College Major - Before a Commission

[tpaine7]

I have recently started an application to the University I wish to attend; however, I am having trouble deciding on a major. I have always had an interest towards architectural, aeronautical, and civil engineering, but I feel it would do me no good as a Marine officer; I am looking to make a career out of it. Those majors are severely difficult, while the challenge doesn't bother me, I'm afraid it could end up being a complete waste of time for an aspiring Infantry officer. As of lately I've been looking into Finance, that way I could gain a better understanding of the stock market and economy. I feel this major could potentially advance myself as critical decision maker. Only one simple problem. I'm not sure if I'm interested in it. I realize I have plenty of time before coming to an actual decision on a major, therefore I would be forever grateful to hear some answers on your pre-commission college experiences.

(These questions may only apply to current midshipmen/officers).
- What major did you study before earning a commission?
- Was it helpful to your military career?
- Difficult or effortless?
- Time consuming?
- What do you suggest?

Answering questions like that would be greatly appreciated. If you did not commission and were enlisted feel free to respond with your opinion and what you would've likely done. Thanks.

 

[Capt MJ]

Find something you will enjoy and pursue it. If you enjoy it, you are more likely to be buoyed up through the hard spots and thrive.

For most military officers, their major doesn’t have a lot to do with their professional specialty, except with IT types who go on to cyber and other direct progressions. If you talk to a lot of people, you will find what they are doing now as a civilian has little relation to their major in college. The Marine Corps will teach you everything you need to know to be an infantry officer.

Think broadly. Engineering, any kind, teaches you to break down a problem and develop solutions. You’ll learn how to plan, study the underlying principles, persevere through mental challenges, trouble-shoot rough spots. College education is designed to further develop your analytical skills, increase your ability to write and think at a more advanced level and broaden and deepen your knowledge. All these are handy foundations for a future military officer.

There are dozens of threads on here about complete disconnects between college major, military specialty and eventual civilian career. Post-military employers hire transitioning officers for their demonstrated leadership expertise, ability to perform in high-pressure operational situations, experience in managing resources and making decisions, flexibility, adaptiveness, security clearance and likely a drug-free, healthy lifestyle - not because they took some finance courses in college.

Ask the adults you know what their college major was and how they settled in the career they are in right now. While there will be some logical progressions, I think you will be interested to see the twists and turns life takes.

I have written several posts over the years describing what disparate paths the USNA midshipmen we sponsored took, but I can’t lay hands on one right now. Here’s a sample:

Physics major > Marine ground (communications) > civilian transition > clandestine operations for an ABC agency > currently doing post-graduate work in international business at a foreign graduate school

Systems engineering > Marine air > language immersion and transition to foreign affairs officer > military attaché duty in foreign countries > civilian transition > Department of State

Political Science major > Marine ground (finance) > civilian transition > licensed financial advisor and regional vice-president of his firm

Quantitative Econ major > Marine air > civilian transition > fitness professional and personal coach

English major > Marine ground (logistics) > systems role with Fortune 500 tire company, now an executive in the quality control area

That’s just a quick sample from the Marine side of our USNA midshipman sponsor family.

 

[Devil Doc]

“Find something you will enjoy and pursue it. If you enjoy it, you are more likely to be buoyed up through the hard spots and thrive.“ If I were to ever disagree with @Capt MJ I would never admit it but completely agree with her opening couple of sentences above.

The Marines care not what you major in. My son is a product of Brown Field and is today considered the top combat engineer officer in the Corps (not his words). He majored in Conflict Analysis and Resolution and specializes in the Resolution part. You know how people say “officers don’t get to do the fun stuff, they just do paper work” or something like that? He teaches 19 year old infantrymen how to blow up stuff. With real explosives.

On one deployment he and “others” were tasked with observing and documenting human smuggling activities in a Central American country. He spent a year with CENTCOM-Forward as OIC of a team of multi-service enlisted who traveled throughout the AOR doing security and threat assessment type of fun-ness. He was CO of Mobility Assault Company in the 1st Marine Division which is as badazz as it sounds.

The honor grad in his TBS class was a Finance grad from Harvard and became an infantry officer. One of my youth baseball players got a masters in one of the Engineering majors at Va Tech and now flys C-130s. I would pick a major in which you have an interest because once you put on the Eagle, Globe, and Anchor, it won’t matter what they print on the diploma.

 

[USMCGrunt]

Great advice and responses from @Capt MJ and @Devil Doc. As a Marine Infantry Officer, let me try to add some color, perspective, and advice.

Picking a major when you are in high school is crazy. You don't know what you don't know. While I support the idea of finding something you enjoy and pursuing it, this is a tall task when you are sitting at home. Some universities (not many) have a "Freshman year of studies" that covers the general education courses allowing you to consider what major you would like to pursue starting your Sophomore year. I support that approach. Many students change their majors over time due to interests, future opportunity, grades, etc. Personally, I went from Chemical Engineering to Chemistry to Business.

Don't pick a major that you think will enhance your Marine career (or avoid those that you feel "will do you no good"). The Marine process of assigning Military Occupational Specialties (MOS) is not as straightforward as you may think. It is way too complex to explain here but in the end, your performance in school and TBS is only part of the equation. The needs of the Marine Corps is also a factor. Besides combat arms roles, the Marines need supply, finance, personnel, and lots of other support Officers. You can not predict or game the system to get the MOS you desire.

The Marines don't care what you major in. Why do you think that is the case? Jokes aside, I maintain it is because they seek someone who is capable of demonstrating a critical mind, logic, problem solving, etc. They want someone who can think. The USMC will teach you what you need to know to perform well. Would higher math and engineering classes help you understand the ballistics of artillery canon fire? Sure, but someone without this training will learn to put rounds on target. Would Finance help you understand the market and economy? Sure. But if you are assigned as the unit's Finance Officer, you will be trained by Uncle Sam to offer competent financial guidance to your Marines and help them dig out of debt regardless of your university degree.

Consider what you might do after the Marines. While the Marines don't care what your major is, the civilian world often does. If you think you might want a career in Engineering or Architecture, you may want to pursue an undergraduate degree in those areas. If you think you want a Finance role in business, you may want to go that route. Civilian leadership roles will be less concerned with your undergraduate degree and might value your military service more.

Bottom line: You HAVE to earn a degree and graduate to become a Marine Officer. Selecting a major you have interest in along with the aptitude to succeed in the classes is critical. If you are bored or overwhelmed and fail as a result you will not become a Marine Officer.

Hope that helps.

 

[Devil Doc]

I second the guidance from @USMCGrunt concerning the gen. ed. classes freshman year and the time you will have to pick a major. My daughter wanted to be a doctor from an early age but got to college and found out how hard it was to major in a hard science, play softball, and party. She changed her major from Biology to English which is actually a communications degree. She now has an MBA and wears a t-shirt and shorts to work like I do. We both work at our kitchen table. Well, her table is in a million dollar neighborhood but whatever.

 

[cb7893]

Physics major > Marine ground (communications) > civilian transition > clandestine operations for an ABC agency > currently doing post-graduate work in international business at a foreign graduate school

Systems engineering > Marine air > language immersion and transition to foreign affairs officer > military attaché duty in foreign countries > civilian transition > Department of State

Political Science major > Marine ground (finance) > civilian transition > licensed financial advisor and regional vice-president of his firm

Quantitative Econ major > Marine air > civilian transition > fitness professional and personal coach

English major > Marine ground (logistics) > systems role with Fortune 500 tire company, now an executive in the quality control area

Here’s another example, still Active Duty:

Mechanical Engineering>Marine Ground (Infantry) >Army Special Forces

I would pick a major in which you have an interest

A good place to start would be your HS classes and extra-curriculars. What do you enjoy and where do you excell?

Your value to future civilian employers will be based, to a large extent, on your management experience. You will get that as a Junior Officer, regardless of major.

Best of luck!

 

[EEBTTF]

My DS was/is in a similar position. He is a 4c NROTC-MO studying Civil Engineering. His goal as an 18 year old it to make a career out of it, but things change. Yes it is a hard major, but its what he wants to do and will give him a solid career option if Plan A changes.

 

[Devil Doc]

Here’s another example, still Active Duty:

Mechanical Engineering>Marine Ground (Infantry) >Army Special Forces

Stud

 

[Capt MJ]

And here’s one of our truly unique ones:
Aero engineering > Navy air > Marine air > Air National Guard full-time

The Navy to Marine was serendipitous. He had just missed the cut for Navy jets in flight school and was headed to rotary wing. Marines needed a few more jet pipeline people and opened a tiny window for 13 Navy folks to cross-deck. After several years flying Harriers, with a growing family (5 kids) and multiple deployments, he left Marines and went straight into ANG in his hometown. A very unusual path. We joke he just has to refresh his helo tickets and somehow fly for CG and Army.

 

[cb7893]

My son is a product of Brown Field and is today considered the top combat engineer officer in the Corps (not his words). He majored in Conflict Analysis and Resolution and specializes in the Resolution part. You know how people say “officers don’t get to do the fun stuff, they just do paper work” or something like that? He teaches 19 year old infantrymen how to blow up stuff. With real explosives.

That's one way, the Marine Way, to resolve a conflict.

I guess it makes sense, since the Nobel Peace Prize was endowed by the inventor of dynamite.

 

[OldRetSWO]

I've known lots and lots of folks with real head-scratching variance between College major and Jobs.

Many Engineers and science folks who were commissioned and after the military became lawyers or finance (Wall St) folks.

Consider my path. USNA major was International Security Affairs (Political Science) and later, an MBA. Within the Navy, had several Advanced Missile Systems billets including teaching and managing some courses at the Naval Guided Missiles School. Hired as an Engineer by a little company named GE, promoted a few times, moved over as an Engineer to another lightweight company, Lockheed. Lots of other job titles with several in the Intel field. Served on a number of Government/Industry Study teams that helped define the way forward in Missile Defense and C4I/C5I.
Now teaching in the Humanities Dept at a University.

 

[tpaine7]

Great advice and responses from @Capt MJ and @Devil Doc. As a Marine Infantry Officer, let me try to add some color, perspective, and advice.

Picking a major when you are in high school is crazy. You don't know what you don't know. While I support the idea of finding something you enjoy and pursuing it, this is a tall task when you are sitting at home. Some universities (not many) have a "Freshman year of studies" that covers the general education courses allowing you to consider what major you would like to pursue starting your Sophomore year. I support that approach. Many students change their majors over time due to interests, future opportunity, grades, etc. Personally, I went from Chemical Engineering to Chemistry to Business.

Don't pick a major that you think will enhance your Marine career (or avoid those that you feel "will do you no good"). The Marine process of assigning Military Occupational Specialties (MOS) is not as straightforward as you may think. It is way too complex to explain here but in the end, your performance in school and TBS is only part of the equation. The needs of the Marine Corps is also a factor. Besides combat arms roles, the Marines need supply, finance, personnel, and lots of other support Officers. You can not predict or game the system to get the MOS you desire.

The Marines don't care what you major in. Why do you think that is the case? Jokes aside, I maintain it is because they seek someone who is capable of demonstrating a critical mind, logic, problem solving, etc. They want someone who can think. The USMC will teach you what you need to know to perform well. Would higher math and engineering classes help you understand the ballistics of artillery canon fire? Sure, but someone without this training will learn to put rounds on target. Would Finance help you understand the market and economy? Sure. But if you are assigned as the unit's Finance Officer, you will be trained by Uncle Sam to offer competent financial guidance to your Marines and help them dig out of debt regardless of your university degree.

Consider what you might do after the Marines. While the Marines don't care what your major is, the civilian world often does. If you think you might want a career in Engineering or Architecture, you may want to pursue an undergraduate degree in those areas. If you think you want a Finance role in business, you may want to go that route. Civilian leadership roles will be less concerned with your undergraduate degree and might value your military service more.

Bottom line: You HAVE to earn a degree and graduate to become a Marine Officer. Selecting a major you have interest in along with the aptitude to succeed in the classes is critical. If you are bored or overwhelmed and fail as a result you will not become a Marine Officer.

Hope that helps.

@Capt MJ @USMCGrunt @Devil Doc
Exactly what I was looking for. The major I intend to choose is more so a backup plan, but I would like to enjoy learning about said major. Aside from engineering, I have always found an interest in the medical field. While there's not much you can do within 4 years with a bachelors in (lets say) Kinesiology, it is something I've been considering. Perhaps after my time serving, I can continue on to med school/pursuing a masters degree in order to become a Physicians Assistant. Just an idea.
Appreciate the feedback.

 

[tpaine7]

Here’s another example, still Active Duty:

Mechanical Engineering>Marine Ground (Infantry) >Army Special Forces




A good place to start would be your HS classes and extra-curriculars. What do you enjoy and where do you excell?

Your value to future civilian employers will be based, to a large extent, on your management experience. You will get that as a Junior Officer, regardless of major.

Best of luck!

Have always participated in Athletics, all 4 years and then some - I'm very active. I always enjoyed history, especially military history; however, that is not a major my university offers. Not to mention, it isn't the greatest backup plan. I did enjoy my medical terminology and health courses. Majoring in Finance would be a risky decision, as I have 0 experience in that field, nor do I know if I'm fully interested in it. More research ahead!

 

[MidCakePa]

Examples of former officers I’ve worked with in the corporate world.

Political science at WP -> Airborne -> top-5 MBA -> consumer-goods marketing executive.

Economics at WP -> Armor -> top-5 MBA -> founder of tech services company.

Engineering at USNA -> nuke subs -> top-5 MBA -> consumer-goods CFO.

Political science at USNA -> NFO -> top-20 MBA -> author and consultant on leadership in business.

The common denominator among all four: great leadership skills, big team players, highly analytical, strong problem solvers

 

[NavyHoops]

I am a USNA grad and was a USMC Officer. I have a BS in History. I also have 3 Masters Degrees; MS, MA, and MBA. I work in tech now and more than anything (like mentioned above), I get paid to lead teams, solve problems and make decisions. Am I a tech person? Not really, though I sort of fake it. I can learn things quickly and take in massive amounts of data (thank goodness for Plebe Year).

I had never set a timeline for myself as to a career Marine or 5 and dive. I think if you asked most of my friends from USNA most would of voted me most likely to spend a career. Well... I was 5 and dive. A big part of it was I hated my MOS. The parts of my job I enjoyed the most had nothing to do with my MOS. Do the major that interests you as that is what you will do best in. Also, remember there are no guarantees in life. What if you hate ROTC? What if you get hurt and can't commission? What if you don't get infantry? What if you get Ground Supply and are sent to the Air Wing (gasp)? These items are all realistic and can happen. There is no metric to say this person will serve 5 or this person who will be a lifer. Thinking about things at 17-18 and making decisions in your 20s with a spouse and possibly kids is a different story.

Another thing to ponder... as much as everyone has stated that your degree doesn't matter, they are correct and I won't say not correct, but there are some considerations. For your commission and MOS (with a minor exception in things like law and cyber) it does not matter. But it can matter later in your career. It can impact your follow on degree, future assignments, etc. Well there has to be officers who design, develop and test future equipment. There are plenty of infantry officers who are at Quantico and the Pentagon who are fielding the next generation of rifles, pistols, field equipment, etc. They need smart capable officers who can take work with vendors, the fleet, and all the different organizations that need to work together to make those new technologies come to life with the lowest bidder! Sure, this might not sound like something a future grunt wants to do, but these are important jobs. In many ways, they are some of the most important jobs out there. Working on the next generation of body armor is a really important job. It could impact what every Marine wears in the future. Also if you make it a career, it can drive what you study for a graduate degree. They don't send every Marine Captain to NPS to get an MBA. Actually very few get to study an MBA (most were loggies).

The bottom line is every military member starts as a Civilian and will eventually return to one. It can either be 5 years after graduating or possibly 30 years. There are so many variables that exist to get to that point that you need to really look at things from different perspectives and ultimately you will make an informed decision that is right for you.

 

[Devil Doc]

@Capt MJ @USMCGrunt @Devil Doc
Exactly what I was looking for. The major I intend to choose is more so a backup plan, but I would like to enjoy learning about said major. Aside from engineering, I have always found an interest in the medical field. While there's not much you can do within 4 years with a bachelors in (lets say) Kinesiology, it is something I've been considering. Perhaps after my time serving, I can continue on to med school/pursuing a masters degree in order to become a Physicians Assistant. Just an idea.
Appreciate the feedback.

PA is a great career and one which several of my high school students are showing an interest. Several occupations these days require a masters as entry level or a doctorate even for things like pharmacist or physical therapist. I know you know it is too early to know for sure "I am looking to make a career out of it" and it sounds like you are thinking beyond life in the military. Before my son decided for sure he would be staying in, he said he wanted to get into international relations and diplomacy type stuff. Now his dream is to retire debt free, live at the beach and surf, get neck and face tattoos, and smoke weed. He might have been joking about the weed part.

Oh, one other thing. You wrote "pursuing a masters to become a Physician Assistant." PA is a masters level program. You can get in with your bachelors but make sure you have the pre-requisites for the particular college and very importantly, almost all healthcare occupations these days require some form of medical experience. It doesn't have to be a job but something like an internship or volunteer experience would work.

 

[kinnem]

I'm scratching my head wondering how you decide on a school before you have some idea of what you want to major in... but apparently that's just me.

 

[Humey]

First of all you have no idea how long you will serve. There all types of stories about people who went in wanting to retire in the military and then leave after 4-5 years. Then you have people who plan on doing 4 years and then do their full 20 or more. I would say for the most part, major in something you like and something you can use if and when you retire from the military. I will also add to major you will do well in. I mean if you cant add 2+2 and want to be an engineer, you are going to have major problems. Even if you do a full 20 years, that still means you will retire around 45. That is still young. Take for example, the AF, they love STEM majors, and yet you can still be a pilot even with a degree in history. Do what makes you happy especially when the Marines dont care what you major in.

 

[tpaine7]

I'm scratching my head wondering how you decide on a school before you have some idea of what you want to major in... but apparently that's just me.

The university I wish to attend has a well respected NROTC unit and a fine business and engineering program. Not to mention, the location, general/personal history, and the atmosphere I’ve observed while visiting. Will still be applying to others I have interest in.

 

[tpaine7]

First of all you have no idea how long you will serve. There all types of stories about people who went in wanting to retire in the military and then leave after 4-5 years. Then you have people who plan on doing 4 years and then do their full 20 or more. I would say for the most part, major in something you like and something you can use if and when you retire from the military. I will also add to major you will do well in. I mean if you cant add 2+2 and want to be an engineer, you are going to have major problems. Even if you do a full 20 years, that still means you will retire around 45. That is still young. Take for example, the AF, they love STEM majors, and yet you can still be a pilot even with a degree in history. Do what makes you happy especially when the Marines dont care what you major in.

Which I will take into consideration as I start my military service. Assuming I go on for around 20 years and get out around 45 I will be seeking a job where I can continue to use the skills I was given as a Marine, not so much an undergraduate bachelors degree. That being said if I make the decision to get out after 4-5 years I will want to have a plan, even if it doesn't survive first contact. Either way I will most likely return to school to pursue a masters degree, while being a current or former officer. Anyways, appreciate the reply.