BSA Core Values....

Unless the Scouts change their organizational view with respect to gay members and atheists, I don't think I'd encourage my sons (should I have them) to do it.

If the Scouts don't want to associate with gay people or those who don't espouse religious faith, it doesn't seem to me that the organization is willing to leave behind a WASPy 1950s worldview. That's not realistic, and not really relevant anymore. Sure, things like being responsible and honest still are, but the BSA doesn't have a monopoly on teaching those values. I do think the reluctance to change is what'll continue to cause a decline in membership, and that's what'll devalue what it means to make Eagle. Worse, it'll be seen as an organization that fits on one side of the culture wars (if it isn't already).

I think the role of the antigay policy in driving away members is overstated. If that was the main reason why the BSA is losing members, then the Girl Scouts, who have allowed lesbians in for the past decade, would be seeing an increase in membership. Instead, the Girl Scouts have lost more than half a million members since 2003, and annual donations are down by almost $45 million from where they were 5 years ago. In both cases, I think the lifestyle change that kids these days are going through (more ECAs, more working parents who don't have time to volunteer, more alternative activities available) is the real culprit, and a controversial BSA policy is just a more convenient scapegoat. Plus, while the decline and fall of a large organization that failed to keep up with the times is an oft-told story, one with an issue as inflammatory as this is not, and that's why it keeps showing up on the evening news, regardless of whether or not said policy is the driving force behind the trend.
 
I think the role of the antigay policy in driving away members is overstated. If that was the main reason why the BSA is losing members, then the Girl Scouts, who have allowed lesbians in for the past decade, would be seeing an increase in membership. Instead, the Girl Scouts have lost more than half a million members since 2003, and annual donations are down by almost $45 million from where they were 5 years ago. In both cases, I think the lifestyle change that kids these days are going through (more ECAs, more working parents who don't have time to volunteer, more alternative activities available) is the real culprit, and a controversial BSA policy is just a more convenient scapegoat. Plus, while the decline and fall of a large organization that failed to keep up with the times is an oft-told story, one with an issue as inflammatory as this is not, and that's why it keeps showing up on the evening news, regardless of whether or not said policy is the driving force behind the trend.
I think that you hit that nail right on the head
 
Of course, it could be all of the things mentioned AND their policy towards gay members playing a role in the decline in membership.

They need not be mutually exclusive.
 
It will be interesting to see how Robert Gates handles the Boy Scouts, what changes might be down the road.
 
Did you read the linked article? It is beyond disturbing...

I did and it was quite disturbing. I asked what I did because tug said "disturbing answer for lack of BSA leadership." That can be interpreted a couple ways with very different meanings. Mainly, lack of leadership by allowing gay scouts, lack of leadership by not going all the way and only allowing gay scouts but not leaders, or lack of leadership by being purposely ambiguous in policy and not being crystal clear by having a policy of full inclusion? That's why I'm asking for clarification instead of knee-jerk assuming the worst.
 
I did and it was quite disturbing. I asked what I did because tug said "disturbing answer for lack of BSA leadership." That can be interpreted a couple ways with very different meanings. Mainly, lack of leadership by allowing gay scouts, lack of leadership by not going all the way and only allowing gay scouts but not leaders, or lack of leadership by being purposely ambiguous in policy and not being crystal clear by having a policy of full inclusion? That's why I'm asking for clarification instead of knee-jerk assuming the worst.
Right, I see what you mean; it is all very ambiguous. As an assistant scout master and a parent of an Eagle Scout, I hope the BSA will no longer be discriminatory. While they want to think that they are being inclusive by changing policy to allow gay youth, they are not. Under the current policy a (gay) scout can participate as a youth but once they turn 21 then they can no longer participate. Maybe Robert Gates can help this organization.
 
Right, I see what you mean; it is all very ambiguous. As an assistant scout master and a parent of an Eagle Scout, I hope the BSA will no longer be discriminatory. While they want to think that they are being inclusive by changing policy to allow gay youth, they are not. Under the current policy a (gay) scout can participate as a youth but once they turn 21 then they can no longer participate. Maybe Robert Gates can help this organization.

I'm very glad to see that what you find disturbing is the Boy Scout Policy, and you are not espousing an intolerant position regarding the freedom of religion as expressed by the development of Trail Life USA. As noted before, the replies about what exactly was "disturbing" regarding the Trail Life news article were quite ambiguious. And by the way, I've witnessed a complete masacre of the Cub Scout oath in much the same way as the "nuremburg" label that one of the previous posters put on the picture of the Trail Life youth conducting the Trail Life oath.
 
I'm very glad to see that what you find disturbing is the Boy Scout Policy, and you are not espousing an intolerant position regarding the freedom of religion as expressed by the development of Trail Life USA. As noted before, the replies about what exactly was "disturbing" regarding the Trail Life news article were quite ambiguious. And by the way, I've witnessed a complete masacre of the Cub Scout oath in much the same way as the "nuremburg" label that one of the previous posters put on the picture of the Trail Life youth conducting the Trail Life oath.

I've been called an immoral deviant and compared with pedophiles and bestiality one too many times to take anyone calling my loud denunciation of organizations like trail life USA intolerant. It isn't freedom of religion, it's downright hate and bigotry thinly veiled in the cloak of "religious freedom." Just as racism, sexism, and miscegenation bans were based on "religious freedom." Try to disguise it all you want, it's clear as day to me.
 
You know folks- I believe that this thread has served its purposes. Why don't you let it go to bed before it starts to get really ugly and really personal fast? It is not about anything that is related to our forum and frankly it's just posters rehashing their personal opinions over and over again. I think it is time to let this go and find another hobby horse to ride.
 
Crumbling BSA...

I’m sorry to see this thread close. I found it, interesting, a good topic and thought provoking. Those who chose to participate in the post, I feel are very intelligent, articulate and passionate about this. I do enjoy everyone’s thoughts and opinions here on SA forums. It can be very inspirational.

I did go back and looked at the photo again. There is an “editorial correction” statement that was not there before. So I can imagine many others had the same opinion to drive a correction.

I get frustrated at times with this form of communications. It can be very limiting for me.

Push Hard, Press Forward
 
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