Can’t Purchase Class Ring?

[A1Janitor]

What year is your cadet? The yearly base pay is 14.2k. Paying back 5k a year for the first two years for advances. Net pay is scheduled to be over 8k for year 1.

My son is an Ensign. Just graduated USNA.

He received a net monthly check of 125 plebe year. Gross was about 12/14k? I am too lazy to look at his tax return over the years. Iirc it went up to like 180 second year.

And I believe it went to the 500-800 his last years as Stealth_81 said.

He had no need for money his first year as a plebe - an occasional dinner when he got liberty or coffee. He always seemed to have enough - his mother and I would occasionally Apple Pay him something if he needed it.

I remember him making a comment how he would be receiving more years ago if he applied for scholarships that he would have won - and used it for his uniforms at the beginning. He did not apply because he didn’t want to compete with his friends who were going to expensive schools.

I assume his bar tab went way up when he turned 21.

 

[A1Janitor]

My son finally texted me. He is sending his spreadsheet to me later.

He said he got 1,000 as a firstie. When reviewing your spreadsheet, he said you don’t have as many deductions as he had at USNA - midshipmen get charged for things they don’t use.

So I am an idiot for assuming the SAs were the same.

 

[99Gold]

My son finally texted me. He is sending his spreadsheet to me later.

He said he got 1,000 as a firstie. When reviewing your spreadsheet, he said you don’t have as many deductions as he had at USNA - midshipmen get charged for things they don’t use.

So I am an idiot for assuming the SAs were the same.

My USAFA doolie receives about $600-$700 per month on average. A LOT more than the $60/month I got as a doolie back in the day.

 

[Osprey123]

My son finally texted me. He is sending his spreadsheet to me later.

He said he got 1,000 as a firstie. When reviewing your spreadsheet, he said you don’t have as many deductions as he had at USNA - midshipmen get charged for things they don’t use.

So I am an idiot for assuming the SAs were the same.

Glad he ended up doing well. The only reason I posted was because @RandomCadet1234 was concerned about finances. I was simply sharing our experience that our cadet was actually earning and saving a lot. As @99Gold said, $600 to $700 a month, C4C and C3C. The last two years, they are making $900 to $1000 a month. (@Stealth_81) The current base pay is actually $1217 a month or $15309 a year. There was a pay raise.

 

[Osprey123]

My son finally texted me. He is sending his spreadsheet to me later.

He said he got 1,000 as a firstie. When reviewing your spreadsheet, he said you don’t have as many deductions as he had at USNA - midshipmen get charged for things they don’t use.

So I am an idiot for assuming the SAs were the same.

So I just compared the 26 USAFA pay schedule to the 26 USNA pay schedule. The USAFA cadet is making almost $7000 more the first year in comparison to their USNA counterparts. The second year USAFA cadets are making almost $5500 more. At year 3 the USAFA cadet is making about $5000 more. As Firsties, USAFA cadets only make a couple hundred dollars more than USNA cadets of the same year. In total USAFA cadets receive about 18k more than USNA. It's because at USNA you have to buy pages and pages of stuff.

I feel like this is a really good time to talk about how amazing USAFA is.

 

[A1Janitor]

So I just compared the 26 USAFA pay schedule to the 26 USNA pay schedule. The USAFA cadet is making almost $7000 more the first year in comparison to their USNA counterparts. The second year USAFA cadets are making almost $5500 more. At year 3 the USAFA cadet is making about $5000 more. As Firsties, USAFA cadets only make a couple hundred dollars more than USNA cadets of the same year. It's because at USNA you have to buy pages and pages of stuff.

I feel like this is a really good time to talk about how amazing USAFA is.

I feel like you are 5 years too late.

But mids should make less because of weather, the Chesapeake, and DTA.

 

[nuensis]

He received a net monthly check of 125 plebe year. Gross was about 12/14k? I am too lazy to look at his tax return over the years. Iirc it went up to like 180 second year.

All cadet/midshipman pay is about 1/3 O1 base pay. Currently $1273.20 per month.

USNA does the held pay thing and is not necessarily comparable to the other SAs. He either received the held pay over 1/C year or as an ENS.

The dangers of cross-posting to another SA's forum.

 

[HCopter]

Hello, I'm curious to know if it's common for cadets to forego purchasing a class ring? In the event that I lack enough money for the purchase, are there any available loans or forms of assistance that I could use? Personally, I don't see myself wearing it regularly, which would make it feel like an unnecessary expense. Moreover, considering my family's low income, it might be more practical to allocate that money towards other essential needs.

@RandomCadet1234 , I hear what you are saying.

It's not about how much Cadet pay you get, but how much you truly have available. Everyone's in a different boat. Easy for me or others to say just budget for it, or just buy it, but it sounds like you will have to entirely support yourself, and possibly chip in for family needs with your own pay. For now, consider the ring something you want to have. You don't have to buy a ring with the features to "keep up with the Jones". Your ring will have special meaning - because of how hard it was to save even for that basic ring with no extra diamonds or whatever. You may never wear it, but it goes in the box with the challenge coins. You can look at it from time to time and be very proud not only that you are a USAFA grad, but having the ring meant you also were able to fully support yourself and get a ring, which many, many others would never get the chance to have.

 

[flieger83]

Ahh...how times change.

Cadet pay, back when Dino's roamed the TZo...

4th - $40 a month in the bank
3rd - $180 a month in the bank (we were rich!)
2nd - $240 a month in the bank
1st - $??? whatever was left of your cheque after Uncle Samuel and Mother Blue go their cut

 

[Osprey123]

LOL. The net pay is literally ~$8K the first two years. So I guess if they literally did nothing outside of the campus and never traveled home, I guess they could save $8K. Now the last two years, assuming you get a car....average cost of true ownership of a car is ~$900 a month, you could save maybe $2K each year...still never traveling anywhere you can't drive.

Yes...grateful for the education, but eyes wide open, they are going to be technically BROKE the entire four years and will need to learn to live frugally if they haven't yet.

So excellent original question on the ring.

Doolie Parent

They are going to be paid $600+ a month so they will literally be making over 16k total the first two years. They literally do nothing much off campus Doolie year. Ours had saved about 7k the first year and plans early for the best, least expensive flights. It may be wise to prepare your cadet especially since your expectation is that they will literally be broke. Having 8k to 11k in discretionary money each year as a college student who has all essential living expenses paid is no joke even though you are laughing.

 

[dahacker]

Doolie Parent

They are going to be paid $600+ a month so they will literally be making over 16k total the first two years. They literally do nothing much off campus Doolie year. Ours had saved about 7k the first year and plans early for the best, least expensive flights. It may be wise to prepare your cadet especially since your expectation is that they will literally be broke. Having 8k to 11k in discretionary money each year as a college student who has all essential living expenses paid is no joke even though you are laughing.

I'd love to hear more from actual self-funded C1C's on how much they ended up saving over the four years. Flights home or elsewhere multiple times during the most expensive holiday flying times of year is no joke. I was mostly commenting on how it isn't realistically possible to save $8K/year the first two years, when $8K/year is the projected take home pay. As I said, totally possible by not spending ANYTHING (that is how I did college), but not realistic for most.

 

[Stealth_81]

This is an older cadet budget because I don't have the current one handy.

It appears that my info is a bit dated from 2011. However, looking at the new spreadsheet, they account for things differently now. One thing that sticks out is the two entries of $950 each for Doolies to buy textbooks. It shows the repayment of the advance, but doesn’t account for the actual cash outlay by the cadet for the books. Even if they are frugal, that is still an expense they will have. At face value, that would be another $1800 to be accounted for against their net pay. I am also guessing that the old “Magic Money” for purchases at the cadet store has been eliminated, so that is another net expense for cadets.

Stealth_81

 

[Osprey123]

I'd love to hear more from actual self-funded C1C's on how much they ended up saving over the four years. Flights home or elsewhere multiple times during the most expensive holiday flying times of year is no joke. I was mostly commenting on how it isn't realistically possible to save $8K/year the first two years, when $8K/year is the projected take home pay. As I said, totally possible by not spending ANYTHING (that is how I did college), but not realistic for most.

My original ballpark savings estimate (especially for someone who was already worried about expenses) was 8k a year. (I took into account the pay bump the last two years and instead of breaking it down to 7k, 7k, 9.5k, 8.5k, I simplified it to 8k a year as an AVERAGE!) MY APOLOGIES for not writing the entire calculation out clearly. I hadn't anticipated that the estimate would be so funny. That would leave the cadet with 6.6k in discretionary money over 4 years. This was only a quick ballpark estimate.

You may have noticed that I lowered that amount to 7k a year (AS AN AVERAGE!!!). That leaves the cadet with 10.6k in discretionary spending money during their four years during which they are earning 38.6k net pay.

Cadets share cars even with doolies. You do not have to own a car your junior year especially if saving is important and your family situation is such that you need to help. That doesn't mean that you are locked on base and go nowhere. Some cadets also stay during Thanksgiving to save money. While the winter break flight cost may be high, I know mine is choosing the cheap, long flights whenever possible. The summer break one being less than $400.

I had responded to OP ONLY so they would not be so worried. I was only trying to share our experience of the first year during which our USAFA cadet both earned and saved A LOT. And also let them know that a large loan at low interest would be available junior year.

 

[A1Janitor]

While the winter break flight cost may be high, I know mine is choosing the cheap, long flights whenever possible. The summer break one being less than $400..

Since I already ruined the thread … I have to go off topic with this doozy:

My son drove with a friend to Louisiana to be the best man in one of his best friend’s wedding. The plan was to fly back to Annapolis Sunday.

He booked a flight from Louisiana to Annapolis, and to save a couple of hundred dollars on the flight:

Louisiana to Atlanta at night, layover. Next morning Atlanta to Orlando for 6 hour layover. Orlando to BWI.

I would have preferred to send him $200 (money wasn’t an issue for him) than to harm my intelligence like this.

 

[Osprey123]

It appears that my info is a bit dated from 2011. However, looking at the new spreadsheet, they account for things differently now. One thing that sticks out is the two entries of $950 each for Doolies to buy textbooks. It shows the repayment of the advance, but

It appears that my info is a bit dated from 2011. However, looking at the new spreadsheet, they account for things differently now. One thing that sticks out is the two entries of $950 each for Doolies to buy textbooks. It shows the repayment of the advance, but doesn’t account for the actual cash outlay by the cadet for the books. Even if they are frugal, that is still an expense they will have. At face value, that would be another $1800 to be accounted for against their net pay. I am also guessing that the old “Magic Money” for purchases at the cadet store has been eliminated, so that is another net expense for cadets.

Stealth_81

It would be interesting to hear a cadet's take on books. I did text my cadet. I know our other college students either rented or ordered really cheap used ones online or got the ebook.

 

[Osprey123]

Since I already ruined the thread … I have to go off topic with this doozy:

My son drove with a friend to Louisiana to be the best man in one of his best friend’s wedding. The plan was to fly back to Annapolis Sunday.

He booked a flight from Louisiana to Annapolis, and to save a couple of hundred dollars on the flight:

Louisiana to Atlanta at night, layover. Next morning Atlanta to Orlando for 6 hour layover. Orlando to BWI.

I would have preferred to send him $200 (money wasn’t an issue for him) than to harm my intelligence like this.

I won't be back to this forum again but that was funny. The crazy things they do to save cash. Best of luck to your Ensign.

 

[Smudge2]

Circling back to the ring….. my kid didn’t think purchasing one would be something viable financially or meaningful. But when it came to it, the ring means so much to him, and worth every cent. And there’s the whole, uh, mom ring replica he purchased as well, which was very thoughtful.

 

[Osprey123]

It appears that my info is a bit dated from 2011. However, looking at the new spreadsheet, they account for things differently now. One thing that sticks out is the two entries of $950 each for Doolies to buy textbooks. It shows the repayment of the advance, but doesn’t account for the actual cash outlay by the cadet for the books. Even if they are frugal, that is still an expense they will have. At face value, that would be another $1800 to be accounted for against their net pay. I am also guessing that the old “Magic Money” for purchases at the cadet store has been eliminated, so that is another net expense for cadets.

Stealth_81

Because my cadet replied with books costs, I am providing this information. I realize that as a current USAFA cadet parent, not a single word is going to be believed and this information will likely be ridiculed by the incoming Class of 27parent just like the earnings/savings information.

What struck me with the line item about books is how dated that line item was. Having current college students and working in academia it is my experience that today's college students spend very, very little on books. Nothing like the old days. Checking in with my USAFA cadet, less than $100 was spent on books for the first year. STEM major. YMMV

 

[A1Janitor]

Because my cadet replied with books costs, I am providing this information. I realize that as a current USAFA cadet parent, not a single word is going to be believed and this information will likely be ridiculed by the incoming Class of 27parent just like the earnings/savings information.

What struck me with the line item about books is how dated that line item was. Having current college students and working in academia it is my experience that today's college students spend very, very little on books. Nothing like the old days. Checking in with my USAFA cadet, less than $100 was spent on books for the first year. STEM major. YMMV

My brother is an economics professor and teaches mba classes. He said he stopped using textbooks 12 years ago. He said many professors have also done that - fewer use them than don’t.

My father wrote a popular freshman English textbook used around the country many years ago and has made tremendous amounts in royalties. I do his taxes - the royalties have been drastically reduced over the last four or five years.

I think the trend is away from textbooks and that trend will continue.

 

[LV2021]

Is there a reason why the academy not issuing every cadet a standard class ring? After all, every cadet wears the same uniform, why should the ring be any different? The class ring is not your everyday jewelry, it was designed to celebrate your accomplishments as well a reminder of your commitments. Making the cadets pay for it is just wrong. As for how many my cadet brings home, my standard response to my DS "You did not join to make money right".