Decision Help For 2028 Appointee

A

Av8tr70

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Mar 28, 2024
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Hi All!

Parent of DS class of 2028. Went to recent overnight, now between academy and State U. Want to know some thoughts from other parents, alum, and such as he is still undecided. He wants engineer degree, comes from a private school, and wanted to put his thoughts and get feedback:

1. Likes the structure, much like his school. Doesn’t seem to be an issue.
2. Academically don’t think he would have issue, was with a deck so did not get to see engineer. Commented about attending physics class that he’s learned the same stuff already..
3. Plebes say it sucks first year..some came bay and said don’t come here..others who said it sucked said it is worth it.
4. Size of school same as his school.
5. Likes going to the city for sure.
6. Likes sea year option.

So here are the questions:
1. I understand that all academy plebe years suck..all over forums. Anyone have wisdom here on best way to help approach this?
2. Only 2 degrees, but tracking engineer. Told by plebes they are always busy. He wants to fly anyway, I know techs are preferred once selection is made..does engineering degree really any different than other college (mechanical?)
3. Told that AF wants you to commit to the before sea year..any truth to that?
4. Obviously lots of mids are successful..any of them have said academics are not that bad? Do they enjoy lab time more? My DS thrives on labs and hands on stuff..great at math and science (never below A’s in HS).

Overall, he feels he could go there but still not completely there because of AFROTC track vs MMA. Feels like restricted to marine only, likes boats but we take cruises!

I want him to make the best informed decision. Plebes are somewhat in the know, but he still has some questions. He met senior staff (plebe seemed shocked I found her with new asst super and commandant). BTW she is super, talked to him, all shook his hand and congratulated him.

Thanks to all.
 
1 is universally true at any service academy. Everyone will struggle at something and apathy is infectious. Being prepared physically and academically will help but there will be dark, lonely and depressively long weeks. The hardest part is when they realize how the SAs and many of those that get in fail to meet their expectations. That being said…the only thing harder than Plebe year is being the parent of a Plebe.

2. At a state school an accredited engjneering degree is 4-5 years. At KP the only accredited engineering degree is Maritime Systems and is a brutal to get it done in 3 years. If he wants to be an engineer and have a top level education than KP is meh at best.

3. USAF does want commitment during plebe year and watches them like Big Brother the entire time at KP. Navy pilots are better anyway but don’t tell Chaggy.

4. The engines side of the house is very hands on. Tearing down marine equipment etc and sea year really is the best OJT. I have two siblings that got 3.8 GPAs at KP and have leveraged their degrees into the aerospace industry and doing quite well.
 
Grad here. When you graduate from KP you have the following options.

1. You're automatically an Ensign USNR so you canchoose to activate your USNR commission and enter the Navy in one of the following Surface Warfare, Aviation, Submarines, Supply, Intelligence. Your obligation gets shortened to 5 yrs with exception to Aviation which is 8 yrs from completion of flight instruction.

2. Cross commission into the other services on active duty for 5 yrs. If he wants to fly the great thing is 67% of the class decide to work in the private sector so the billets for flight school either with the Navy, Air Force or Coast Guard often go unfilled and less competitive compared to coming out of the other academies. AFA coworker of mine missed out on flight school so the AF sent him to some AFB in the middle of Montana babysitting missile silos. Needless to say his AF career didn't go beyond 5 yrs.

3. Work in the maritime industry and serve in the USNR drilling 2 weeks/yr for 8 yrs. ie shipyards, shoreside employment with shipping companies, marine insurance companies, ocean logistics companies.

4.Grad school or Law School.

5 Sail on your license and do your 2 weeks/yr USNR duty. You may be granted a waiver if your sailing schedule conflicts with scheduling USNR drill schedule. BTW the current rate for a 3rd mate 3rd Engineer is $120-160k. Low end being with MSC and higher end with Union contracted shipping lines. Captain's and Chief Engineers are at $250K plus. Alot of grads use this path to pay for grad school or law school to avoid student debt. Also not unheard of for a grad to sock away that large payday and be independently wealthy in their early 30's. In essence we're the highest paid grads of all the academies right out of the gate.

The engineering degree is a BS in Marine Engineering. It's mechanical engineering with emphasis on ships propulsion and engineering systems. The part that makes Kings Point Engineers unique is our curriculum actually teaches us how to be mechanics, electricians, plumbers, welders, HVAC techs and metal fabricators rolled into one as the engineers on commercial ships need to be proficient in those specific trades. A ship is basically a floating city and the engineers are its Public Works Department. The engineering degree makes it easier to transition shoreside as we can come to work at powerplants, engineering firms, shipyards and defense contractors.

Pretty awesome in terms of choices after graduation and none wrong or bad.

Our alumni is very tight. I'm retired now but if I wanted a job, I could pick up the phone and probably have one tomorrow. If one of us was stuck or stranded in an unfamiliar port in between ships, mid or grad, we could just post our predicament on the FB alumni page and be rescued in no time and have a place to couch surf until we got settled in aboard our next ship. KP'ers look out for eachother. Definitely a family. Or Ohana like we say here in Hawaii.

Anyway! Aloha and good luck at the Zoo if thats what he chooses. Definitely won't regret it.
 
KPEngnr90 said:
The engineering degree is a BS in Marine Engineering. It's mechanical engineering with emphasis on ships propulsion and engineering systems. The part that makes Kings Point Engineers unique is our curriculum actually teaches us how to be mechanics, electricians, plumbers, welders, HVAC techs and metal fabricators rolled into one as the engineers on commercial ships need to be proficient in those specific trades. A ship is basically a floating city and the engineers are its Public Works Department. The engineering degree makes it easier to transition shoreside as we can come to work at powerplants, engineering firms, shipyards and defense contractors.
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As an engineering grad (1965), after doing my seagoing requirement, I transitioned into a shoreside job for one of the largest and most respected gear manufacturers in the world. I later moved into a career in rotor dynamics. I would agree with the above comment by KPEngnr90. When I went to grad school I came up short in that I had to take a course in Differential Equations, otherwise I was full accepted into a MS Mechanical Engineering program. A few years later I took the Engineering Fundamentals Examination and later the examination to be a Registered Professional Engineer. At no time did I feel that attending KP was a detriment to my progress.
 
Av8tr70 said:
Hi All!

Parent of DS class of 2028. Went to recent overnight, now between academy and State U. Want to know some thoughts from other parents, alum, and such as he is still undecided. He wants engineer degree, comes from a private school, and wanted to put his thoughts and get feedback:

1. Likes the structure, much like his school. Doesn’t seem to be an issue.
2. Academically don’t think he would have issue, was with a deck so did not get to see engineer. Commented about attending physics class that he’s learned the same stuff already..
3. Plebes say it sucks first year..some came bay and said don’t come here..others who said it sucked said it is worth it.
4. Size of school same as his school.
5. Likes going to the city for sure.
6. Likes sea year option.

So here are the questions:
1. I understand that all academy plebe years suck..all over forums. Anyone have wisdom here on best way to help approach this?
2. Only 2 degrees, but tracking engineer. Told by plebes they are always busy. He wants to fly anyway, I know techs are preferred once selection is made..does engineering degree really any different than other college (mechanical?)
3. Told that AF wants you to commit to the before sea year..any truth to that?
4. Obviously lots of mids are successful..any of them have said academics are not that bad? Do they enjoy lab time more? My DS thrives on labs and hands on stuff..great at math and science (never below A’s in HS).

Overall, he feels he could go there but still not completely there because of AFROTC track vs MMA. Feels like restricted to marine only, likes boats but we take cruises!

I want him to make the best informed decision. Plebes are somewhat in the know, but he still has some questions. He met senior staff (plebe seemed shocked I found her with new asst super and commandant). BTW she is super, talked to him, all shook his hand and congratulated him.

Thanks to all.
Click to expand...
I recommend that your son accept the AFROTC scholarship if he is set on an Air Force commission and attends State University to major in a field he is interested.

I promise he will be much happier and fulfilled, especially if he is not sold on marine transportation or engineering at Kings Point.

It can be a long three years at school and one year at sea before he realizes that he is not interested in what he is studying and will never use what he learned, wishing he attended State school majoring in a field he at least had an interest.
 
tankercaptain said:
I recommend that your son accept the AFROTC scholarship if he is set on an Air Force commission and attends State University to major in a field he is interested.

I promise he will be much happier and fulfilled, especially if he is not sold on marine transportation or engineering at Kings Point.

It can be a long three years at school and one year at sea before he realizes that he is not interested in what he is studying and will never use what he learned, wishing he attended State school majoring in a field he at least had an interest.
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He does not have the AF scholarship. If he did I agree with that..right now he would have to apply for in school scholarship..
 
Av8tr70 said:
So here are the questions:
1. I understand that all academy plebe years suck..all over forums. Anyone have wisdom here on best way to help approach this?
2. Only 2 degrees, but tracking engineer. Told by plebes they are always busy. He wants to fly anyway, I know techs are preferred once selection is made..does engineering degree really any different than other college (mechanical?)
3. Told that AF wants you to commit to the before sea year..any truth to that?
4. Obviously lots of mids are successful..any of them have said academics are not that bad? Do they enjoy lab time more? My DS thrives on labs and hands on stuff..great at math and science (never below A’s in HS).
Click to expand...
1. Focus on GPA plebe year, having a bit of a pad to fall back on in case of a bad trimester later is helpful. Go low-profile. Don't try to stand out plebe year. It offers you nothing in terms of achieving your post-grad goals and only invites additional stressors. Minimize extra-curriculars but have at least one that gets you out of the regiment and provides an escape from plebe stuff.

2. I would first clarify directly from AF rep at KP that "techs are preferred" and if that means Engine majors are preferred over Deck majors. They may be referring to a BS over a BA but keep in mind even the deck majors at KP earn a BS (insert deckie joke here). Marine Engineering Systems is ABET accredited so if DS wanted to do anything non-maritime engineering related later that may be a good option.

4. Engine is definitely more hands on than Deck. HS grades/intellectual ability matters less than time management skills. I saw more than one straight A, perfect SAT/ACT score people fail out before Christmas. Don't be scared but expect to have to study a lot even in areas one has an exceptional previous record in.

I would also second tankercaptain. If DS just wants to fly AF, KP may not be worth the suck if the same can achieved elsewhere.
 
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