Coast Guard I am impressed

N

NorwichDad

10-Year Member
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Apr 6, 2010
Messages
1,351
Well Coast Guard,
I guess saving the lives of crews of stricken crab boats in Bering Sea Cyclones or idiot millionaires in the their sailboats in Nor'easters off Massachusetts is not enough. Now you have crew jump off your boats and rip open the hatches of captured Narco subs.

Very impressive

https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/11/us/cocaine-coast-guard-trnd/index.html
 
Interesting that the sub's crew didn't scuttle this vessel to avoid arrest. Think that they're more afraid of the Columbian Drug lords than they are of the American Justice system? Does anyone know what happens to this crew if they're picked up in international waters?
 
Amazing video. Spectacular!! Two things I wonder:

* Why wouldn’t the sub dive?
* Why would they open the hatch?
 
It wasn't a submarine. It was a semi-submersible. It runs on the surface with minimal radar cross section.
My guess is that they opened the hatch because they didn't want to die. If they didn't open the hatch, the Coasties would either disable the propulsion or put holes in it, or both.

These guys were caught, and they knew it. Better to give up, turn over, and get in the WITSEC program. :)
 
justdoit19 said:
Amazing video. Spectacular!! Two things I wonder:

* Why wouldn’t the sub dive?
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Not sure in this case but in the past many of the drug smuggling "submarines" are actually Semi-submersibles where most of the vessel is underwater but there is no actual capability to dive. Looking again at the video, it appears to me to be a very low freeboard surface vessel.
 
LurkingQuietly said:
Interesting that the sub's crew didn't scuttle this vessel to avoid arrest. Think that they're more afraid of the Columbian Drug lords than they are of the American Justice system? Does anyone know what happens to this crew if they're picked up in international waters?
Click to expand...
Federal district court maybe?
 
LurkingQuietly said:
Devil Doc said:
Federal district court maybe?
Click to expand...

Oh, wonderful. So we get to house them for the next 20 years? They should have just put some rounds into the hull, and drop the crew off on the shore.
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The war on drugs has been an expensive failure. I've done counter narcotic ops twice. The shipboard one had a CG LEDET and we made a huge bust off the coast of Colombia. At the time it was the largest combined USN/USCG cocaine seizure in history. To fast forward a long but interesting story, we took the crew and captain to Rodman in Panama where were met by men in SUVs with multi antennae and khaki pants with lots of cargo pockets and Velcro. And sunglasses. I gave a patient report to one of them on the captain as he had a cardiac event while the DET was aboard his vessel. I didn't ask where they were taking them and he didn't offer. Maybe El Chapo has room in his cell for some roomies.
 
I always thought that the war on drugs should be fought against the users not suppliers. As I have gone to funerals of young men and women who once were children I coached on many youth sports teams I always think about it. Always drug deaths.
Their deaths had nothing to do with parenting. They had exceptional parents. They just could not helicopter over their sons and daughters 100% of the time. Addiction is very difficult. The parents could not control a 20, 22, or 23 year old. The sons and daughters were almost always stronger and bigger than their parents. I think it should be a major crime to be a user. Our resources should be used to treat or jail drug addicts. Users would decide whether they go to prison or treatment. If they leave treatment they go to jail. The problem is in the demand not the suppliers. We have proven over the last 60 years that drug dealers and suppliers are replaced instantly. It does nothing to reduce supply. I think if we eliminate demand they go out of business. Attacking the demand would eliminate most crime. More importantly it would save a lot of lives.
 
Forget arresting these a**holes, the Cutter should have just blown it out of the water.
 
If they don’t open the hatch my guess is the Coasties put the .50 cals on the front of those gun boats to good use. Not sure how well those semi submersibles float with a couple hundred holes in them.
 
It has been a while, but shooting at or seizing a foreign vessel in international waters used to be a long arduous process. The CO, or OinC had to contact the OPS center with complete description, reason for stopping the vessel, Nationality of the vessel (or if unknown a complete statement of why it is unknown and that it is being stopped to ascertain nationality). Then the District had to contact the State Department that then contacted the Ambassador or Country Contact to obtain permission to either use disabling fire or to board the vessel. This process took anywhere from a few hours to a day or two to work through, now it is much easier to embark a foreign country's Law Enforcement Offcier, or belong to a Task force made up of host countries that you can contact or directly ask permission to do either the disabling fire or the actual forced stopping and boarding of said vessel. My guess is that they were participating in one of ongoing Multi-National Drug Interdiction Task Forces currently operating and received a SNO (statement of no objection) to either forcibly stop or board the semi-submersible. Vessels that showed no flag or did not claim nationality used to be able to be boarded as "stateless" vessels, then all actions were on the CO or OinC. It would be interesting to hear from someone who is current with policy.
 
Impulsive said:
It has been a while, but shooting at or seizing a foreign vessel in international waters used to be a long arduous process. The CO, or OinC had to contact the OPS center with complete description, reason for stopping the vessel, Nationality of the vessel (or if unknown a complete statement of why it is unknown and that it is being stopped to ascertain nationality). Then the District had to contact the State Department that then contacted the Ambassador or Country Contact to obtain permission to either use disabling fire or to board the vessel. This process took anywhere from a few hours to a day or two to work through, now it is much easier to embark a foreign country's Law Enforcement Offcier, or belong to a Task force made up of host countries that you can contact or directly ask permission to do either the disabling fire or the actual forced stopping and boarding of said vessel. My guess is that they were participating in one of ongoing Multi-National Drug Interdiction Task Forces currently operating and received a SNO (statement of no objection) to either forcibly stop or board the semi-submersible. Vessels that showed no flag or did not claim nationality used to be able to be boarded as "stateless" vessels, then all actions were on the CO or OinC. It would be interesting to hear from someone who is current with policy.
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I may be wrong, but as far as I know the USCG can board/seize just about any vessel they deem in violation of the law as long as the boat is in US or international waters. The US Navy, on the other hand, can’t because doing so could be seen as an act of war by the other country. My dad flew helo’s for the coast guard in the 80’s and used to stop/board/seize foreign vessels all the time in US/international waters in and around the Caribbean.
 
"Alto su barco!" (Stop the boat!)
 
Tex232 said:
Impulsive said:
It has been a while, but shooting at or seizing a foreign vessel in international waters used to be a long arduous process. The CO, or OinC had to contact the OPS center with complete description, reason for stopping the vessel, Nationality of the vessel (or if unknown a complete statement of why it is unknown and that it is being stopped to ascertain nationality). Then the District had to contact the State Department that then contacted the Ambassador or Country Contact to obtain permission to either use disabling fire or to board the vessel. This process took anywhere from a few hours to a day or two to work through, now it is much easier to embark a foreign country's Law Enforcement Offcier, or belong to a Task force made up of host countries that you can contact or directly ask permission to do either the disabling fire or the actual forced stopping and boarding of said vessel. My guess is that they were participating in one of ongoing Multi-National Drug Interdiction Task Forces currently operating and received a SNO (statement of no objection) to either forcibly stop or board the semi-submersible. Vessels that showed no flag or did not claim nationality used to be able to be boarded as "stateless" vessels, then all actions were on the CO or OinC. It would be interesting to hear from someone who is current with policy.
Click to expand...
I may be wrong, but as far as I know the USCG can board/seize just about any vessel they deem in violation of the law as long as the boat is in US or international waters. The US Navy, on the other hand, can’t because doing so could be seen as an act of war by the other country. My dad flew helo’s for the coast guard in the 80’s and used to stop/board/seize foreign vessels all the time in US/international waters in and around the Caribbean.
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The USN cannot as you stated because of Posse Comitatus I suppose. The LE Det on my ship could of course board vessels but as @Impulsive wrote, they had to obtain permission to board from the country of nationality. That is unless the vessel's master granted permission to come aboard. Our Det boarded numerous yachts and hung out for awhile in luxury and then Rhib'ed their way back.
 
It used to be (not positive it still is) that any "Law Enforcement" actions against maritime assets needed either USCG or foreign Law Enforcement Officers onboard the stopping vessel. That is why Navy ships embark USCG Ledets or Taclets, during L/E OPS the CG Officer in Charge or the Foreign L/E Officer in Charge is the one issuing commands and controlling the actions of any boarding or L/E action (such as warning shots, disabling fire, or forcibly boarding), as @Devil Doc states Posse Comitatus prevents any DOD entity (Navy, Army, National Guard) from taking Law Enforcement action alone, except in time of war.

When we used to do OPBAT OPS, we used to have to embark RBDF Officers in order to do any L/E in Bahamian waters, and those RBDF Officers were in charge of any L/E action taken. And there used to be LEDETS and TACLETS in Miami and Key West that used to "ride" Navy ships to provide L/E capacity whenever the Navy would be operating in the Caribbean Basin or the Pacific coast of Central and South America. It GREATLY increased the ability to interdict vessels, being able to operate from Naval assets. Used to ride the Pegasus Class hydrofoils and Frigates back in the 80's. GREAT duty, the Navy treated the CG very well.
 
Impulsive said:
It has been a while, but shooting at or seizing a foreign vessel in international waters used to be a long arduous process
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Do you think the USCG towed this vessel to the nearest port? I pretty sure they "lit it up" as soon as the crew/cargo was removed.
 
LurkingQuietly said:
Impulsive said:
It has been a while, but shooting at or seizing a foreign vessel in international waters used to be a long arduous process
Click to expand...

Do you think the USCG towed this vessel to the nearest port? I pretty sure they "lit it up" as soon as the crew/cargo was removed.
Click to expand...
The one big at-sea bust I was involved in, we towed the vessel to Panama. It took awhile to off load the coke. I have a video. I can see where they would sink it as a hazard to navigation if all the cargo was removed.
 
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