Maybe Norwich?

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May 1, 2022
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Hello, first time poster, but I’ve been reading and learning a ton here for months. My DS might want to pursue ROTC and corps of cadets at Norwich starting fall 23. Should he reach out to their ROTC department if he’s sure he wants to try for this? Do they want to hear from kids interested or is it just apply and go from there?
 
Hello, first time poster, but I’ve been reading and learning a ton here for months. My DS might want to pursue ROTC and corps of cadets at Norwich starting fall 23. Should he reach out to their ROTC department if he’s sure he wants to try for this? Do they want to hear from kids interested or is it just apply and go from there?
I would definitely recommend talking to someone at Norwich and contacting someone in the ROTC program. We did that well before my son applied and found the information we gleamed from talking to them and visiting the school itself to be very helpful. We not only learned a lot about Norwich, but we learned a lot about ROTC and SMCs in general.
 
Hello, first time poster, but I’ve been reading and learning a ton here for months. My DS might want to pursue ROTC and corps of cadets at Norwich starting fall 23. Should he reach out to their ROTC department if he’s sure he wants to try for this? Do they want to hear from kids interested or is it just apply and go from there?
At the open house in the fall they had a session for each branch of ROTC and we found the Army session to be extremely informative so I do recommend attending an open house if possible. My son is headed there for Fall 2022!
 
Thank you both very much! I will let him know to reach out to the branch he’s interested in. Do you think a general introduction would be appropriate? We have family background in ROTC so not a ton of questions at this point, as we know most of the deal… he I’m sure has some though that he’d rather ask the source…
 
My son is contracted Army ROTC at Norwich. He’ll be a Junior this year and is happy to answer any questions your son may have about life at Norwich, etc. He also hosts prospective students when they visit Norwich. If interested, just send me a DM and we can get them in touch by email.
 
Norwich was one of my daughter’s top choices . For several reasons, primarily because she was recruited to swim at another senior military college, she is not attending. We attended the open house and the ROTC session and found it very informative . The USMC ROTC coordinator answered every question she had and gave her his card to call if she needed more information. I agree a campus visit would be a good idea . Everyone we met at Norwich was helpful and friendly. Good luck .
 
Hello, first time poster, but I’ve been reading and learning a ton here for months. My DS might want to pursue ROTC and corps of cadets at Norwich starting fall 23. Should he reach out to their ROTC department if he’s sure he wants to try for this? Do they want to hear from kids interested or is it just apply and go from there?
Army ROTC, NROTC, or AFROTC?
 
He’s interested in Army ROTC.
Call up there and have him speak to the recruiting operations officer. Best to speak to someone soon. The officers are in and out of the office because they will soon be headed to advance camp for the summer.
 
Thank you all for the responses! I’ll have him make contact, introduce himself and ask about next steps. He has visited and loved the campus. At this point I think he just needs to take a first step in the right direction.
 
This is sort of irrelevant to your question, but Norwich is a great place. My dad was a graduate (later had a long career in the Army) and has nothing but great things to say about it. Good luck to him!
 
This is sort of irrelevant to your question, but Norwich is a great place. My dad was a graduate (later had a long career in the Army) and has nothing but great things to say about it. Good luck to him!
I love to hear this type of stuff, so thank you for sharing! My son thought it was awesome during his visit. We’ve had him visit other schools with AROTC, but none of them are giving him the feeling that Norwich did.
 
Also want to add that Norwich was extremely generous with scholarship offer and I might be wrong , but I think they will cover room if one is a recipient of an rotc scholarship. .
 
Our experience has been that Norwich is more thorough, responsive, and overall positive compared to the SAs. I graduated from West Point, yet have been thoroughly impressed with Norwich (my son has enrolled there for C/O '26). Their alumni association is effective and strong. Norwich is only 17 years younger than West Point and recently achieved their 200-year milestone complete with the construction of a new building and renovations at most of their other buildings. Truth be told is that at an SMC, a cadet will receive more military specific training and opportunities to participate in field training exercises than at an Academy - the academies embroil their students in extremely heavy course loads that interfere with core military training. Did I ever participate in a field training exercise as a West Point cadet during the academic year? No. Do Norwich cadets participate in multiple FTXs during the academic year? Yes.

I am concerned by how many SA grads only complete their initial service obligation and then jet from active duty. The mission of SAs should be to produce leaders of character that fulfill a lifetime of service in uniform - each year, however, more and more leave active duty after completion of the initial service obligation, get their MBA and ride off into the sunset - that scenario is not in line with the original intent of the SAs. This attrition will not bode well if it continues to accrete into the future. In short, Norwich is an incredible alternative to an institution like West Point.
 
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Our experience has been that Norwich is more thorough, responsive, and overall positive compared to the SAs. I graduated from West Point, yet have been thoroughly impressed with Norwich (my son has enrolled there for C/O '26). Their alumni association is effective and strong. Norwich is only 17 years younger than West Point and recently achieved their 200-year milestone complete with the construction of a new building and renovations at most of their other buildings. Truth be told is that at an SMC, a cadet will receive more military specific training and opportunities to participate in field training exercises than at an Academy - the academies embroil their students in extremely heavy course loads that interfere with core military training. Did I ever participate in a field training exercise as a West Point cadet during the academic year? No. Do Norwich cadets participate in multiple FTXs during the academic year? Yes.

I am concerned by how many SA grads only complete their initial service obligation and then jet from active duty. The mission of SAs should be to produce leaders of character that fulfill a lifetime of service in uniform - each year, however, more and more leave active duty after completion of the initial service obligation, get their MBA and ride off into the sunset - that scenario is not in line with the original intent of the SAs. This attrition will not bode well if it continues to accrete into the future. In short, Norwich is an incredible alternative to an institution like West Point.
I hope some of the SA forum regulars drop by the SMC section to read your post. You raise some strong points in favor of SMCs.
 
I hope some of the SA forum regulars drop by the SMC section to read your post. You raise some strong points in favor of SMCs.
Thanks! I still maintain that if a candidate receives an appointment to an SA and the academy environment is what they desire then they should in most cases accept that appointment over SMCs or other ROTC programs - but, there's a lot to be said for how effective the SMCs are at producing well-trained, informed, and high quality officers. My brother graduated from North Georgia and was more successful during his military career than me. My main point was related to how I think the natural assumption is that the SAs are all about military related training, training, and more training - when in reality, and but for the summer training season - that's not 100% accurate.
 
Usbjbma, thank you for your perspective. Our DS is attending '26 Norwich with AROTC, but also fully completed his WP application, including two MOC nominations, etc. and was deemed 3Q qualified. He did receive his WP decline notice several weeks ago. However, during the time frame, we kept seeing that SMC like Norwich was a much better fit. If successful thru ROTC, the cadets achieve the same rank regardless although SA typically get better service selections (what USNA told us.)

From a parents perspective, WP's got really quiet at the end, and we felt that if WP was not pushing your items through (CFA approved 3 months late only after a nomination was received) you are not top brass in their eyes. His WP Field Force rep was great, but even FF was getting frustrated. Norwich on the contrary was "on it" from day one. Responses to questions in a day, updates that afternoon, and nice consistent updates from day one. We totally understand the level of volume and requirements are way different, but the push through the Regional Command to get things approved/updated was extensive for a process that started in March '21.

Secondly, playing a sport at a SMC really helps take some of the Indoctrination stress away for that short time out on the field with teammates. Our DS will play a D3 sport which is perfect to enjoy practice and get off campus for competitions. Being not D1 athlete, this was something he might be able to do at SA easily.

Finally, our DS went thru Norwich FLC in 2019 as a rising sophomore. That really allowed him to understand what being a Rook will be like. In summary, we started to advise him that Norwich as better successful fit than WP as prestigious as it.
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One very funny piece. Norwich FLC trained our DS so well, that during his overnight stay at USNA this Fall, our DS's USNA plebes asked our DS to dress like a plebe to see if the upper class mid would notice. It took them 2 hours to finally catch-on. (did not square a corner to USNA spec.) Our DS received a USNA Company Award coin by the upper classman for the effort and good Company laugh.
 
I am concerned by how many SA grads only complete their initial service obligation and then jet from active duty. The mission of SAs should be to produce leaders of character that fulfill a lifetime of service in uniform - each year, however, more and more leave active duty after completion of the initial service obligation, get their MBA and ride off into the sunset - that scenario is not in line with the original intent of the SAs. This attrition will not bode well if it continues to accrete into the future.
That's an interesting take. I would expect a "lifetime of service in uniform" to be at least the 30 years allowed by statute for non FO/GOs. With approximately 1000 graduates per year, how would the Army handle it of ALL stayed for the lifetime of service. Can the Army handle 1000 promotions to Major each year (approx yr 12) ? Can it handle 1000 promotions to LtCol each year (approx yr 16)? What about to Col? I
daresay that the MAJORITY would be passed over at some point and if there is no voluntary attrition then the Army will be paying significant severance to the many that it will be "kicking out" to meet end strength limits as enacted in legislation. The only way to avoid this would be to slow down promotions A LOT which would result in a much more "seasoned" force as you'd be discharging many 20 year Capts/Majors every year to make room for the next generation of new 2nd Lts.
 
I can speak to my personal experience as a Norwich grad--both as a Cadet and now 20-year alum. The basic answer is that Cadet life, whether at Norwich or any similar institution, is spartan and challenging. And that is what the design of such institutions demands. It is no-fun at the time as a Cadet; the standards are high (and, in some cases, purposefully unachievable--character is everything), the hours long, the academics a genuine challenge, and the stress is quite real. Ok, why? Because we need leaders who can be challenged and not defeated. Yes, at Norwich you will receive a world-class education, but to quote the school's now ancient mission statement (and this is my best attempt at an off-the-cuff paraphrase)--"education is measured in mental, physical, and moral proportions." That is what going to a place like Norwich will provide, a truly whole-person experience. As the president of a state college in California I can reliably offer that is something you will not get outside of a military academy.

At the same time, it takes the right type of person at 17 or 18 years old to commit to such a grueling four-year experience. I remember on a random Tuesday in February of my junior year, while I was standing in morning formation thinking to myself "it takes a pretty motivated individual to be willing to give up the trappings of a civilian college experience to get up at 5 AM, wear a uniform, go out in the cold, salute the flag, struggle through academics, and accept the challenge of leadership." I never forgot that moment. But it is those motivated people that go from individual to leader, and in so doing the sacrifice made at a place like Norwich pays dividends decades in the future. Norwich, and other institutions like it, school their Cadets in the true meaning of service. I am privileged for having had the experience.

This fall is my 20th class reunion. Its is tough to believe. And in those 20 years I have met with some professional success...but, the professional touchstone for my success has been the education, development, training, and experiences I had at Norwich. Let me share this--and none of this is meant from the perspective of bragging--rather, I am sharing these things to put some data behind my claims: when I showed-up at the University of California to begin my PhD as a brand new captain, I found the experience in a top-tier PhD program to be academically challenging, but that Norwich had prepared me well academically; after I completed my PhD, I reported to the Intelligence Officer Course...I graduated then reported to my first operational unit and was well-prepared to effectively lead my troops...Norwich was the core of that preparation; and as a brand-new college president I had tons of opportunity to choose the "easy right over the hard wrong" and never did. Norwich had refined my character and personal integrity in ways I still do not fully appreciate, and that refinement gave me the ability to do the right thing "when no one was looking." Most importantly, Norwich built me into a man--and officer--that my troops were proud to call "their own."

So, please do not read me as trying to brag...the credit should go to Norwich, the NCOs that trained me to be a better leader, and my superior officers who mentored me.

No matter what you do--do it right. You will never regret it.
 
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DD and I visited Norwich last October. She will be USAFA 2026 but here were our impressions....beautiful campus, personalized tour (she got to meet with the Head of the Civil Engineering Dept.), very generous aid, and amazingly efficient communications. Minor downsides...the remote location (for DD, but I loved it!) and DD did not like that there were civilian students on campus. She decided she wanted "all in" military and that's what she's going to get.
 
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