Continuing to date enlisted soldier after appointment

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by UHBlackhawk, Sep 20, 2018.

  1. UHBlackhawk

    UHBlackhawk Member

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    I swore I'd never come on this website again.

    Prior service DD was dating a fellow soldier prior to her appointment to West Point.

    He has subsequently become an NCO.

    They are still dating.

    He is not based at West Point.

    His current commander refuses to let him take a pass or leave to visit her as he says the relationship violates regulations. However, what I read in AR 600-20 is:

    "4–14. Relationships between Soldiers of different grade.

    ...

    (2) Dating, shared living accommodations other than those directed by operational requirements, and intimate or sexual relationships between officers and enlisted personnel, or NCOs and junior enlisted Soldiers. This prohibition does not apply to the following:

    ...
    (b) Situations in which a relationship that complies with this policy would move into noncompliance due to a change in status of one of the members (for instance, a case where two junior enlisted members are dating and one is subsequently commissioned or selected to be a WO, commissioned officer, or NCO). In relationships where one of the enlisted members has entered into a program intended to result in a change in his or her status from enlisted to officer or junior enlisted Soldier to NCO, the couple must terminate the relationship permanently or marry within one year of the date of the appointment or the change in status occurs."

    So the way I read this they can continue dating until one year after DD is commissioned.

    Thoughts?
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2018
  2. NavyHoops

    NavyHoops Super Moderator 5-Year Member

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    There are so many gray areas in this one. Her best bet to be honest, to ensure she and he are covered, both go visit a JAG at each base and get council to ensure they hear it from someone who deals in this and then they can decide what is best.
     
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  3. kp2001

    kp2001 10-Year Member

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    Agree with NavyHoops, but I read that to mean they have a year from Appointment into the Commissioning program to either marry or terminate the relationship.
     
  4. UHBlackhawk

    UHBlackhawk Member

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    Says a year from the change in status, not entering the program that will result in a change of status. A Service Academy Cadet cannot marry.
     
  5. Capt MJ

    Capt MJ 10-Year Member

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    These are always difficult situations, where the human heart clashes with the regs.

    You may also want to research any applicable USMA regs on cadet fraternization and prohibited relationships.

    In USNA MidRegs, there is specific detail on midshipmen and their relationships. As I recall (had to research it a few months ago), midshipmen may not fraternize with enlisted personnel regardless of any previous existing relationship.

    I am inexpert on researching Army refs, but a quick look found:

    https://www.usma.edu/sharp/Shared D...ropriate Relationships and Fraternization.pdf

    And,

    Page 9, 2012 SOP, there may be a newer one. This looks like the counterpart to MidRegs.

    https://www.usma.edu/dfl/SiteAssets/SitePages/Summer Faculty Workshop/USCC SOP 2012.pdf


    Because of the slight weirdness of the cadet/midshipman rank in that limbo land between enlisted and commissioned officer, they get specific guidance on their prohibited relationships.
     
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  6. UHBlackhawk

    UHBlackhawk Member

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    These deal with Cadets and staff assigned to West Point and MAPS Cadets, which doesn’t surprise me.
    I am surprised that Cadets can submit a written request to their TAC for an exception to this policy.
     
  7. Capt MJ

    Capt MJ 10-Year Member

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    I’ll be interested to see how the regs shake out in this.
     
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  8. USMCGrunt

    USMCGrunt 5-Year Member

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    Navy Hoops had a great idea speaking to a JAG. CaptMJ suggests a thorough read of the regs but often there are just enough grey areas (or conflicts)to make that a difficult task. Often, precedence provides the direction in those cases but not always.

    Just a thought... would a Chaplain be able to provide advice on matters like this?
     
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  9. UHBlackhawk

    UHBlackhawk Member

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    He is going to talk to Senior Defense Council at his installation next week. She already discussed it with JAG here before and they didn’t see problems with the relationship.
    I’ll admit I even though it would be looked at as an improper relationship until I read the actual regulation.
     
  10. 1mom

    1mom Member

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    Affairs of the heart may be a super stressor for a Plebe. I wonder if the young man would consider putting his own application in for WP.
     
  11. UHBlackhawk

    UHBlackhawk Member

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    He considered, but he had a very short window due to his age. He is considering a different commissioning program, however.

    She had no intention of "getting" a boyfriend right before going to West Point. And truthfully, we weren't thrilled about her having a boyfriend. However, he was and has been very supportive of her going this route. They lasted through her Plebe year. We shall see.
     
  12. 1mom

    1mom Member

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    Hope everything will turn out for the best. Congrats to your DD on her appointment.
     
  13. UHBlackhawk

    UHBlackhawk Member

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    We'll see how this goes. We try to be neutral. Frankly, I think this is the first time we've been involved with helping "What's his name".
     
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