Wedding Pickle

Navy Lion

5-Year Member
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Jun 3, 2018
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My DS is USNA incoming class of 2022. His sister is getting married on September 22, 2018. Any advise regarding him requesting liberty for the wedding night? We are a 4 hour 15 minute drive from Annapolis so he only needs about 24 hours of liberty. Does he have a shot at making the wedding?
 
Possibly. Once he gets to the academic year he will need to submit a special request chit. His chain of command will help.
 
He should also quickly develop a reputation as a good plebe, looking sharp, room squared away, doing well on pro knowledge quizzes, no apparent academic trouble, no conduct or military performance trouble. Yes, I know, that’s not likely for your DS, but someone gets C’s and D’s there, and gets into trouble.

His chain of command will look at USNA regs, the current policy for exceptions, his “good mid” reputation, and what precedent it sets for other non-emergency requests. He will submit what is called a special request chit; he will learn all about this.

He’s not missing class (always a big factor), since it’s a Saturday wedding, so perhaps an early early Sat pick-up and Sun return might fly. He’d be in uniform, not civvies.

Also be prepared that even if he submits it right away after ac year starts and his ac year chain of command is in place, they may sit on it til they figure out what kind of plebe he is.
 
The one challenge is that this is the WE right before the first set of exams. Not sure if they will grant plebes overnight liberty that WE. If it's an afternoon wedding, perhaps he can make the ceremony and skip the reception. In the end, all he can do is ask.
 
The thing that informs all decisions at USNA is not only the all-encompassing “needs of he Navy,” but the mission of USNA. Mids’ duty is to attend class and do all other required things that contribute to USNA producing an officer ready to serve in the Fleet or Corps in 4 years.
 
The thing that informs all decisions at USNA is not only the all-encompassing “needs of he Navy,” but the mission of USNA. Mids’ duty is to attend class and do all other required things that contribute to USNA producing an officer ready to serve in the Fleet or Corps in 4 years.
Can you expand on this? I'm not sure I understand where missing one weekend day fits into this comment.
 
The thing that informs all decisions at USNA is not only the all-encompassing “needs of he Navy,” but the mission of USNA. Mids’ duty is to attend class and do all other required things that contribute to USNA producing an officer ready to serve in the Fleet or Corps in 4 years.
Can you expand on this? I'm not sure I understand where missing one weekend day fits into this comment.
Simple. His mission is to be at class or studying. They may or may not allow him to attend.
 
More than likely USNA does what they can to help these kinds of situations, but there are no guarantees. Him doing well academically and with his professional knowledge will help. He needs to ask his 3/C to help with the chit once the academic year starts. They will assist with getting it done right and routed. I hate to say it, but it’s the military. This would be considered a privilege early on Plebe Year. A special case like this, they try to accommodate as best they can, but it is not guaranteed.
 
Saturday mornings may have training for the plebes, or a platoon run, or some other required evolution that the plebes are responsible for (I’ll say the word “boards” but won’t expand) that builds class esprit d’corps and teaches teamwork, discipline and time management. Plebes rate the least number of privileges, and earn more each year or as they achieve certain other things; among those privileges is liberty. The immersion model of military training mimics the 24/7 workstyle of operational Fleet or Corps environments. Hence, they stand watch in the Hall, an introduction to the concept of standing watch on a ship, sub or other duty location. It’s all about learning and suffering as a group, learning to rely on each other and getting things accomplished as a team. Military people miss a lot, I repeat, a lot of family events, due to operational needs. Most of the time, there is an effort to honor family commitments. It’s a challenge at USNA, because if you let 1 Plebe go, that sets a precedent for all other plebes requesting non-emergency weekend chits.

At least it’s not a football weekend, which is a mandatory evolution for mids not otherwise excused.

Plebes will be in AD status in the military as of I-Day. The training to military norms comes in many forms. Your DS will be so unimaginably busy by then with looming academics, Plebe duties, watch-standing, trying to get his PT in, 101 minor mandatory things, that the weekends just blur by. He won’t be lounging around a college campus.

I have to tell a small sea story from my BattO time at USNA. The Commandant constantly coached us that the 6 Battalions should be enforcing MidRegs roughly the same way, ditto exceptions, as we were “1 ship, not 6.” Easter was coming up, and it’s not a Federal holiday. Liberty expired at the normal time at that time at 6 pm on Sunday. I had said no to several chits asking for a later return, as it was a school night, and was not exceptional enough to say yes. Five of the six of us sailed in formation on that. I called around to a few of the others to ensure I was in sync. But - one BattO said “yes” to a chit saying the mid’s family tradition on Easter was an evening dinner, and he wanted to return at 11 pm. Astonishingly, chits started flooding in to all of us, with the tradition of an evening family dinner being the reason - pretty darn pervasive traditions. Mids are no dummies - they exploited the crack in the leadership cohesiveness. That BattO had to stand tall in front of the Dant. The Dant gave everyone 1.5 extra hours and used it as a leadership training moment, which he talked about at a Brigade all hands call. Any of us who served know you have to “keep ‘em equally happy, or equally unhappy.” The point of this is precedent. Out of 4200-ish mids, how many are likely to have siblings marrying over a 4-year period?

I don’t know which way this will go. He can only try.
 
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Agree with the previous responses. Don't plan on him being able to attend. The wedding is so early in his time as a Plebe he may not be allowed to go. All he can do is put himself in the best position for a positive outcome by performing well and being generally squared away. Hopefully it will work out.

A suggestion for you is he isn't able to make the wedding: Our DD missed a close family members wedding in October of her Plebe year. During the wedding we used facetime and passed the phone around to people. Not the same as being there, but it was the best we could do and it worked out well.
 
Needs of the Navy trump all personal desires...I missed MY first wedding date because of Desert Storm...so did half of the groomsmen...
 
I think the challenge will be that it's an overnight before the first set of grades are out and the first week of exams. Thus, his chain of command doesn't know how he's doing academically (b/c he hasn't taken any exams) and it's the WE that plebes really need to study for those exams. That said, as others have pointed out, USNA does try to honor important family events.

I would think creatively how you can minimize your DS's time away from USNA. Could he stay just for the wedding (not the reception) and get back late that night (using Uber, etc.) If he really can't get back Saturday night, can he get up at 0500 the next morning such that he's back at USNA before 10 am? He will want to demonstrate that he's prioritizing USNA and academics to have the best chance of getting this approved.

If you're not in the military, this whole discussion probably seems crazy -- and this wouldn't be an issue at almost any other (non-SA) school in the country. But USNA is the military and this is how things work. Military members inevitably end up missing lots of important family events . . . it's unfortunate, no one likes it, but it comes with the territory. Difficult as it may be, I wouldn't stress over it b/t now and then b/c neither you nor your DS has much control over the situation.
 
That chit needs to be in minute one of the academic year. Our 20 with a very good record needed a thurs and fri night this year for sister’s wedding. His company officer noted in her recommendation for approval that he should be commended for early action. It still took weeks. Cost me more because I couldn’t book a flight til approval. During the process, he had to bring proof that he had no exams that day and that he was not needed for parade.

He was denied chit last fall for a big wedding party because of home football game.

Our 17 needed Friday off Plebe or youngster year to fly to Pensacola for grandparents’ 50th wedding anniversary. All professors gave permission. As he was leaving, company officer asked him where he was going. Said he hadn’t given permission. Couldn’t come. Would have been able to the next morning, but party was Friday night (I had told my wife earlier that Friday would make him getting there dicey.)

That early in Plebe year — sorry, but don’t get your hopes up. Treat it as an unexpected gift if it happens. Many at USNA don’t want plebes to experience anything about normal life until thanksgiving.
 
+1 to @usna1985 for noting 1) this discussion sounds crazy to non-military people 2) the recommendation for a precise plan that minimizes time away and demos understanding of the USNA priority and 3) there is nothing thing you can do about it now.
The timing is just about the worst. As an upperclass, he’d have a weekend he could take, or later in the plebe year, when things are a tad more relaxed and he’d established he was in no academic jeopardy, would mitigate in his favor.

On a slightly lighter note, one of our USNA alumni sponsor daughters was not granted leave to be in her sister’s wedding (sister is also AD) due to operational situation. This is a creative and flexible family. They had a “Flat Daddy” made up, the life-sized photo cut out, which appeared at the church, the reception, the dance floor, in photos, everywhere. They did get in some FaceTime.
https://thefuntimesguide.com/free_flat_daddies/amp/
 
It is the military and some of the rules and regulations are strange to those not familiar. I was called to the Commander's office one day during instructor school. He informed me that my Grandfather had died but the Red Cross had decided I was not allowed emergency leave since he was not a member of my immediate family. After I told him what he could do with the Red Cross I told him I had thirty days leave coming. OK not a problem but I still hate the Red Cross. Most embarrassing moment, walking to the NCO club at NKP and this guy is walking toward me with all this fruit salad. I saluted and it was some guy in a Red Cross uniform with something on his epaulets. USO is a lot better and they do a great job at BWI.
 
It is the military and some of the rules and regulations are strange to those not familiar. I was called to the Commander's office one day during instructor school. He informed me that my Grandfather had died but the Red Cross had decided I was not allowed emergency leave since he was not a member of my immediate family. After I told him what he could do with the Red Cross I told him I had thirty days leave coming. OK not a problem but I still hate the Red Cross. Most embarrassing moment, walking to the NCO club at NKP and this guy is walking toward me with all this fruit salad. I saluted and it was some guy in a Red Cross uniform with something on his epaulets. USO is a lot better and they do a great job at BWI.

That was not handled well, yowee. It’s the Service policy to define who is immediate NOK (grandparents or others only if they raised the service member in loco parentis), and make the service member eligible for emergency leave status and official priority on govt travel, as well as rate the govt paying airfare from OCONUS to the nearest CONUS airport. The Red Cross is just the messenger verifying details of the situation, so the commander can make the leave approval/disapproval decision according to current policy. See
http://www.redcross.org/news/article/Red-Cross-Helps-Members-of-US-Military-During-Crises

I fault your commander for not making clear how emergency leave works and the Red Cross’ role, and not taking responsibility for the decision himself, and most reprehensibly, not working with your CofC to figure out how to get it done, operational situation permitting. There has never been a shortage of bad leadership.
 
That was not handled well, yowee. It’s the Service policy to define who is immediate NOK (grandparents or others only if they raised the service member in loco parentis), and make the service member eligible for emergency leave status and official priority on govt travel, as well as rate the govt paying airfare from OCONUS to the nearest CONUS airport. The Red Cross is just the messenger verifying details of the situation, so the commander can make the leave approval/disapproval decision according to current policy. See
http://www.redcross.org/news/article/Red-Cross-Helps-Members-of-US-Military-During-Crises

I fault your commander for not making clear how emergency leave works and the Red Cross’ role, and not taking responsibility for the decision himself, and most reprehensibly, not working with your CofC to figure out how to get it done, operational situation permitting. There has never been a shortage of bad leadership.

Apologies for jumping to off-topic. Those new to the military need to know about this important mission of the Red Cross, that they can get critical news to deployed family members via official channels.
 
Just a little view of how active duty military sometimes ( well really often ) works. Out of twenty plus years I was home at Christmas twice. The tree stayed up at times through April / May. Also during a two year period I missed 4 ( yes Four ) funerals of immediate family members. Granted, two of them were due the fact that the time to get home was too long to be able to attend. The other two were because of operational requirements. Added to that were two High School graduations and one birth. Again, all immediate family members ie. mother, father, sister, brother, wife or children.

This may sound harsh or cold but often this is the reality and the life we chose.

Sort of gives new meaning to service to something bigger than self.
 
Still think other than local Red Cross they suck. USO never charged us for stamps but Red Cross did.
 
Just a little view of how active duty military sometimes ( well really often ) works. Out of twenty plus years I was home at Christmas twice. The tree stayed up at times through April / May. Also during a two year period I missed 4 ( yes Four ) funerals of immediate family members. Granted, two of them were due the fact that the time to get home was too long to be able to attend. The other two were because of operational requirements. Added to that were two High School graduations and one birth. Again, all immediate family members ie. mother, father, sister, brother, wife or children.

This may sound harsh or cold but often this is the reality and the life we chose.

Sort of gives new meaning to service to something bigger than self.

We could populate an entire forum with posts on births, deaths, anniversaries, birthdays, weddings, holidays, family events missed due to “needs of the (Service).” I don’t think non-military or people without military in their family realize the magnitude of that element; it’s not just the “going in harm’s way” stuff.
 
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