High School Scheduling Drama

Sciencnerd

Sciencnerd

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In high school, I want to do marching band. However, as an eighth grader, I get to see what marching band is like on multiple experiences, and some of the high schoolers come by the school to help us with stuff. I'm starting to realize how big of a time commitment it might be. Because while I want to do marching band, I also want to do cross country, JROTC, RISE program, advanced classes, BJJ, etc. So right now I'm a bit frustrated and a bit confused. Has anyone been in a similar situation, or have a DS/DD that was? All advice is welcome. Thanks.
 
Sounds like what my kids were (are) faced with in HS. You need to decide what is important to you, improve time-management, talk to teachers/coaches about time conflicts. Look ahead in the calendar - would band competitions conflict with big events in JROTC, etc.? You might think you can handle the load, but when it comes to championships/competitions, you cannot clone yourself.

The stress of HS classes and other time commitments can be overwhelming. Choose wisely.
 
I was -

I am both a saxophone player (my first passion) and a tennis player. I wanted to do Marching band, jazz band, wind ensemble, all honors/AP classes, national honors society, have a class leadership position, JROTC, the tennis team PLUS regularly play regional and national tennis tournaments that had me out of the area pretty much every other weekend and often whole weeks at a time (lots of missed class).

I got close....

I managed to do:
Marching band (10-12 grade, not freshman year) - but I played in the pit and missed half of the rehearsals so I could play more tennis. This is why I didn't play freshman year, that director was not ok with that particular arrangement and so I chose tennis over MB
Wind Ensemble (concert band - I had to give up jazz band)
Almost all the AP classes offered including calculus (I made some tough choices here to support my tennis-namely taking some easier dual enrollment credits instead of a couple AP classes known for eating up massive amounts of time)
High school tennis + Competitive junior tennis w/a pretty good ranking that led to playing at USAFA
CAP (not JROTC, but comparable with a much more manageable time commitment- chosen for that reason) and made it to Mitchell in 2 yrs
National Honor's Society (small time commitment and easy to fit in)

The key here is evaluating the trade space between the activity and how much you really want to do it and the time commitment. In my case, my freshman year marching band would have made competitive tennis impossible and I would have had to give up tournaments and my training schedule (about 3hrs/day). That was not a trade I was willing to make.

Similarly, AP Art History and AP Lit were well known as some of the most challenging classes - I decided not to take either and focus on calculus because I knew I wouldn't have enough time. I took a college writing class instead - much easier.

CAP was a great compromise for JROTC because the time was way more flexible. I could only attend the weekly meetings when my schedule was nuts, but then get more involved over the summers when I had more time.

In short-it all comes down to deciding what you care most about and making some tough choices based on those priorities. I do the same thing now on active duty trying to balance an INSANE workload from my job with what I like to do for fun (play and coach tennis). I gave up coaching this year to focus on my career - I love coaching, but when weighed against a job I am 1000% committed to and my own time to PLAY tennis, it wasn't a contest.
 
My son was VP for his 300 member marching band, and was a league and district champion for his XC team, along with being a 3 year captain. He made it work, but was very busy. Fortunately the coaches and band director were willing to work together. Obviously he couldn't be at two places at once.

There were many students in his class who took on many leadership positions, to the point that it was obvious they were resume-loading. There was no possible way for them to give the proper commitment to all the groups where they took leadership roles. Keep that in mind. You want to keep busy, especially in activities you are passionate about, but you need to be realistic, too. There are only 24 hours in each day. And remember, grades need to come first.
 
I will say depends on teachers and coach's plus your time mana skills. At my school my friend was marching band, varsity cross country, and Jrotc along with 4 AP classes and he finished top of the class. I personally did AP, Varsity Cross country and track, Jrotc, NHS, Book Club and BJJ all at once my senior year. I was able to do this as I always communicated with my coaches and teachers when I would be late and when I was late worked very hard if I had to miss something.

Take a look at when everything meets. Coaches are much more likely to work with you if you aren't missing hard days ( Monday and Wednesday for me cross country/ track) I knew this and had NHS on Tuesday, Book Club on Thursday. My JROTC meetings in the morning. AP studying right after practice and BJJ at night ( 6-8pm Monday- Thurs). Over here marching band was always right after sports practice so that's where my friend went every single day till 9:30 at night.

Talk to your coaches, look at schedules and make a plan. I didn't do things just for the academy, because of this I had motivation for each thing I did. It also allowed me to decide what mattered more to me. Always school first but normally sports at a close second and JROTC at a really close third. Because of this, I love high school and planned in rest days (book club) because again, I was doing this for me no one else.

Best of luck and if you feel overwhelmed ask for help. People want to help you.
 
Great to hear you're planning in 8th grade.

First of all, while USAFA might put some weight on Marching Band, it's not a sport (at least where I live). Golf is a sport, and marching band is not - I know, I asked that question many times. Also, Marching Band does not allow for you missing practices, as you leave a hole in a formation that screws everything else up. Bottom line - during Marching Band season, you have nothing else to do. Additionally, most MB members also had band as a class, and were strongly encouraged to join Pep Band (a half dozen or so musicians at every sports games, cheering them on)

A typical rotation of activities (in my DS experience) was Marching Band in the late summer and fall. Swim team over winter, and one of cross country, golf, or tennis in the spring. Note that all of these are individual sports, rather than team sports (and I think I've read the academies want to see a team sport. Are you good enough to make your baseball/softball team in the spring? You might want to work on it to get a true team sport under your belt.

Now your BJJ isn't a recognized sport in our school system, but should serve you well should you take up wrestling (again, an individual sport versus team).

Let's complicate things with JROTC. DS was told as a rising freshman, there was no extracurricular time required, but guess what? To advance well in JROTC, he needed to do Raiders or Drill (much extracurricular time, and with drill, you can't miss practice for the same reason as Marching Band).

Next is your community involvement. You don't mention Boy/Girl Scouts, girl Boy Scouts, 4-H, AHG or church youth group (actually out doing things).

The point being, yeah, you need to map out the seasons and pick your schedules carefully.
 
My DD did marching band all 4 years along with being a club swimmer and high school swim. Very busy but very fun.
 
I joined marching band my senior year, and it's one of my favorite extracurriculars. However, it is a big time commitment with practices and competitions. If you stick with it, you can advance to drum major which is a significant leadership position. Like OldAFRet said, each person has a specific dot in their drill which others rely on you to remember their dots. If a person is missing, there is a high risk that the majority of the band will be thrown off because of the hole. Then again, you create a bond with your band members that'll last. I wish I would've joined my freshman year as it is an enjoyable experience for you and your family when they come watch comps.
 
A lot is going to depend on the coaches and leaders of the various events, as how they schedule will determine what your choices will be. At my kids' school the band director took pains to not overlap with sports times and they tried hard to stay in their lanes as well. JROTC put the various drill teams' practice in 0 hour before school and also cut a lot of slack to allow for students to do JROTC and band or sports.

But broadly speaking, you don't want to overbook yourself to the point where you aren't enjoying what you're doing, or you end up doing poorly at a lot of things. If you notice in the posts above, several folks took things slow during freshman year until they had the lay of the land. If you're an oldest child and your family doesn't know what it takes to get through your school's programs that might be a prudent consideration. If your siblings or cousins have navigated this then maybe let their experience inform your choices.

The one piece of advice I give anyone with big dreams who hasn't started high school yet is to not give away their grades in 9th grade. That is, don't get poor grades in classes before you even get to the harder honors/AP material. They typically start you out a bit easier and those grades are a third of what you have in the book when you want to apply in fall of senior year. Turn stuff in, talk to teachers, study your returned tests and homework to see what you got wrong, form study groups if necessary, and generally learn how to study. If you get average grades because you're not smart that's fine, own it and move on. But don't get bad grades from neglect or indifference.
 
My suggestion is to target activities that will net leadership opportunities and/or personal/team achievements. Learning how to manage a busy schedule is a valuable life skill. Your challenge will be in learning time management - doing too much can have a consequence of performing poorly in academics AND extracurricular. You also do not necessarily control future outcomes and have a potential for putting in significant prep work only to NOT be selected for the leadership role down the road. Make sure you enjoy the experience because the accolades are not guaranteed and you need to be OK with either outcome.

For me, I had to choose between football and band. At the time, the new turf stadium was built for the band - a top program in the country that has a varsity and jv marching band, and the drumline has won PASIC multiple times. People came to games for the halftime show and not the game (and this was in Texas where both band and football are a big deal). I did both in 9th grade and then knew I needed to make a choice. I was mediocre in football, but was the only freshman in my section in the top band. In other words, it was clear that I would achieve more in band than in football and that was my decision criteria.

Band is virtually all consuming during the summer and first semester, but I found other activities that could work well together. By the time I was a HS senior, I had a different activity every day of the week AND I was the person running each organization. Time management will be critical to your success. Best of luck!
 
brewmeist said:
My son was VP for his 300 member marching band, and was a league and district champion for his XC team, along with being a 3 year captain. He made it work, but was very busy. Fortunately the coaches and band director were willing to work together. Obviously he couldn't be at two places at once.

There were many students in his class who took on many leadership positions, to the point that it was obvious they were resume-loading. There was no possible way for them to give the proper commitment to all the groups where they took leadership roles. Keep that in mind. You want to keep busy, especially in activities you are passionate about, but you need to be realistic, too. There are only 24 hours in each day. And remember, grades need to come first.
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I see that in the NHS packets I read. The resumes are supposedly vetted before the readers get them but on some I call bull snot. I haven't done it in two years and may never again.
 
OldAFRet said:
Great to hear you're planning in 8th grade.

First of all, while USAFA might put some weight on Marching Band, it's not a sport (at least where I live). Golf is a sport, and marching band is not - I know, I asked that question many times. Also, Marching Band does not allow for you missing practices, as you leave a hole in a formation that screws everything else up. Bottom line - during Marching Band season, you have nothing else to do. Additionally, most MB members also had band as a class, and were strongly encouraged to join Pep Band (a half dozen or so musicians at every sports games, cheering them on)

A typical rotation of activities (in my DS experience) was Marching Band in the late summer and fall. Swim team over winter, and one of cross country, golf, or tennis in the spring. Note that all of these are individual sports, rather than team sports (and I think I've read the academies want to see a team sport. Are you good enough to make your baseball/softball team in the spring? You might want to work on it to get a true team sport under your belt.

Now your BJJ isn't a recognized sport in our school system, but should serve you well should you take up wrestling (again, an individual sport versus team).

Let's complicate things with JROTC. DS was told as a rising freshman, there was no extracurricular time required, but guess what? To advance well in JROTC, he needed to do Raiders or Drill (much extracurricular time, and with drill, you can't miss practice for the same reason as Marching Band).

Next is your community involvement. You don't mention Boy/Girl Scouts, girl Boy Scouts, 4-H, AHG or church youth group (actually out doing things).

The point being, yeah, you need to map out the seasons and pick your schedules carefully.
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I am doing both boy scouts and church youth group.
 
Sciencnerd said:
I am doing both boy scouts and church youth group.
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Outstanding! For scouts - look to Eagle asap. If you have not already held he SPL position - look to achieve that asap. It is a fantastic leadership experience, but does tend to take up time. 8th grade is PERFECT for this. If you are honest with yourself, middle school is a training program for high school. The grades do not carry forward to impact your GPA. While important, a hiccup here is not damaging to your long term goals.

My suggestion is to Eagle and serve as SPL. THEN.... transition into a Junior Assistant Scoutmaster (JASM) role. On the org chart, JASM is a higher position than SPL, but it takes significantly less time because you serve as the experienced youth who serves as a trusted advisor to SPL and as an intermediary between the adult leadership and youth leadership. The reduction in overall time commitment, while still having an important leadership role, will allow you to put more effort towards high school academics AND other extracurricular activities - if you so desire.

When I was in your position, I leveraged the added time to join CAP. I rose through their advancement program and ended up as the youth leader (squadron commander) for my unit by the 12th grade. On the resume - you are then leading your BSA troop as JASM and you are leading your CAP unit as squad com. Should your leadership carry into band roles, you should have aspirations of section leader and then drum major. In my own application, I knew my academics were good enough while not amazing. I knew my athletics were passing but certainly not a stand-out on the CFA. It was the extracurricular leadership part of the student resume that made my application package compelling. Everyone has a superpower - figure out which one you have and run with it.

The real bummer is that you have MANY great options to choose from, but only 24 hours in a day. Your high school will offer a slew of interesting activities but you can only select a few.
 
shiner said:
Outstanding! For scouts - look to Eagle asap. If you have not already held he SPL position - look to achieve that asap. It is a fantastic leadership experience, but does tend to take up time. 8th grade is PERFECT for this. If you are honest with yourself, middle school is a training program for high school. The grades do not carry forward to impact your GPA. While important, a hiccup here is not damaging to your long term goals.

My suggestion is to Eagle and serve as SPL. THEN.... transition into a Junior Assistant Scoutmaster (JASM) role. On the org chart, JASM is a higher position than SPL, but it takes significantly less time because you serve as the experienced youth who serves as a trusted advisor to SPL and as an intermediary between the adult leadership and youth leadership. The reduction in overall time commitment, while still having an important leadership role, will allow you to put more effort towards high school academics AND other extracurricular activities - if you so desire.

When I was in your position, I leveraged the added time to join CAP. I rose through their advancement program and ended up as the youth leader (squadron commander) for my unit by the 12th grade. On the resume - you are then leading your BSA troop as JASM and you are leading your CAP unit as squad com. Should your leadership carry into band roles, you should have aspirations of section leader and then drum major. In my own application, I knew my academics were good enough while not amazing. I knew my athletics were passing but certainly not a stand-out on the CFA. It was the extracurricular leadership part of the student resume that made my application package compelling. Everyone has a superpower - figure out which one you have and run with it.

The real bummer is that you have MANY great options to choose from, but only 24 hours in a day. Your high school will offer a slew of interesting activities but you can only select a few.
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Can you put SPL on applications if you serve in 8th grade? Most apps that I looked at with DS specify leadership positions in high school. Just checking since I have 3 more scouts coming down the line.
 
99Gold said:
Can you put SPL on applications if you serve in 8th grade? Most apps that I looked at with DS specify leadership positions in high school. Just checking since I have 3 more scouts coming down the line.
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If the language says high school leadership positions, then it would be excluded. Did the role extend PAST the last day of school in 8th grade and potentially cover summer camp or high adventure trek? If so, that is a gray area.

Most troops do not use the JASM role and thus it is lesser known. When the role is available, prior experience as SPL is typically a prerequisite. The JASM leadership position would then theoretically be held while in High School and can be used on the student resume. The candidate would likely need to explain the role to non-scouters, but if positioned properly, it is the most senior role a youth scout can hold within a local unit.

Another alternative, and one my son used, was to attend a National or World Jamboree and secure a SPL role for the event. The duration is shorter than a typical 6-month troop level leadership position AND you have quantifiable actions covering a large unit on a large event with significant responsibility.

With any leadership role, you need to be able to demonstrate your impact. The balance is the time commitment required to make a difference. Serving in a leadership position for 12 months sounds great, but if the student had no impact to show for the time spent, that was a poor use of time. If the student served in the leadership role for 1 month, but could show a major impact or personal growth, there is an argument to be had that it was more significant.

Admissions panels and nominations boards should be able to see the difference between resume fillers and youth leaders with impact. Document your impact and get specific when you can - just like you would for a concise but powerful OPR bullet.

I also don't want applicants to take my advice as rushing through the scouting program. Most applicants are high achievers and TIME is your nemesis. There is not enough time in the day to achieve all that you want to achieve. Parents will uniformly attest to high school students having more time TODAY than you will TOMORROW. There are just too many things competing for your time. As the workload piles on, the available time for extracurriculars will decrease. Front loading some activities that allow it is highly encouraged. My suggestions are intended to result in the highest rank and leadership role possible while conserving time for other activities. Doing more with less.

There comes a time when you have achieved every possible Whole Candidate Score point possible for a given activity and that may be a decision point for some applicants.
 
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shiner said:
If the language says high school leadership positions, then it would be excluded. Did the role extend PAST the last day of school in 8th grade and potentially cover summer camp or high adventure trek? If so, that is a gray area.

Most troops do not use the JASM role and thus it is lesser known. When the role is available, prior experience as SPL is typically a prerequisite. The JASM leadership position would then theoretically be held while in High School and can be used on the student resume. The candidate would likely need to explain the role to non-scouters, but if positioned properly, it is the most senior role a youth scout can hold within a local unit.

Another alternative, and one my son used, was to attend a National or World Jamboree and secure a SPL role for the event. The duration is shorter than a typical 6-month troop level leadership position AND you have quantifiable actions covering a large unit on a large event with significant responsibility.

With any leadership role, you need to be able to demonstrate your impact. The balance is the time commitment required to make a difference. Serving in a leadership position for 12 months sounds great, but if the student had no impact to show for the time spent, that was a poor use of time. If the student served in the leadership role for 1 month, but could show a major impact or personal growth, there is an argument to be had that it was more significant.

Admissions panels and nominations boards should be able to see the difference between resume fillers and youth leaders with impact. Document your impact and get specific when you can - just like you would for a concise but powerful OPR bullet.

I also don't want applicants to take my advice as rushing through the scouting program. Most applicants are high achievers and TIME is your nemesis. There is not enough time in the day to achieve all that you want to achieve. Parents will uniformly attest to high school students having more time TODAY than you will TOMORROW. There are just too many things competing for your time. As the workload piles on, the available time for extracurriculars will decrease. Front loading some activities that allow it is highly encouraged. My suggestions are intended to result in the highest rank and leadership role possible while conserving time for other activities. Doing more with less.

There comes a time when you have achieved every possible Whole Candidate Score point possible for a given activity and that may be a decision point for some applicants.
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Great points.

Our troop just started utilizing the JASM role a lot for Junior/Senior Eagle scouts to keep them involved. My oldest was SPL in 9th and JASM in 11/12. My 2nd son currently SPL in 10th and will likely become a JASM next leadership cycle. My oldest also had leadership roles during both of his High Adventure camps so that is another option. His leadership experience at Philmont turned into a great essay on perseverence. I think

I agree with the not rushing advice. However, there is a deadline for Eagle. We have had severeal last minute Eagles in our troop and they are always knocking down my door for merit badge help. I have told my own boys that their poor planning is not my emergency so do not wait until 17.5 to finish Eagle merit badges that have a 3-month time component. It also doesn't help with college (especially SA/ROTC) apps. That's just a PSA for all of you Life Scouts out there!
 
99Gold said:
Can you put SPL on applications if you serve in 8th grade? Most apps that I looked at with DS specify leadership positions in high school. Just checking since I have 3 more scouts coming down the line
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With only 11 years in scouting as den leader, cub master, assistant scout master, I'd have an issue with an 8th grader even running for SPL. I doubt most would have the requirements filled. Beyond that, older boys would not respect him, and the scoutmaster would likely fire him since he could not lead.
 
OldAFRet said:
With only 11 years in scouting as den leader, cub master, assistant scout master, I'd have an issue with an 8th grader even running for SPL. I doubt most would have the requirements filled. Beyond that, older boys would not respect him, and the scoutmaster would likely fire him since he could not lead.
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My 8th grader is tall for his age and young for his grade. His scoutmaster kept asking him when he was going to run for patrol leader and he kept saying, "I'm only 11." Now at 13.5 he is doing a great job as a PL. He won't be ready for SPL for awhile. I can't believe the growth I've seen in my 10th grader as SPL this semester.
 
My DS did cross-country and NJROTC. Now, as a senior, he is also working night shifts at Chick-Fil-A and is XO and drill team commander of his NROTC unit. He is also a leader on the orienteering team.

NJROTC can be as much or as little of a time commitment as you choose. On the minimal side, it is one Naval Science class per day, and it gets you out of the PE requirement in most districts. On the maximum side, you could be going to drill, academic team, color guard and orienteering practices every single day after school all year round as well as 1 to 2 competitions on per month on Saturdays. DS has an orienteering meet this Saturday and a drill competition next Saturday. I personally believe, in hindsight, that my DS devoted TOO much time to NJROTC, but that's another story.

What I would suggest is start out by doing marching band because that sounds like it is your passion. Also, start ROTC and put "your toe in" first to see how much you like it. Just go to NS1 class. In a really competitive school, you probably won't make the drill team as a freshman anyway. Cross-country is usually a "no-cut" sport. Go to practices when you can. Run on you own. Go to as many meets as you can.

There will definitely be conflicts, but managing a busy schedule is what the service academies look for. You will figure it out as you go. But remember, grades and SAT scores are just as important and must come first.
 
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My advice, is to try different things to find your interests/passions. @NJROTC-CC had good points about XC being a no cut sport (do what you can), etc.

You also want to ENJOY your high school career. You may decide to not apply for anything when the time comes. Your 8th grade self will be vastly different than your senior self.

Good luck, stay focused, and have some fun!!
 
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