Reasons people leave USMMA?

A

AMDG

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Apr 13, 2019
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My son just accepted his appointment yesterday and is excited to begin this journey!

From what I have seen, about 1/3 of those entering KP do not graduate. I have searched the forum and could not find my question about this.

Are there statistics about how many drop out for the different reasons I have seen? The reasons I have seen for those leaving USMMA are:

  1. Don't want to be there, maritime industry not for them etc.
  2. Behavioral problems, be it serious rule violations, criminal offenses and/or honor violations
  3. unable to keep up with Academics
So #1 is their own choice and the last two are not their choice...

Curious as to what percentages are each of these and what years they happen (of the four years they could be at KP, I am guessing that many if not all leave the first year)

My son is not even curious about this - just me!!

Thank you!
 
AMDG said:
My son just accepted his appointment yesterday and is excited to begin this journey!

From what I have seen, about 1/3 of those entering KP do not graduate. I have searched the forum and could not find my question about this.

Are there statistics about how many drop out for the different reasons I have seen? The reasons I have seen for those leaving USMMA are:

  1. Don't want to be there, maritime industry not for them etc.
  2. Behavioral problems, be it serious rule violations, criminal offenses and/or honor violations
  3. unable to keep up with Academics
So #1 is their own choice and the last two are not their choice...

Curious as to what percentages are each of these and what years they happen (of the four years they could be at KP, I am guessing that many if not all leave the first year)

My son is not even curious about this - just me!!

Thank you!
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When you look at the number of people who either quit, get kicked out, or setback a year it is more than 1/3. The number is higher because there are people from the previous years class and in some cases the year before that in the current year's class. I think 2019 has 200 seniors, of which 15-20 are set backs. So, 180/260 is the real number after four years are up.
 
I have never seen any statistics on why plebes/mids leave USMMA. Many leave during plebe year, but the attrition continues all the way through to first class year. Additional reasons for leaving that you did not mention include (1) failing to meet physical standards (weight issues and physical fitness issues). Remediation is allowed, but repeated failures to meet these standards can result in disenrollment. (2) failing sea year projects. A fair number of Midshipmen do fine academically while at Kings Point but find the distractions of sea year too great and fail to complete the required academic work while at sea. Or they fail the written/oral exams when they return from sea.
Lots of places to stumble on the path to licensing and graduation. No, there is no time until they graduate that they (or you as a parent) can relax and say they are home free.
 
Anyone know about how many people end up failing Calc? Worried because I’ve only taken pre calc
 
travelor said:
Anyone know about how many people end up failing Calc? Worried because I’ve only taken pre calc
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Calc is failed by those who don't spend enough time studying and/or do not seek help when they need it. It is not uncommon to fail calc if you fall into one or both of those categories. If you have been admitted, you have the ability to be successful academically at Kings Point. My DD had not even taken pre-calculus prior to coming to Kings Point (due to scheduling conflicts at her high school) and she got a B in calc. She went to her professor's office hours regularly and managed her time well. Don't worry. Just study hard and get help early and often.
 
kpmom2013 said:
travelor said:
Anyone know about how many people end up failing Calc? Worried because I’ve only taken pre calc
Click to expand...
Calc is failed by those who don't spend enough time studying and/or do not seek help when they need it. It is not uncommon to fail calc if you fall into one or both of those categories. If you have been admitted, you have the ability to be successful academically at Kings Point. My DD had not even taken pre-calculus prior to coming to Kings Point (due to scheduling conflicts at her high school) and she got a B in calc. She went to her professor's office hours regularly and managed her time well. Don't worry. Just study hard and get help early and often.
Click to expand...

I took no Calc before KP and flew through the first four quarters with relative ease. . . is was that last one, intro to Differential Equations that was a challenge. . . but I passed. As to the OP, there are many reasons and have been addressed here. For some, like myself, it was quite a shot to the system, but I got it figured out, coming close to bailing during Indoc. . .others may look at the shot at a "free" education, but the maritime industry requires more from people that work in it that most, I feel and some are not up to that. I know that my kids, my daughter in particular, while certainly a high achiever, has no interest. I think that the current state of the US flag maritime industry may also be a factor. When I went through KP, there were many US flag shipping companies and ships. . .now, not so many. . .
 
Expectations and Priorities.

Expect that you will not have the "typical" college experience. Expect that you will spend significantly more hours both in the classroom and doing homework than your high school friends experiencing the "typical" college. Expect that your grades may in fact be lower on average than your friends at a "typical" college. Expect that you will constraints on your time that are not of your choosing and that your friends at a "typical" college do not have.

Continually rethink and re-evaluate your priorities with the above expectations in mind. Two questions you should be asking yourself every single day. What am I doing that I shouldn't be and what am I not doing that I should be (taken from LTG Hal Moore in the movie "We were soldiers ...")
 
I think you can expect a 1-1.5% drop during indoc. That is what the numbers appear to have been for the last several years, and, those numbers are consistent with the drop rates during the other Academies' summer indoc/beast/etc. Then, at the end of the first try, expect about a 10% drop. There should be a lesser drop at the end of the second tri, maybe 7%. The drop rate at the end of tri 3 should be less. And, then, as indicated, drops continue for a variety of reasons. The Academy does not drop to drop though. It appears that the school wants to keep the students, which makes sense because of the investment they make in each student, and tries to keep them, allows courses to be retaken, allows set backs, etc.
 
cmakin said:
I think that the current state of the US flag maritime industry may also be a factor. When I went through KP, there were many US flag shipping companies and ships. . .now, not so many. . .
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That's an understatement.. Also along with the declining numbers of deep sea U.S. flag ships, there have been radical changes to the industry that you and I entered in the mid 1970s and early 1980s.. Reduced crews, faster and bigger ships, less port time, more regulation which, in turn, has spawned MORE paperwork, are just a few of those changes.. It used to be, going to sea was kinda fun.. These days, not as much.

travelor said:
Anyone know about how many people end up failing Calc? Worried because I’ve only taken pre calc
Click to expand...
I know of at least one.. My older son failed it.. But on a positive note, he ended up graduating without being set back :thumb: YMMV..
 
Reasons for leaving KP?

1) Injuries
2) Doing stupid things and .... getting caught.
3) Fraternization
4) Not studying and not asking for help.
5) Loneliness and missing one's girl/boyfriend. This happened.
6) Not passing security clearance.
7) Failing drug test and using cocaine while at KP.
8) Getting to senior year and not being able to pass the Navy PT test or physical.
 
At the acceptance day the other day, a parent asked this question. The first answer was "girlfriends!" They also said kids whose "parents wanted them to come here" (and the teen didn't) and lack of use of cell phones was another. Time management was stressed.
 
deepdraft1 said:
cmakin said:
I think that the current state of the US flag maritime industry may also be a factor. When I went through KP, there were many US flag shipping companies and ships. . .now, not so many. . .
Click to expand...
That's an understatement.. Also along with the declining numbers of deep sea U.S. flag ships, there have been radical changes to the industry that you and I entered in the mid 1970s and early 1980s.. Reduced crews, faster and bigger ships, less port time, more regulation which, in turn, has spawned MORE paperwork, are just a few of those changes.. It used to be, going to sea was kinda fun.. These days, not as much.
Click to expand...

No argument there. It was changing much when I came ashore, and then the 10 years I was at ABS, I saw it change so much more. . . and now even more so. . ..
 
The class of 2021 A split lost 9 Midshipmen to disenrollments/setbacks after first sailing.
 
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