Disenrollment or PRB

My son is a MIDN and finishing up his sophomore year at a private institution.

He has failed Calculus 2xs and has to attend summer school (12K) and has requested a waiver.

He was already informed that due to this he will be going to a PRB and a request for LOA.

The dilemma I have is - if he passes Calculus I in the Summer, I am not sure he will pass Calculus II the first go round. I am not willing to take out a 25k loan for a semester and he is not guaranteed to pass. I know he can not transfer schools and attend a public school since he won't be in good standing. I am not even sure he will meet G.P.A this semester with a D in a 4unit class.

My son has never had any issues in High School and won a 4yr National Scholarship but college Calculus (with tutors/study hall). I am not confident.

He is on good standing with everything else however, I told him that he needs to tell his CO that if they put him on LOA that he can not pay for it. They only allow Undergrads to take out so many loans and then look at the parents. I just don't see him paying to go to that private school and they may disenroll him anyway.

Should I just advise him to DOR and see if enlistment is an option? He wants to serve - he would prefer being an Officer. He does not want to quit but they will end up quitting him due to him not meeting the requirements.

He said that they will do PRB end of Summer and give him his decision beginning of Fall semester but that is a set up to me to force him to incur those loans if they place him on LOA.

Well, it's his choice. If he chooses to roll the dice on this fall semester, then that is his decision-- enlistment will be an option then, like it is now.

ROTC is not the only route to a commission, and the Navy pays 100% tuition for enlisted members.

Good luck to your son.

There are some tough decisions your son will need to make. As you mentioned if he transfers he would not be able to join NROTC until he can be back on good standing. That may be worth it to him to look into since he could transfer to a school with a lower tuition rate if he decides not to continue ROTC. If he transfers he would most likely not be able to get another scholarship.

One thing he needs to find out is what obligation he will have back to the Navy since he would be dropping the program after the one year grace period, usually the Navy will want to be reimbursed for the tuition they have already paid. I know that there is an enlistment option but it's up to the Navy whether he is given that option. Most of the people that have had similar situations that have posted on this board have been made to reimburse the Navy. If he is in fact required to payback the scholarship to date then he could take the risk of passing the course this summer and then gambling he could pass the second course next fall. Paying for one semester may be cheaper then having to pay back the entire scholarship for the first two years. This is of course an option only if the Navy approves his LOA.

As mentioned above, if he is able to enlist he can go to college while enlisted but there are requirements that go along with that. The catch for TA is that they will pay up to 100%, the catch is that there is a Not to Exceed amount, the amount given often does not cover the entire tuition cost depending on which school they go through. Getting a BA degree while enlisted will take longer then it would if he stayed in school now.

You can be reimbursed up to 100 percent of the cost of the course, not to exceed:

• $250.00 per semester hour
• $166.67 per quarter hour
• $4,500 per fiscal year

You must pay any back any TA you receive for:

• undergraduate classes you get a D or lower in
• graduate classes you get a C or lower in
• any classes you get any non-passing or incomplete grade in

Your son will go through an application process for TA and will need final command approval, here are just a few of the requirements.

Requirements for Command Approval

1. Must have served one-year on-board in their FIRST permanent duty station (this requirement may be waived by CO)
2. Will serve on active duty through the last day of the course.
3. Pass the most recent Physical Fitness Assessment or received a waiver.
4. Took their most recent advancement exam, if applicable, and be recommended for advancement or promotion.
5. Have not received a NJP within 6 months or not pending administrative separation.
6. Not under instruction in initial skills training or in a duty under instruction training status.

Make sure your son looks at all his options and has a honest conversation with both his command and you. Best of luck to your son.

For readers: I believe t his is a good example of why it’s suggested to attend a college/university where one can afford to pay tuition should the need arise. Things happen.

I wish your son best of luck. It sounds like a stressful situation at best.

Is this the first semester that he fell below the gpa? If so, then *usually* they can be placed on academic probation.

My question for those experienced out there is whether enlisting is an option over disenrollment. Meaning, does the navy allow the option to enlist vs pay them back? (Assuming the person is otherwise qualified)

MsBCT said:

My son is a MIDN and finishing up his sophomore year at a private institution.

He has failed Calculus 2xs and has to attend summer school (12K) and has requested a waiver.

He was already informed that due to this he will be going to a PRB and a request for LOA.

The dilemma I have is - if he passes Calculus I in the Summer, I am not sure he will pass Calculus II the first go round. I am not willing to take out a 25k loan for a semester and he is not guaranteed to pass. I know he can not transfer schools and attend a public school since he won't be in good standing. I am not even sure he will meet G.P.A this semester with a D in a 4unit class.

My son has never had any issues in High School and won a 4yr National Scholarship but college Calculus (with tutors/study hall). I am not confident.

He is on good standing with everything else however, I told him that he needs to tell his CO that if they put him on LOA that he can not pay for it. They only allow Undergrads to take out so many loans and then look at the parents. I just don't see him paying to go to that private school and they may disenroll him anyway.

Should I just advise him to DOR and see if enlistment is an option? He wants to serve - he would prefer being an Officer. He does not want to quit but they will end up quitting him due to him not meeting the requirements.

He said that they will do PRB end of Summer and give him his decision beginning of Fall semester but that is a set up to me to force him to incur those loans if they place him on LOA.

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Also, as an aside,if he does face disenrollment, he is entitled to have an atttorney represent him. I recall seeing links for military attorneys and info on this site.

momx3 said:

My question for those experienced out there is whether enlisting is an option over disenrollment. Meaning, does the navy allow the option to enlist vs pay them back? (Assuming the person is otherwise qualified)

Click to expand...

It's entirely up to the service. These days they seem to prefer payback, as someone pointed out earlier on the thread. When they really, really, really need bodies they might require enlistment.

Can he take summer school at another school and transfer that in?

NavyHoops said:

Can he take summer school at another school and transfer that in?

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That’s a REALLY good idea!!

I know some schools allow that and others don’t. If it’s allowed, might be a great idea to cut costs.

NavyHoops said:

Can he take summer school at another school and transfer that in?

Click to expand...

Whereas the University may allow summer school at another institution and to transfer the credit, you would also want to see if the NROTC will accept Calculus from another institution. I think I read somewhere that Calculus and Physics are supposed to occur at the NROTC school, but I might be wrong.

goirish1 said:

NavyHoops said:

Can he take summer school at another school and transfer that in?

Click to expand...

Whereas the University may allow summer school at another institution and to transfer the credit, you would also want to see if the NROTC will accept Calculus from another institution. I think I read somewhere that Calculus and Physics are supposed to occur at the NROTC school, but I might be wrong.

Click to expand...

You are correct. I remember DS telling me last year that a number of mids were planning to take calculus over the summer at schools near their homes and were told by cadre that they could not do that.

goirish1 said:

NavyHoops said:

Can he take summer school at another school and transfer that in?

Click to expand...

Whereas the University may allow summer school at another institution and to transfer the credit, you would also want to see if the NROTC will accept Calculus from another institution. I think I read somewhere that Calculus and Physics are supposed to occur at the NROTC school, but I might be wrong.

Click to expand...

To my knowledge (from my unit), it's okay if you take it at a NROTC school (or crosstown affiliate). So if you live by a school that offers NROTC, you can take summer classes there and transfer them to meet NROTC calc and physics requirements.

If the class isn't calc or physics, I think you can go anywhere the institution approves transfer credit, but don't quote me.

Thank you all. The school requires he repeat the class there since he failed it there.

I never thought my son would fail a class. He never even received a C in High School or I would not have allowed him to go to this Private School.

It is 8K for summer school. I am not sure how to advise him.

I am thinking maybe allow them to disenroll him and maybe that will allow him and enlistment option versus recoupment. I was thinking if he request to disenroll they won't like that. They know he is failing he is up front. He was on academic probation last semester for the first failure of Calculus.

If they disenroll him and request recoupment does that prevent him from enlistment in the Navy or another Branch of service? He meets all other requirements he is doing really well in PT and he is medically fit. They like him overall but I know, he knows and they know he is just not meeting the requirements of his contract.

No answers but share your concern. As difficult as this is for everyone, it’s not the end of the world, y’all will get through it! Best wishes, good luck, hang in there! I feel for you as a parent!!

@MsBCT

My sympathies on a difficult time.

If he faces disenrollment and recoupment, rather than enlistment, I do recommend seeking out a former JAG attorney who can help negotiate the recoupment and ensure all parties are clear on a fair agreement. They would also be a source of counsel as to whether it is best to wait or to actively request disenrollment.

If you google this search string, options will appear: JAG law firms ROTC disenrollment

There are reputable firms who specialize in ROTC and SA disenrollment and separation cases, along with other issues. They know the policies, the regs, the system, the precedent, the options.

If enlistment is an option, that might be just the thing to resolve the pressure of the current academic situation and expenses, give your son a worthwhile path to serving, learning skills and being financially independent. Never fear, there will be plenty of options for him to finish his degree supported by Tuition Assistance and distance learning or after-hours courses on base or in town. There may even be a shot at applying for OTS/OCS, if he gains his degree and is a top performer with command endorsement.

Something is not working right for your son in this setting, and I am sure you are worried for him, trying to let him be an adult and trying to properly support him. If he wants to serve as an enlisted member, the structure and discipline, the teamwork, hands-on nature of the skills, might be just the ticket for him at this stage. He’s got brains, clearly, but something is out of alignment that is blocking him from doing his best work.

I have no advice but just want to express my sympathy. College Calculus is hard! My son is a NROTC midshipman at a rigorous private university, and he has struggled mightily in Calculus, earning two Ds so far -- which, as passing grades, are acceptable grades as far as the Navy is concerned, but the experience has been stressful.
Your son worked hard to earn the scholarship, and if he can somehow hang in there and survive the current challenge (even with a parental loan) it may help preserve what he's accomplished so far. But if he's not thriving and needs to take a step back, that's OK, too.

Calculus is difficult to grok. Although I managed to pass Calc in high school and freshman year in college with As and Bs, I never really understood it until I started using it in an Economics class senior year.

Thinking outside the box here, but is switching to Marine Option a possibility? That would remove the Calculus requirement. I'm sure it wouldn't be an easy road but just something I wanted to toss out there.

Another outside the box idea. He would still need to repeat the class in summer school but The Khan Academy has a decent online Calculus class and it's free. It might be a helpful supplement to classes. Sometimes just hearing/reading something stated a different way can make all the difference.

I thought that he needed a C to pass Calculus. He failed with a D and was informed he needed to repeat the class.

QUOTE="learningNavymom, post: 672868, member: 45051"]I have no advice but just want to express my sympathy. College Calculus is hard! My son is a NROTC midshipman at a rigorous private university, and he has struggled mightily in Calculus, earning two Ds so far -- which, as passing grades, are acceptable grades as far as the Navy is concerned, but the experience has been stressful.
Your son worked hard to earn the scholarship, and if he can somehow hang in there and survive the current challenge (even with a parental loan) it may help preserve what he's accomplished so far. But if he's not thriving and needs to take a step back, that's OK, too.[/QUOTE]