerful & respected (if not always loved). Not any longer. Materially rich, to be sure, with high standards of living. But not much else. An empty, hollow nation. Passionless. Like religion has become.

Love of country, patriotism, now is passe, something to be sneered at. A cynical joke. Something to be used only to in politics. (Did I serve in the military, pols will be asked. No, but look at my awesome US flag pin! Lee Greenwood loves me!)

A country permanently divided, never to be united for any future cause or issue or event. Never again.

Ethics, civics, honesty - might as well remove those words from the dictionary. They're for "losers" who can't "counter punch".

Future 4th of July celebrations? Memorial Day observances? Excuses to get drunk. Nothing more.
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Somewhat overdramatic!

I truly hope you do not have a DD or DS as a cadet. My DH, cadet DD, and I still have full faith in this country and its people. And, yes, we and our families have all served (DD is now serving), for several generations.

It amazes me how someone can give up on the greatest country in the world after only 3 weeks, when we have survived 8 years of attempted socialism, and 240 years as a FREE nation.

But, to each his/her own...
Go drink yourself silly, or maybe sane.

I'm done. This is not the forum for this.
 
Day-Tripper said:
American patriotism is dead
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I'm getting ready to send my Korean vet dad on an honor flight to DC to visits all the war memorials and Arlington. I would imagine that plane load of vets could let you know in short order how dead American patriotism is.

They may not necessarily like the politics, but they love the country.

my 1 1/2 cents worth and I'm done.
 
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