I need help clearing some things up (and maybe some advice)

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another guy

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I'm an incoming sophomore in high school with USMA being my top choice for college. However, I only really learned about WP at the end of freshman year, so I've been slacking off some and not working as hard as I should have been. I've researched what I could about the academy and other alternatives in case I don't make it in, please bear in mind that I have pretty much no idea what I'm talking about, which I why I wanted to ask the people that have gone through it:

What I know:
-From what I have found, all service academies, not just USMA largely inflates their applicant numbers by including juniors going to SLE, people requesting more information, or people just putting enough information to start a file. I've seen that the "real" acceptance rate ranged from something from 15-16 percent all the way to 50-60 percent, which are both from online blogs, so I'm a bit skeptical.

-And like any other competitive college, I've also heard that some bribery was involved to getting a nomination? Which mainly includes funding specific government official's campaigns to raise your chances of nomination.

-And the last thing was that the academy reserves slots for active duty (some 85 more or less if I remember) to attend WP.

My overall questions/concerns:
-Regarding the inflated application numbers, is there any solid information that can really confirm this other than a personal account? I don't doubt that it's not wrong, I really can't imagine that many people wanting to go to USMA

-Assuming I typed in my address in correct and all, the representative for my congressional district seems like a nice lady, she seems pretty old (I don't mean to be rude but she'll almost be in her 80's by the time I do apply for a nomination). I really can't imagine someone like her just appointing some random dude because their parents paid for it, but I'll never know. Anyways, I'm not sure how competitive my district is but from the site we use to see our GPA and whatnot, we can also see how many from our high school students applied to a college. From what was recorded, which only goes back as far as 2014.

USMA: 2014 (2 applied)
USNA: 2014 (2 applied)
USAFA: 2017: (2 applied)
2018: (2 applied)
USCGA: 2017 (2 applied)

Not even considering the fact that this only means "applied" and not "appointed," I still find the numbers weirdly similar. But, based on the numbers how competitive would you say it is to get a nomination (there are about 750k people living in this congressional district which may or may not mean much). And, if these things about bribes I'm hearing is something I should be concerned about.

-If I don't make it into USMA, then that's where I can foresee the most problems arising. I haven't opened up to my parents about wanting to go to USMA yet, but I can guarantee they would be against it. I'm trying to and least go to a prestigious school so I can maybe reason with them that this is a safe path to go down. However, that's only what I think. If I don't make it in I don't really want to go to a senior military college because my parents would probably think that it's just a watered down version of USMA, however I'll still apply to one of them just in case. My main goal is to become an officer in the shortest time possible (may sound selfish but I kind of want to do it in the most efficient way possible). Where option 3 comes in, enlisting and then requesting to go to USMA. Main question is how long do you have to serve to get a chance at one of the reserved slots and if it's really worth the risk? I assume you have to serve for a couple years so your superiors can see if you're worthy or not, but if they don't, I can expect climbing the ranks and then OCS taking a long time (again it's selfish I know). For now my plan B resides in hoping to get a scholarship of some sorts to any ROTC program. For the people saying "it's your life do what you want with it," I don't disagree with you, but doing something like going through the application process of a SA isn't something you can or should really hide from the people that raised you. You need their support or and least their acceptance to go through with this, so I have to take into account what they think as well.

-Sorry for making you guys read that eye sore of a paragraph, but do the SA look at your weighted GPA? because if that's the case it doesn't even say it for me.

-Last concern:
As I only decided I wanted to go to USMA a couple months ago my application for now is looking pretty... dry.
I did XC, Winter and Spring Track from middle school all the way up to now. I do have asthma which I do see as a problem just because I had it after 13 and I'm not sure about the waiver process. Currently I'm just an average runner, no varsity letters or anything. I can't tell how I compete compared to others because our school is has a pretty good team, with some running at the national level (as far as last year and least). But I'll assume I'll make varsity by and least junior year. There's no official captain as it's more of "who's going to organize our meet ups and whatnot this year." so is it still considered a captain? (officially and least).

So what are my chances? (as of now)
-I'm a pretty skinny dude because I'm a runner but I've started to lift a little bit and I'm confident I can CFA standards.
-I'm in several clubs, but nothing leadership worthy which is concerning
-Academically, I can't really say where I stand now because my weighted GPA is 4.663 and I'm in the top 15th percentile (I think because the total students was off so calculations can be wrong, also that was a full remote-year learning environment so in-person may be different)
-I plan on taking the SAT junior year BUT seeing how they removed the writing portion for that what does it mean? Ik someone asked this before and they said they can't make you take the ACT with writing because then it makes you take one test over the other
-I'm enrolled in 1 AP class for now with the others being honors
-There is an AFJROTC program which I'm taking, but that means I'll only take it from sophomore to senior so does that put me at a disadvantage to someone who started since 9th grade?
-When it comes to extras, I couldn't find anything meaningful when it came to leadership positions but when I turn 16 I do plan on doing a junior fire department volunteer and boy's state (and maybe SLE if it feels right even though it doesn't really matter). So I think I need to work on that more.

Looking at myself, I'm pretty much known as the introverted guy as well so that doesn't help but assuming I can change that I think I'm in the "he's just an average candidate"

I would appreciate any advice and feedback on the path I plan to take and if there's anything else I missed, thank you!
(I'm not re-reading what I just typed so sorry if something doesn't make sense)
 
I will take the bribery one.

Has it ever happened? Maybe. But to suggest this is systemic is foolish imo. I know the kid who got inducted to USMA, a great friend and classmate of my son. I know my son’s record. Both earned their spots.

Just like every other person inducted.
 
Have you ever met someone who has gone through the process? I don't think anyone gets an appointment handed to them!! It is highly competitive - some kids with great stats get rejected (just like at every other university). You have got to be the best of the best!
 
A1Janitor said:
I will take the bribery one.

Has it ever happened? Maybe. But to suggest this is systemic is foolish imo. I know the kid who got inducted to USMA, a great friend and classmate of my son. I know my son’s record. Both earned their spots.

Just like every other person inducted.
Click to expand...
thank you! I know that all the cadets
 
This is the first I’ve heard of bribery. Maybe it happened back in the 1800s, when machine politics and cronyism were more rampant. But today, the process seems so professional and objective. Best I can tell, MOCs play a minimal role in the process. Their staffs are involved, along with constituent leaders and/or veterans. The MOC, for the most part, rubber-stamps the slates. And contrary to some public opinion, you don’t need to know or have contributed to or have voted for the MOC. It’s your credentials that matter. Can there be an isolated case of bribery? Of course! But again, it would seem exceeding rare — rare enough to not worry about.
 
OP, who are “the people” you are talking to, that say things like ‘bribery’ is prevalent? You should talk to other people…who really know. Attend an admissions forum. Attend a Service Academy Open House for your nominating sources. Study the SA’s official website. That’s where you will get accurate info.

You cannot buy your way in. IF ONLY it were That easy. “Even if” you could buy a nom? That doesn’t get you appointed.

Try dropping some of your queries into the search function and you will get hits on lots of discussion that’s already occurred about which you are inquiring.

Thousands apply. About 1,200-ish are appointed. It’s very competitive. The SA has to see you as a future officer. Every year, there are highly qualified applicants who don’t get appointed.
 
Put forth the best application you can for both all nomination sources and academy candidacy.
Control what you can.
Master all within your control; ie test scores, CFA and leadership. As well as practicing and honing interview skills.

With all due respect forget most of what you posted as it really appears to be rumor and or outdated crud.

Those that are in attendance can assure you that they didn’t get there by bribe. Or handshake. Or nepotism. This is a hard a** road and those that apply and earn and accept their place deserve the kudos. The thought that somewhere in the universe someone thinks my son “bought a spot” or bribed someone for his spot makes me nauseous.

Control what you can.
 
I didn't think that bribery was a problem being honest really, I was hoping to get more information about the competitiveness of my district and extracurriculars (but I still appreciate your guys information as it means I was thankfully wrong about something).
 
another guy said:
I didn't think that bribery was a problem being honest really, I was hoping to get more information about the competitiveness of my district and extracurriculars (but I still appreciate your guys information as it means I was thankfully wrong about something).
Click to expand...
Part of your competitiveness IS other people in your district. You have to be the one that a SA wants to grab, and shape into an officer. You have to be the one with the demonstrated leadership, academics and physical fitness, that the SA wants in that particular class that they are building. One thing for sure is that it is not the most physically fit highest GPA and person with the most leader ship on the résumé that necessarily gets the appointment. It’s the overall person which includes the interview and other intangibles that the SA considers.

Your chances, in part, depend upon how others who apply fit that bill, too. From your district, or other enlisted applicants.

People ask all the time ‘what are my chances’. Or ‘chance me’. And the response is always the same: we can’t, unless we know your the entirety of every other person applying from you slate. It’s truly impossible to know. You can search ‘chance me’ title threads and see what I mean.

There IS however, on thing that os certain. That’s 100 pct….you WONT get in if you DONT apply.

Adding this: don’t enlist unless you are prepared to fulfill that contract. It’s a risky way to go. I have one applying for OCS, and his brothers attend a SA. HANDS DOWN the SA route has been less complicated, less risky. Good luck to you!!
 
You may be overthinking the process. Unlike a civilian college, it is very difficult to project chances of getting an appointment to a service academy. Unless a file is exceedingly strong or weak, there are too many variables to accurately project chances for an individual candidate. Every year many outstanding candidates are rejected and several average candidates are appointed. It has nothing to do with favoritism, but rather is a reflection of the segmented appointment process. Your RC and FFR are in the best position to give productive feedback on your chances.

Appointment to USMA is essentially based on passing the medical and competing with other candidates in three areas - Academic (60%), Leadership (30%), and Physical (10%). Since you are only a Sophomore, there is plenty of time to shore up any weaknesses. Read everything available concerning admissions on the West Point website and attend an admissions briefing in your area. This will guide you in the right direction, make your USMA application most competitive, and also improve your chances for civilian schools.
 
Thoughts:
1) You will take the PSAT this fall...that will give you an idea how you will do on the SAT. Start practicing with Khan Academy now.
2) Your asthma may or may not be waiverable... make sure you are putting as much effort into Plan B colleges. The good thing is anything you do for USMA will also be great for any other colleges. Realize that if you can't get into USMA with asthma, you can't just get around that by going to a senior military college..you still have to be meet the medical/physical requirements when you enter the army.
3) There are many other ways to serve the country, e.g., CIA, etc besides the military
 
If you really really want to serve, be sure to open to all routes! That includes ROTC as well. Do your research on different ways to commission, do your research on the other Service Academies. You still have 2ish years to prep, start working on pull ups, pushups, etc. Get your academics up if need be, study for those standardized tests, start taking more leadership roles.

If you really really want this, you will be motivated.
 
You are here on SAF and I commend you for wanting advice to be a better candidate, better person. Pivot your mindset and start actionable steps. Stop spending mental/emotional energy on things outside your control - the entire bribery/octogenarian MOC bits. You are also not the only candidate with non-supportive parents, but many candidates will have far greater disadvantages and varying degrees of support.

Right now you are like the little car icon on my Uber Eats and twirling around with my Order, and i'm watching carefully to make sure you are heading in the right direction and getting to my house within the estimated time limit. The good news is you have the order - that is, you seem to be engaging (but not yet leading) in activities, doing well in school, and have a plan for additional activities/boys state. You are starting to address Plan B. All good things.

Actionable steps: made a grid, left columns are elements of application (GPA/class rank/courses; SAT/ACT, XC, AFJROTC, clubs) - and right column are your goals (top 10%, varsity, letter, captain, leadership roles, etc). In between are the action steps! Block a 3-4 month window to study for the SAT/ACT and take the tests in the summer and early Fall (rising Junior/early junior year). That way you also "double-dip" and will do well on the Fall PSAT. Use the same window to prepare for the CFA, and test at the earliest opportunity and get it done.

While SLE may not impact admissions decisions, still apply and attend if accepted. Main reasons: Get the CFA done - which will count for USMA and all the other SAs (verify for YOUR cycle; plus is one more element towards triggering DoDMERB), a taste of USMA, and could serve as an essay of Why USMA citing your experience/ah-ha moment. For my DD, she did her interview at SLE. Again, verify all details with your cycle.
 
You seem to be spending a lot of time twirling around on things that really don't matter to applying to USMA. You need to focus you efforts on things that matter and not get bogged down on things that don't. Your competition for an appointment with be some of the top high school students from across the country. Many excel in multiple areas such as academics, leadership, athletes and extra-curriculars. You should use that as motivation to excel all during high school. I would not be looking for advice from random blogs, social media or people you happen to know who think they know something about service academies. You have no idea if any of them know what they are talking about or just providing random/wild opinions. I would stick to known/reputable/current sources of information like the official USMA website. This forum is also a good source of information since a number of people have years of admissions knowledge and if a random person posts something that is inaccurate or out-dated, those who do know what they are talking about will step in with the correct information.

All SA's are highly competitive and far more apply then get appointments. That is also a reason why candidates are encouraged to have a Plan B when applying. It makes no difference to your application if x% of this or y% of that get selected. Many individuals start the application process but then never complete it. You have to be 3Q with a NOM to be in the RUNNING for an appointment. Each MOC runs their own NOM process and usually has a website with information about applying for their NOM. You may never meet/talk with the MOC since they typically delegate the NOM process to a team who works for them. However, I would avoid jumping to conclusions about anyone you interact with during this process. The USMA website also discusses the various sources of NOM's and it is recommended you apply for all NOM's for which you are eligible.

You will have no way to know who else will also be applying from your region or state and the number individuals who applied in prior years from your high school has nothing to do how successful you might be. The same basic questions get asked each year on this site so you might also search back older threads for input on the most commonly asked topics.
 
I decided to have some fun with Siri and ask for a list of the oldest U.S. Representatives who happen to be women.

Though I may not agree with some of their politics, they all seem to be mentally competent to serve and have been around long enough to know about ethics rules. As with most elected officials, they will have staff who deals with the nomination process (panels, interviews, applications, etc.). The elected official may only be involved in a photo op or may be slightly more involved. As to the bribes, other posters have covered that.

The fact your Representative has spent more time on the planet than you should not factor into your concerns. Be just as wary of bias against age as you no doubt are about race, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientations and other diverse aspects of humanity.
www.oldest.org

10 Oldest Women Currently in Congress (Updated 2024) - Oldest.org

Discover the 10 Oldest Women Currently in Congress (Updated 2024) here. Prepare to be transported into a rich & fascinating history on the oldest women in congress that exist.
www.oldest.org www.oldest.org
 
This is a copy of general advice to those just starting out to explore the path to a commission. Some of it might be useful to you.
———————————————————-
This is my standard advice, which I copy and paste several times a year.

You are at the right time to begin serious research.

The service academy application process itself tests for qualities and attributes desirable in future junior officers: attention to detail, executive planning and organizing, time management, task prioritization, humility, perseverance, patience. Take ownership of the process.

If you haven’t read every page, link and menu item on your sa.edu of choice sites, taking notes and starting to build out an extended timeline of action items and long-term due dates, now is a great time. That is your primary source, and most answers are there.

Do the same kind of research into alternative paths to commissioning, such as ROTC and related scholarships. That is a prudent thing to do, and shows no lack of commitment to an SA. Additionally, a college ROTC unit is another nomination source, if you find yourself re-applying after a SA turndown. There will be thousands of candidates building HS resumes with similar stats, plus college re-applicants; leave no opportunity unexplored. Presumably, your prime goal is to commission as an X officer, with USXA your preferred path. It’s not the only path. Re-applicants to SAs make up a chunk of each class.

Take this time to research all five of the Federal service academies, and subsequent career paths, so you can make an informed decision about ruling them in or out. It’s very important to look past the interim waystation of 4 SA or college ROTC years to see if there are at least a good handful of career paths you could see yourself doing for a minimum of 5-6 years or whatever the applicable minimum active duty service obligation is.

For those interested in a Navy career, don’t overlook the Navy Nuclear Power Officer Candidate (NUPOC) program and the Civil Engineering Corps (CEC) officer program (think SEABEEs). These are college programs with financial assistance, but no ROTC time commitment.

Go to your elected officials’ websites (2 Sen, 1 Rep), read and take notes on their service academy nomination process. They can choose submission deadlines, interviews or not, panel interviews, any method they want. If they are having a F2F or virtual info session, sign up and soak it in, so you are well-prepared for your cycle, even a few years out. Stay current with that site, in case the elected official changes.

Apply for all nominations for which you are eligible, including the VP at the DOD service academies. This gives the SA max flexibility, if they want to offer you an appointment, as to what nom authority they eventually charge the appointment to.

Go to the DoDMERB site, the entity which does the physical qualification of candidates. Explore each menu item on the left. This often turns into one of the most frustrating and time-using aspects of the process. Get smart on it now so you won’t be surprised. There are some medications that must be discontinued for a certain period of time. IEPs and accommodations also are off the table at a certain point.

Research the CFA or applicable fitness test for the SA or program of interest. Assess yourself and develop a training plan. Women, learn to do pull-ups. It’s worth more points, and you will value that strength and confidence. Do not procrastinate when it’s your cycle. Leaving it too late invites illness, injury, bad weather, family emergency or sudden non-availability of your test administrator or video person, if that is required. There are YouTube videos on various techniques Google Stew Smith’s website and YouTube videos; he’s a USNA grad, former Navy SEAL, now a fitness pro.

If you are a non-swimmer or not a confident swimmer, take some adult swim classes at the Y or other program to get more comfortable in a pool. Though the SAs will teach you to swim to meet various required tests, you don’t want to spend precious time in remedial swim. It’s a good life skill anyway.

Here on SAF, read the Stickies at the top of the Nominations and DoDMERB forums. There is also The Acronym List on the Home page if you haven’t found it yet.

There is a Search function tool inside SAF, and google works well when you include “site:serviceacademyforums.com” in the string. The same questions come up every year. The “Chance Me” and “stats” threads can be illuminating as to ideas for summer leadership programs such as Boys State and Girls State, and other competitive elements. The SA summer programs in your rising senior summer are worth looking into to get a feel for that SA.

There is no one cookie-cutter magic formula; a class is made up of individuals who bring different combinations of strengths.

If you are not involved in a sport, be sure you prepare well for the CFA to prove basic physical ability, and also ensure your other activities supply the leadership, collaboration skills, work ethic, time investment and discipline learned in a sport.

Don’t overlook the Senior Military Colleges (SMCs), which offer a military-type environment and structure, as well as paths to a commission. Some are only Army ROTC; some have Army plus other service ROTC.

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List of Colleges & Universities | GoArmy.com

The Army ROTC training program is held at select schools across the country. Visit goarmy.com for a list of these military colleges & universities.



Research the state maritime academies, which also offer commissioning programs.

Maritime Academies | MARAD

Studying merchant marine operations at the university level is a core component of MARAD's education strategy; particularly its essential responsibility to meet national security needs and maintain maritime defense readiness. The six maritime academies and USMMA meet that need by educating young...

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www.maritime.dot.gov



Create your organization system - binders, folders, spreadsheets, calendars, wall boards, whatever works for you to plan, track and execute. Many apply to multiple SAs, nom sources, ROTC scholarships, ROTC schools, etc.

Finally, stay flexible and open to the paths that open before you. The key is to show sustained performance, personal growth and achievement in a well-rounded person.
 
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