LET 2013 RING!!!!! KP Parents, Alumni and All Concerned Please Read

[kpskilegac]

Well said Jasperdog. The bell ringing tradition dates back to the academies early days - with the first ringing in 1943-1944. Most old timers and I mean the real old timers that are still with us will tell you immediately they remember running to the oval to ring the bell in the war days. No musters or formations, just check the grade sheet and run down to celebrate passing license by ringing the bell. It was a celebratory event and strong motivator for the classes coming behind them to know this was doable. Of course in those days everyone was always in uniform on campus.

If the administration is concerned with appearances and that all mids should be in the uniform of the day as is the regulation when on the oval, then make that a requirement or leave should not commence until after the bell ringing for the majority of the class is completed. In the not so distant past, most classes ran to ring the bell in their khakis and only in recent years have mids with free gangway been in civis, and even more recently has the event been broadcast live via webcam. Turning what has traditionally been a celebratory moment free of regimental restriction into another regimental dog and pony show doesn't seem right.

 

[Sea Faring Moose Mom]

One Question.....

Does EVERYTHING have to be regulated???

I will NEVER forget the phone call and hearing that bell ring WITH my DD. Then we both screamed our heads off......

I pulled over on the side of the road to share this moment. I am certain the people driving by seeing an 'old lady' standing by her car, screaming, and do the 'happy dance' out of her mind. It was a triumph of 4 long years, tears, prayers, and late nights on the phone...getting through it together.

I was presented a necklace just like the top of her Academy ring....she told me that I had 'earned' this degree with her. Perhaps that is why I screamed as loud as her.

Let this wonderful tradition continue to be spur of the moment.......

 

[JED482]

Pretty sure when the author Henry David Thoreau wrote his essay Civil Disobedience, and later when Gandhi embraced Civil Disobedience in his doctrine of Satyagrahaaid similar admonishments and warnings were likely issued. Leadership is not always blindly following directives or orders, nor is doing so a garuntee that those who behave as such own all rights to any moral imperative.

REALLY, you view this forum as a place for exercising Civil disobedience. REALLY, you believe Civil Disobedience is the proper way to address this issue.

I have no ties to the academy, I am not an Alumni, I don’t have a child that attends. I, like many people, come to this forum to get information. On the main page for this forum it states:

“This is a place to ask questions and give answers to general questions for prospective service academy members”

Of course you have the RIGHT to say anything you want on this forum. If you want to use this PUBLIC forum to paint a negative picture of the academy, disparage the current administration, and try to drum up public support to force a change you have the RIGHT to do it here. If you want to join in and throw fuel on the fire you have the right to do it. But you need to also be fully aware that this is a PUBLIC forum, designed for prospective service academy memmbers, freely accessible to everyone in the WORLD, and we WILL judge you the Alumini, you the Student, and your Academy based upon the things you write here. We may view you as individuals who were educated to believe this is the proper way to deal with this situation. We may have a negative view of the administration and wonder why you attend this academy. We may wonder why anyone would consider attending this academy. Yes, you do have the right to deal with your internal problems in this open, PUBLIC forum.

I am not suggesting you shouldn’t address or deal with this type of issue. My point is, there are other, better ways to accomplish your goals. This is probably just about the worst way possible to do it. Using this method causes far more damage than good.

I understand the young man is upset and this is a very important issue to him. Perhaps this is the only method he has, or knows of, to reach out to others who he thinks can help. If you don’t have access to a private forum or similar communications method for students, alumni and/or parents It would be very beneficial for you to create one.

I don’t know who runs this forum, but I would suggest that someone with Leadership skills from the Alumni group step in and get this forum back on track to its original stated purpose.

 

[LineInTheSand]

REALLY, you view this forum as a place for exercising Civil disobedience. REALLY, you believe Civil Disobedience is the proper way to address this issue.

I have no ties to the academy, I am not an Alumni, I don’t have a child that attends. I, like many people, come to this forum to get information. On the main page for this forum it states:

“This is a place to ask questions and give answers to general questions for prospective service academy members”

Of course you have the RIGHT to say anything you want on this forum. If you want to use this PUBLIC forum to paint a negative picture of the academy, disparage the current administration, and try to drum up public support to force a change you have the RIGHT to do it here. If you want to join in and throw fuel on the fire you have the right to do it. But you need to also be fully aware that this is a PUBLIC forum, designed for prospective service academy memmbers, freely accessible to everyone in the WORLD, and we WILL judge you the Alumini, you the Student, and your Academy based upon the things you write here. We may view you as individuals who were educated to believe this is the proper way to deal with this situation. We may have a negative view of the administration and wonder why you attend this academy. We may wonder why anyone would consider attending this academy. Yes, you do have the right to deal with your internal problems in this open, PUBLIC forum.

I am not suggesting you shouldn’t address or deal with this type of issue. My point is, there are other, better ways to accomplish your goals. This is probably just about the worst way possible to do it. Using this method causes far more damage than good.

I understand the young man is upset and this is a very important issue to him. Perhaps this is the only method he has, or knows of, to reach out to others who he thinks can help. If you don’t have access to a private forum or similar communications method for students, alumni and/or parents It would be very beneficial for you to create one.

I don’t know who runs this forum, but I would suggest that someone with Leadership skills from the Alumni group step in and get this forum back on track to its original stated purpose.

Whoa!!! I was going in a different direction. I regularly advocate for standing on classroom desks and, one at a time, saying "Oh captain, my captain." This is all the more appropriate at USMMA.

Or... don't ring the bell until no one is looking....They aren't going to march you up at bayonet point, right?

Either way, it sounds like a pretty cool tradition.

 

[Lynpar]

Hi JED and welcome! That is quite an impression you may have just made with your third post to this forum.

You may be correct in all you have asserted however my question to you is: how long have you been reading this forum? If it is very recent I think you may be throwing out an oppinion that is pretty shallow in judgement. I think you will find if you go back in the archives, what you have read is not really all that bothersome. Some of our esteemed members may be rolling in the deep ( just a little ) but if you actually take the time to read up you will gain valuable insight into the culture of this forum and the academy. You surely have the right to your opinion and I thank you for providing it even though you have no connection to the academy as you stated.
We have lots of fri-enemies running about and being new you may not have a view of the bigger picture. Case in point. ^^^^^^^^^^ LItS

If I am wrong and you have been reading this forum, for the months it would take to have enough perspective to jump in and post such a thing, remove the stick and pull up a chair because you will be fun to have around.

 

[KPEngineer]

REALLY, you view this forum as a place for exercising Civil disobedience. REALLY, you believe Civil Disobedience is the proper way to address this issue.

I have no ties to the academy, I am not an Alumni, I don’t have a child that attends. I, like many people, come to this forum to get information. On the main page for this forum it states:

“This is a place to ask questions and give answers to general questions for prospective service academy members”

Of course you have the RIGHT to say anything you want on this forum. If you want to use this PUBLIC forum to paint a negative picture of the academy, disparage the current administration, and try to drum up public support to force a change you have the RIGHT to do it here. If you want to join in and throw fuel on the fire you have the right to do it. But you need to also be fully aware that this is a PUBLIC forum, designed for prospective service academy memmbers, freely accessible to everyone in the WORLD, and we WILL judge you the Alumini, you the Student, and your Academy based upon the things you write here. We may view you as individuals who were educated to believe this is the proper way to deal with this situation. We may have a negative view of the administration and wonder why you attend this academy. We may wonder why anyone would consider attending this academy. Yes, you do have the right to deal with your internal problems in this open, PUBLIC forum.

I am not suggesting you shouldn’t address or deal with this type of issue. My point is, there are other, better ways to accomplish your goals. This is probably just about the worst way possible to do it. Using this method causes far more damage than good.

I understand the young man is upset and this is a very important issue to him. Perhaps this is the only method he has, or knows of, to reach out to others who he thinks can help. If you don’t have access to a private forum or similar communications method for students, alumni and/or parents It would be very beneficial for you to create one.

I don’t know who runs this forum, but I would suggest that someone with Leadership skills from the Alumni group step in and get this forum back on track to its original stated purpose.

With all due respect (since I know nothing about you) but it is my experienced opinion that you are 100% wrong.

KP is its own animal with its own culture. "Civil Disobedience" has been practiced there for generations. I could try to explain it to you but frankly, there are no words. It is something that can only be lived.

"Everyone in the world" can judge me, but frankly I don't care. I only care about my fellow members of Kappa Pi Sigma. Only they know what it is like, only they know what it took and only they know how to earn the title "KP Alumni".

You want to know why anyone would want to attend this Academy? Keep reading. Us Alumni are always happy to tell you and we frequently do. All throughout these forums.

 

[EDPKP81]

With all due respect (since I know nothing about you) but it is my experienced opinion that you are 100% wrong.

KP is its own animal with its own culture. "Civil Disobedience" has been practiced there for generations. I could try to explain it to you but frankly, there are no words. It is something that can only be lived.

"Everyone in the world" can judge me, but frankly I don't care. I only care about my fellow members of Kappa Pi Sigma. Only they know what it is like, only they know what it took and only they know how to earn the title "KP Alumni".

You want to know why anyone would want to attend this Academy? Keep reading. Us Alumni are always happy to tell you and we frequently do. All throughout these forums.

Upon reading these posts I can only think of something we occasionally did while at the 'Zoo' - BOLT!!

 

[JED482]

With all due respect (since I know nothing about you) but it is my experienced opinion that you are 100% wrong.

You need to read again what I wrote. You can practice all the “Civil Disobedience” you want. But believe me, doing it on an Internet forum designed for prospective service academy members is causing you more harm than good.

The stated purpose of this forum is:
"This is a place to ask questions and give answers to general questions for prospective service academy members”

Do you believe I just made up that statement?

Do you believe this forum is the appropriate/best place for Kings Pointers to exercise their Civil Disobedience?

"Everyone in the world" can judge me, but frankly I don't care. I only care about my fellow members of Kappa Pi Sigma

This actually explains a lot and helps me better understand what type of man a person could become if they graduate from Kings Point, thanks for helping with the decision making process.

 

[MumKP2015]

If you are truly interested in finding out more about Kings Point, if at all possible, visit the campus. We did not know anything about the forum until after our DS planned on attending USMMA. There are many people here that are more than happy to answer questions, if you or a family member are interested in attending. USMMA has many traditions as do the other service academies.

 

[kpcrew]

JED482 [/QUOTE] This actually explains a lot and helps me better understand what type of man a person could become if they graduate from Kings Point, thanks for helping with the decision making process.[/QUOTE]

You have certainly done your due dilligence in regards to making what I assume to be your choice to attend or not attend a prospective college by reading this anonymous public forum. You are absolutely correct to base your decision on the comments chosen to be made here by less then a dozen current mids and alumni about an all-important topic such as a bell ringing ceremony. Disregard the important legacy and tradition aspects touched upon, they matter not. Best wishes to you as you move on with your college search.

 

[kpbaseballmom]

Then why is the Naval Academy allowed to do this?????

Is this tradition at the Naval Academy "dignified"? Should this be allowed to continue? If KP can't ring a bell with unbridled joy, then why should this "tradition" be allowed to continue at Annapolis? Seems like our ritual is tame compared to this!! BTW, this is still happening!! All events like this should then be banned at all the Academies. Aren't there several Annapolis grads at KP? Did they participate in this tradition when they were there? From the local paper near Annapolis:


Years of lard, tradition Rituals: Naval Academy plebes unite to scale slippery Herndon Monument, one of many academy rituals.
May 19, 1998|By Neal Thompson | Neal Thompson,SUN STAFF
A thousand semiclad men and women ran screaming across the grounds of the U.S. Naval Academy yesterday toward a lard-slathered column of granite.

Why? Because that's how it was done last year and each of the 80 years before that. At this training ground for future military officers, tradition is like a mascot.


To the cheers of thousands, academy freshmen spent two sweat-soaked hours and 20 slip-sliding minutes getting one midshipman to the top of Herndon Monument. But what yesterday's crowds missed was the numerous, lesser-known customs and rituals that have become the tics of this 153-year-old institution.

Most of them happen toward the end of the year, when midshipmen seek an extra bit of help -- surviving exams or surviving the last days as a low-life "plebe," as freshman are known -- by way of luck, superstition and the ghosts of those who went before them.

 

[kpbaseballmom]

And ....


Is anything about USMMA's Bell Ringing:

1. Illegal
2. Immoral
3. Damaging of government property
4. Sexist
5. Dangerous
6. Infringe on anyone's rights
7. Demoralizing
8. Viewed as hazing
9. Filled with religious overtones

NO to all of the above. Then why can't they Ring the Bell like everyone has since the 1940's?

 

[AMF]

With all due respect (since I know nothing about you) but it is my experienced opinion that you are 100% wrong.

KP is its own animal with its own culture. "Civil Disobedience" has been practiced there for generations. I could try to explain it to you but frankly, there are no words. It is something that can only be lived.

"Everyone in the world" can judge me, but frankly I don't care. I only care about my fellow members of Kappa Pi Sigma. Only they know what it is like, only they know what it took and only they know how to earn the title "KP Alumni".

You want to know why anyone would want to attend this Academy? Keep reading. Us Alumni are always happy to tell you and we frequently do. All throughout these forums.

KP, you nailed it again. The entire history of KP is replete with stories of "revolt" (for lack of a better term) amongst the regiment. It happened with important issues like the admission of women, and people of color. It happens with smaller issues like a protest over the newest rules/uniforms, etc. It shows great unity when the entire regiment unites in protest (not riots) against a given superintendent/commandant. Many time the regiment prevails in these protests, many times the command prevails. This is a positive reflection of the regiment and it's ability to contribute to the overall workings of the school. A unique animal indeed.

 

[kdbax]

The stated purpose of this forum is:
"This is a place to ask questions and give answers to general questions for prospective service academy members”

Do you believe I just made up that statement?

And if you read the rest of the purpose (right under the bulletin board titles), you would see that this is a forum for parents, current midshipmen, and candidates. It's not limited to just providing answers for prospective students, and never has been if you've read other threads. And as the mother of a 2013 grad, you better believe I'm interested in bell ringing. I've watched prior webcasts and loved watching the mids finish their careers at KP. I hope to watch my son have the same experience, instead of the regimented experience the powers that be apparently have in mind.

BTW, just in case you haven't read other threads, jasperdog is not only an alumnus but also the parent of a 2012 grad. Carries a lot of weight in my estimation.

 

[one_seat]

I have to say as a 2013 midshipman and a setback from 2012 I have been looking forward to the bell ringing since i first watched the class of 09 run out of the academic buildings to be bell in the oval to signify the release. It gave me hope that this place isn't impossible to get through that I can do it. As mentioned before its the spontaneity of the event that makes it so special. Its hard to explain the feeling to some one who hasn't seen it or experienced it. I have been looking forward to ringing that bell to feel that elation and sense of accomplishment for all five years i have been here.

It has been that beacon of hope that has helped me get through here and in one fell swoop that beacon is gone. Yes graduation and working is still a good motivation for passing license, but I'll be honest it became a little harder and made this place a little harder to deal with. and for those who say you can still just ring the bell on your own time or they are still letting you ring the bell, the bell ringing isn't the point, it the spontaneous atmosphere of reading off your grades for license and running right after to the oval and that sense of release and relief.

And the command staff wonders why there is a moral problem here at Kings Point.

 

[cmakin]

Upon reading these posts I can only think of something we occasionally did while at the 'Zoo' - BOLT!!

I know nothing of which you are writing. . . .

Nor do I know anything about going over the wall, food fights or any other potentially subversive behavior. . . .

 

[cmakin]

On another note, does anyone still jump into the pool, or has that been fallen by the wayside. . . .

 

[KPEngineer]

I told my wife about this last night. Her response, "That's idiotic. What's next? Marching to the pool after Change of Command and falling in while at attention."

 

[cmakin]

I told my wife about this last night. Her response, "That's idiotic. What's next? Marching to the pool after Change of Command and falling in while at attention."

What he (she) said. . .

 

[Voyager20]

This has been an interesting thread. Because of this thread, I went out on youtube and watched some videos of the bell ringing. You could see and feel the excitement of the students – it was a thrill to watch the ones on the phone knowing they wanted to share that moment with someone and how excited that person on the other line must be.

I wish you all luck in keeping your tradition. I wonder though, if this will be like the Naval Academy’s one year of the no lard on the Herndon Climb and then the tradition came back.

Traditions do matter. Here’s hoping your effort will ring through to the future.