Congratulations air force !!!!

AF kicked had yards to spare in his kick, certainly could have tacked on 10 more and been fine (and it was raining harder when AF had the ball...). And yes, Navy outscored Air Force 25-7 in the second half, however over half of that was in the FINAL 4 minutes of the game. So the other 16 minutes involved Navy outscored Air Force 10 to 7. Hardly domination.

Correct me if I'm wrong Mongo, but that point after wasn't the first kick the Navy kicker missed that day either.... what was the distance of the missed field goal?


Navy had issues with controlling themselves throughout the game, and it was obvious (not just to the refs).
 
Calls for the home team?? For Independents, the visiting team brings the referees. AF brought the Big 12. It almost seems they were courting each other. I never saw one call go Navy's way all day. We probably lost 20 yds of rushing to ball spotting alone.

Sports Illustrated had an article a year or so ago about refs siding more often with the home team than away. Broke it down by sport and league. It's about fan reaction, not the players, but they side with the home team more often than away, and I can think of a number of calls that went Navy's way. I also remember Navy's lack of control.
 
I also remember Navy's lack of control.
Yep. Me too. Taunting, pushing, and shoving the entire game. From both sides. Did we see the instigation or the retaliation? Unless we heard the entire exchange, we don't know. And we won't. My position from the very beginning. Why did the officials decide to wait to clean it up five minutes into overtime?
 
Navy had more first downs, 31 compared to 19. Passing was exactly the same. Navy had over 100 more yards of rushing offense. Both sides scored exactly 28 points. How did AF do more?? And yes, ball control is the basis of Navy's game plans.

I assume you do know basic math. If passing was the same. And navy had 100 more yards than air force. And both sides scored 28 points. And Navy had control of the ball for 41 minutes against air force's 19 minutes. Then OBVIOUSLY Air Force did MORE with their 19 minutes than navy did with 41 minutes. It's pretty basic math.

As for the game; I'm simply saying that you can't say that the game was decided on 1 isolated call against navy in overtime. If you believe that way, then you're obviously reacting as a fan, and not as someone that knows anything about football or sports.

If navy had made their short field goal in the first half; we wouldn't be having this discussion. They would have won in regulation time. If the navy defense had not been so confused in the 1st half, the air force team wouldn't have had an 18 point lead at half time, and navy would have won in regulation time. On the other hand; if the ref hadn't gotten excited and blown the whistle during a fumble that air force recovered, but instead had to replay the down; air force was on the navy 30 and probably would have scored again that close; even a field goal, and navy wouldn't have ever tied. There are dozens of plays in yesterday's game that had any one of them happened could have changed the dynamics of the game. THAT IS WHY YOU PLAY 60 MINUTES. Rarely if ever is a sporting even such as football EVER relegated to being decided by 1 individual call. That's just an excuse for saying that you didn't play very well the rest of the game.

Bottom line: Doesn't matter what all the stats or reports say about a game. What matters is the final score. Not only did Navy mess up a "ROUTINE" field goal (Extra Point) from 35 yards; "ball on the 18, 7 more for the snap, 10 more for the endzone"; more importantly, that wasn't the end of the game. They also didn't stop air force when they had the ball. In a matter of 4 plays, air force scored, hit the extra point, and won. No, don't ever blame the final score of a game on 1 play or 1 call. It only shows that you're speaking with emotion as a fan; and not as someone who really knows the game and can look at it objectively. Navy lost this game in the first 3 quarters. Air Force ALMOST lost this game in 1 quarter. But at the end of the day; Air Force scored more points and did more things right. And next year, we will do this all over again. Why? Because that's why we play the game.
 
As for the game; I'm simply saying that you can't say that the game was decided on 1 isolated call against navy in overtime. If you believe that way, then you're obviously reacting as a fan, and not as someone that knows anything about football or sports.
There you go again. Making wild speculations based on no facts. And you are just repeating yourself.

Bottom line. Both teams did something right to get to 28-28 at the end of regulation. Taunting, pushing, and shoving by both sides was ignored until 5 minutes into overtime when the officials suddenly took notice. It should have been called way earlier or not at all. A s**tty way to end a ball game. For both teams. Just my opinion.
 
There you go again. Making wild speculations based on no facts. And you are just repeating yourself.

Bottom line. Both teams did something right to get to 28-28 at the end of regulation. Taunting, pushing, and shoving by both sides was ignored until 5 minutes into overtime when the officials suddenly took notice. It should have been called way earlier or not at all. A s**tty way to end a ball game. For both teams. Just my opinion.

Yup. Just your opinion. That's cool. It's a game. We can all have our opinions.
 
Go Air Force!

This is why you play to win the game. Plane and simple. Air Force won, Navy lost. That's all that matters in the end. (Gotta love sports talk though, its why ESPN, etc, are around to analyze the game :thumb:) Good game!
 
If Navy stopped AF on their possession, they win.

Watch the AF/Army game this year. There will be pushing, shoving, and taunting by both sides just like the Navy/AF game. Then watch the Army/Navy game and I will almost guarantee you that there will not be any. What is the common denominator in the games where unsportsmanlike conduct runs rampant? It's not Army and Navy... Navy had more first downs, 31 compared to 19. Passing was exactly the same. Navy had over 100 more yards of rushing offense...

I hope you are not seriously suggesting that the Air Force academy are a bunch of thugs. It is one thing to lose a football game, it is quite another to lose your perspective. I was there, I saw a pretty intensely played game, at a historic stadium filled with some of the finest young people I have ever had the pleasure to be around. A 15 yard penalty should not have decided the game (A 25 yard extra point is not undoable and should not have forced the kicker to change the angle of his kick), and it did not. A blocked kick setup the possibility of a victory, Navy could still have ended the contest by stopping Air Force on their possession. The fact the Air Force was able to score during overtime is what ultimately decided the contest, not the referree's call.

As for the stats? A very famous son of a USNA football coach has a saying that "stats are for losers", I am talking about none other than Bill Belichick, whose dad is buried on Annapolis grounds. I'm not calling Navy losers - they are a very good team, but stats don't mean much when you lose the game.

The call in overtime was over the top by an overzealous referee. It was unfortunate and both sides should have been permitted to play on without referee controversy.
Like said earlier - it was a terrific game save for a nasty call at the end.

I second what Bullet said, Proctor played a monster game, but I have no idea what he thought he was doing when he ran around the line of scrimmage after the scoring play, chest bumped the Air Force player from behind, and then got in his face. I cannot imagine any ref simply letting that one go. The rule is in the books for a reason and as I stated above, it really did not decide the contest.
 
As for the stats? A very famous son of a USNA football coach has a saying that "stats are for losers", I am talking about none other than Bill Belichick, whose dad is buried on Annapolis grounds.
Since he was fined the biggest fine ever in the NFL for cheating, he obviously thinks rules are for losers also.
 
Since he was fined the biggest fine ever in the NFL for cheating, he obviously thinks rules are for losers also.

Wow, not sure we should go there. If you have not done so, you should watch the NFL Special they did on him, "Bill Belichick - A Football Life". It might give you more perspective on what you just said.

But since you brought it up, have you noticed that Goodell has not handled similar problems the same way since? I think he may have come to realize that his approach to the Patriots hurt the game more than it helped. Look at what happened susequently with the Jets sideline shinanigans and the Bronco's, Goodell did nothing publically and it was handled internally.
 
It's nice to hear all of the belly-aching. USNA wasn't serving whine with their cheese at the tailgates on game day, but luckily Mongo brought more than enough to go around now! :wink:
 
Reporters from CBS, NBC, USA Today, ESPN, and local TV stations and newspapers, both in the DC area and in Colorado, and other sources all called it a controversial call. I agree with them. I was still disappointed that both the players and coaches used it as an excuse for losing. However, I am supposed to be a curmudgeon.

@falconfamily. Teams under Fisher DeBerry were notorious for their lack of sportmanship.
 
Fisher DeBerry's teams won the Commander's-in-Chief's Trophy FOURTEEN times in 21 seasons. I think that is what his teams were "notorious" for...
 
Please people....you are missing the point. The PAT was blocked, it didn't matter if it was kicked from 15 yards or 30 yards, a blocked kick is a blocked kick. The referee didn't block the kick or try to block the rushers on the AF line. Simply put, Navy didn't execute on the final detail and it cost them the game.
 
Folks...

Taking off my ALO hat and putting on my Moderator hat here.

I think we've gone far enough with this. This forum is about the Air Force Academy; it's not about "who did what, didn't do what, what was or wasn't called" in a football game.

The game was played; the two teams gave their all. Good and bad occurs in a game; that's what happens. Many folks are not completely happy with the results; isn't that normal in sports? We're getting too close to "nit picking" in a "personal" fashion and that's NOT the purpose of this forum.

The game is over, next weekend Air Force visits South Bend and Notre Dame and Navy hosts Southern Miss. BOTH games look to be battles. And so we move on.

How about we do that here too?

Steve
USAFA ALO
USAFA '83
 
Please people....you are missing the point. The PAT was blocked, it didn't matter if it was kicked from 15 yards or 30 yards, a blocked kick is a blocked kick. The referee didn't block the kick or try to block the rushers on the AF line. Simply put, Navy didn't execute on the final detail and it cost them the game.
Distance does matter. A lot. A short field goal is called a chip shot for a reason. To continue the golf analogy, the further out the field goal, the lower the required trajectory. Add the winds at that end of the stadium and the kicker's need to keep the ball below these winds and it was a recipe for disaster. The call hurt.
 
With respect to Flieger, this will be the last on this. Trajectory on a 50 yarder, yes much lower. Trajectory on a 35 yarder isn't any different than a 20 yarder...it was blocked by either the kick being too low or a bull rush. The devil is in the details, let down and it will cost you as Navy will tell you. The distance made no difference since it was blocked. If it was wide right or left, yes, then you can say it made a difference. Agree to disagree
 
Distance does matter. A lot. A short field goal is called a chip shot for a reason. To continue the golf analogy, the further out the field goal, the lower the required trajectory. Add the winds at that end of the stadium and the kicker's need to keep the ball below these winds and it was a recipe for disaster. The call hurt.

Give him 10 more yards he STILL WOULD NOT HAVE MADE IT.....off center and too low....also not the first kick he missed that game. Mongo, are you sure you aren't a SWO?
 
With respect to Flieger, this will be the last on this. Trajectory on a 50 yarder, yes much lower. Trajectory on a 35 yarder isn't any different than a 20 yarder...it was blocked by either the kick being too low or a bull rush. The devil is in the details, let down and it will cost you as Navy will tell you. The distance made no difference since it was blocked. If it was wide right or left, yes, then you can say it made a difference. Agree to disagree
Hi Bobbigboy, it was actually shorter than reported. It was 25 yards (3 yards + 15 yard penalty + 7 yards set back). So as is has been stated numerous times, the distance should not have affected the kicker. That said, Navy had the chance to end the game defensively. It was a well played game, as exciting as it could get, I'm glad I got a chance to be there.
 
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