Air Force ROTC Scholarships / Admissions - AMA

thibaud

Member
The interview is dispositive.

Great stats won't get you a Type 1. Mediocre stats won't preclude you from getting a Type 7.

The interview, Ben.

Mr. Maguire: There is a great future in acing your ROTC Scholarship interview. Think about it. Will you think about it?
Benjamin Braddock: Yes, I will.
Mr. Maguire: Okay. Enough said. That's a deal.
 

AROTCPMS

Former Army ROTC PMS for Claremont McKenna and USC
5-Year Member
The interview is dispositive.

Great stats won't get you a Type 1. Mediocre stats won't preclude you from getting a Type 7.

The interview, Ben.

Mr. Maguire: There is a great future in acing your ROTC Scholarship interview. Think about it. Will you think about it?
Benjamin Braddock: Yes, I will.
Mr. Maguire: Okay. Enough said. That's a deal.
Yes. IMHO the local interview takes on too much weight for AFROTC. It leaves too much in the hands of the local interviewer and their judgment on the candidate.

I've posted my thoughts on this issue here: https://www.serviceacademyforums.com/index.php?threads/overemphasis-on-the-detachment-interview-for-the-air-force-rotc-high-school-scholarship-hssp-progr.68757/
 
Yes. IMHO the local interview takes on too much weight for AFROTC. It leaves too much in the hands of the local interviewer and their judgment on the candidate.

I've posted my thoughts on this issue here: https://www.serviceacademyforums.com/index.php?threads/overemphasis-on-the-detachment-interview-for-the-air-force-rotc-high-school-scholarship-hssp-progr.68757/
Unfortunately that's the way it is based off our algorithm. A good chunk of our applicants have perfect GPA / test scores. Our interview is what determines most of it.

For example, if we go majority by academic score -> the averages across all types would be high 3.9, and almost near perfect test scores. As much as academics is important, character is what we really look for. A lot of these students may only apply as a USAFA backup whereas someone who is definitely driven with same stats to do AFROTC will be picked.
 
@AROTCPMS I can't seem to find the private message function in here, perhaps I am to infrequent a user to have earned such a function? Anyway, I would be glad to share a profile of our sons stats if you would like to PM me. I don't feel it's overly beneficial to put that in the public forum like this because I fear it becomes a yardstick by which other young candidates measure themselves and if they find that their numbers are slightly lower it only serves to invoke unneeded anxiety and worry. So for respect of the great candidates awaiting board decision I would be willing to share in PM. I think it reasonable to concede that the numbers are important but there are other factors unmeasured by SAT or GPA alone and these young folks shouldn't get too hung up on the stats.
Do you use reddit?
 

PAproud

New Member
Has anyone encountered an issue or glitch when using the site to set up DoDmerb exam? After receiving scholarship son began this process. Completed the extensive health questionnaire however at end asks to esign but each time when attempting it states can not esign until all questions answered. We have gone through each and every page several times. All questions are answered and saved so not sure if there is just a glitch in site/software? Just wondered if anyone else experienced same.
 

FloridaFirst

New Member
Thanks for the stats on Type 1 and 2 scholarship awards through the first two Boards. The SAT's for the Type 1 and 2 awards in particular appear significantly higher than recent years.
 
Thanks for the stats on Type 1 and 2 scholarship awards through the first two Boards. The SAT's for the Type 1 and 2 awards in particular appear significantly higher than recent years.
Keep in mind these stats will decrease with later boards. Earlier boards are typically those who are trying for ED at their colleges and are Ivy League applicants.
 

Pima

10-Year Member
Thanks for the stats on Type 1 and 2 scholarship awards through the first two Boards. The SAT's for the Type 1 and 2 awards in particular appear significantly higher than recent years.
To me I would not say they are significantly higher than recent years. The stats I have seen in the past are in the 30-31 range for ACT and mid to high 1300s for the SAT for type 1 and 2. The last I saw a few yrs back was type 7 avg was 29 with a high 1200, almost 1300. Type 2 was 30 and mid 1300s. Type 1 was @31 and very high 1300, close to 1400.

My DS many moons ago, had a 1410 and 33 or 34 (can't recall) best sittings and was awarded a type 2 non-tech.
Earlier boards are typically those who are trying for ED at their colleges and are Ivy League applicants.
I would also think that many of those candidates also are trying for an SA appointment, since their (USAFA) system really pushes for the candidates files to be completed by Nov. 1st. Thus, many of those candidates will also try to complete everything by the end of the summer, which means they are going to meet the 1st few boards. They might as well if you think about it from applying for both an SA and ROTC scholarships.
1. They spend the summer training for the CFA, so they do the PFA around the same time....not the same day, but around the same time. This is especially true for candidates that are doing fall sports. Hard to find the time to do the PFA if you are playing football since M-F after school you are training or at a game, and only specific people can administer the exam. Your PE teacher may not be a coach, so their free time to do it is the exact same time you are training.
2. Candidates are assigned ALOs usually by July. Our DSs ALO made sure that as he worked on his USAFA packet and MoC noms., and he completed his AFROTC package by the 1st week of school. I know by the 1st week of October he had both put to bed and moved onto his college apps. and college visits
3. AFROTC does not take anything you do as a senior (except new best sitting SAT/ACT) that it makes sense to put it to bed early.

Just my personal opinion and I have no proof to say this is factual, it is just anecdotal from what I have seen.
 
Last edited:

Pima

10-Year Member
@PAproud you cannot message on this site until you hit a magic number of posts. I believe it is 10. If you look up at the top of the page on the right side next to your moniker there will be an envelope appear when you get to that number. It will look like your moniker, envelope, alert bell and than the search button. Hope that helps.
 

AirDad

New Member
Unfortunately that's the way it is based off our algorithm. A good chunk of our applicants have perfect GPA / test scores. Our interview is what determines most of it.

For example, if we go majority by academic score -> the averages across all types would be high 3.9, and almost near perfect test scores. As much as academics is important, character is what we really look for. A lot of these students may only apply as a USAFA backup whereas someone who is definitely driven with same stats to do AFROTC will be picked.
Glad to hear this for a variety of reasons.

Not all 'Swim Team Captains', '4.3 GPA' Students, 'Excellent Test Takers' (i.e. 1500 SAT Score or 34 ACT), have great character. Some are wonderful young up-and-comers. Others can be self-centered, cocky, self-promoting, etc...

Great Stats are not always synonymous with great inner character.

At the end of the day, would you rather hire a leader that is concerned with how his/her hair looks that particular day or a Leader that is always there to lift up every soldier! A leader that is consistently concerned with the well-being of those under his or her command.

Character.
 

Pima

10-Year Member
@AirDad
I also see it from 3 different aspects/reasons why the interview matters.

1. Many candidates apply for multiple ROTC scholarships, such as both AF and Navy, or Navy and Army or all 3.
~ Why the AF/Navy?
~~ I want to be a pilot. That's great, but ....what if you can't be a pilot, what appeals to you for this branch?
~~~~ Same could be said why Navy and Army? I want to be a SEAL or Ranger. Great again, but what if that is not an option?
Only the interviewer can really read between those lines.
2. Is this a future career choice, or is this a way to pay for college?
~ Nobody saw 9/11 occuring, even at 7 a.m. that day, but within days we were deploying newly minted enlisted and officers to the Gulf. These kids that entered college on a ROTC scholarship in Sept of 2001, never envisioned come fall of 2005 for the next 4 yrs they were going to be deployed alot. Many thought this was a great way to pay for college, get work experience and no danger. They were wrong.
~ Same can be said in 2007/08 when the economy tanked. Parents were no longer able to take a 2nd mtg out on their home, or sell mutual funds to pay for their kids dream school. Kids were looking at ROTC as a way to pay for college.
3. Do you want this school and ROTC, or ROTC, but not this school?
~ An interviewer can offer on the spot to a candidate a scholarship, but it is tied to only their school. If the candidate accepts that school, they must remove their name from the national board. It doesn't happen often, but it does happen. You see at least a handful every yr on this forum that is offered that option. It is for many a hard decision, sometimes it comes down to a bird in the hand. They may be offered on the spot that scholarship, yet not know if they are going to be admitted to the school. Do you take your name out of the hat from the national pool with the risk of not getting accepted, or do you risk not getting a type 1, but a type 2 from the national pool and getting accepted later on to that school? IE being out of pocket for tuition.

I know this might offend, upset you and others AirDad, but I actually disagree with you on one thing you stated
At the end of the day, would you rather hire a leader that is concerned with how his/her hair looks that particular day
I believe how you look that particular day illustrates a lot regarding character. I work mgmt for a national retailer. 1st impressions regarding how they dress tells me a lot about them. Did you put thought into what would occur today, or was this, oh well let me roll out of bed and grab something from my closet?

I am not saying that the kids need to wear a suit. Nice dress shirt, dockers, and boat decks would not deter me in an interview over the person in a suit.... my thought process is not everyone can afford a suit, so I would not hold that against them. Heck, my DS, an ADAF brat had curly hair (just above his collar, but below his ears) when he did not only his AFROTC interview, but his MoCs nom interviews too. He got a type 2, and all 3 Moc noms.
~ The point is his hair was clean and kept. His nails were clean. His outfit was Sunday best....no suit, no sport coat, just white button down, a tie, khakis and loafers. It showed he gave an extra thought about how he looked that particular day because in his eyes he was applying for a job. A leader in the military also has to adhere to dress standards. That is impo part of a great leader...do as I do. That is part of a person's character where they illustrate respect for the interviewer, the organization and the position they want to achieve.

I do interview people/ my DH as a GS interviews people. As much as you might want to say image doesn't matter, it does. As a woman, when I interview women, I pay attention within a minute or 2 of certain things.
1. Handshake...I look at their finger nails...is it chipped, weird colors, insanely long? If it is weird colors I typically will comment, wow that is interesting color, where did you get it....it starts the conversation without them knowing why I am asking. If it is chipped, I look deeper into them, wondering if maybe they are chipped because of other factors, and not common, but in the back of my mind, as a woman I think....cmon you washed your hands this a.m., right? Did you not see that? Are you telling me you didn't have 2 mins to remove the nail polish? I am not lieing or exaggerating. That is how I truly feel, and even my DD lives by it bc her entire life was me hounding her when I could see her nails chipped.
2. Jewelry. Lots of bracelets, and dangling earrings are distracting. Females tend to play with their jewelry when they get nervous. Most posters here will tell the females to remove all jewelry, except maybe stud earrings because unconsciously they play with jewelry and the interviewer maybe looking at them spin their bracelet instead of hearing their answer.

When I interview men, it is basically the same for the handshake. It is not about it being a firm handshake, but unkept nails, gives me an oh uck factor.
For men, the 2nd thing is being comfortable in their clothes. A 17 yr old boy that has never worn a suit does not know how to sit down in a suit. IE they do not unbutton the coat and typically sit on the tail of the jacket. This tends to lend them into squirming since they are constrained by the jacket. It is very disconcerting as an interviewer.
~ The kid that walks in, even in dockers is comfortable. They took the time to prepare for that interview. Again, it means this interview was important enough to prepare for it from even the smallest aspect.

Not trying to offend, just mpo.
 

AirDad

New Member
Thank you for the note @Pima
Truly well said!

(apologies, hair comment above was meant more figurative than literal. I may not have communicated that very well)
 
Keep in mind, this was the last FY. This year might be different as we are predicting more applicants. FYSA:
~11K applicants
~3.1K eligible
~2.7K awarded

This year, we already have ~7K applicants and the deadline is in January 17.
I'm curious if you know, but what is the percentage award rate for Type 2 for any major? I'm guessing it's smaller than for tech majors. Thanks!
 

thibaud

Member
Re the stats, as AFROTCAdmissions said, it's very unlikely that the final stats will be as high as what came out of the early boards.
For comparison, here are the stats from last year (FY'19)-- the Type 1 avg SAT = 1472, Type 2 avg SAT = 1404:
FY19 HSSP Results | SAT | ACT | GPA
Overall (2534 scholarships) |1366 | 30 | 3.78
Type 1 (284 / 11%) |1472 | 33 | 3.93
Type 2 (437 / 17%) |1404 | 31 | 3.87
Type 7 (1813 / 72%) |1342 | 29 | 3.73
 
Top