National Pool

Discussion in 'Naval Academy - USNA' started by Old Navy BGO, Jan 3, 2018.

  1. Old Navy BGO

    Old Navy BGO 5-Year Member

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    My turn to ask a question (I don't think I have ever done it on this forum)....this is triggered by an recent exchange of private messages with a parent, and numerous vague references to the "National Pool" in this forum. The term usually comes up when someone refers to not winning their MOC slate, and pins their hopes on getting picked up in the "National Pool." When asked, I had to admit, I don't know exactly what the National Pool is and how many people get Appointments from the National Pool ?

    What I do know is that every Appointment needs a nominating source, and the normal nominating source's are clearly identified on Admissions website. Is there some other "secret" source of nominations that creates the National Pool. For example, I have seen references here to how the Supe has some ability to admit great candidates or blue chip athletes. Does the Supe have nomination or other discretionary powers. If so, how many candidates can get in that way ?

    I know that it is possible for Noms and Appointments to use unfilled MOC nominations to appoint a good candidate from one of the more populated states , and that from time to time some MOC nominations are unfilled and available...but realistically, this probably doesn't happen all that often. I am a BGO in one of those rural states, and we have plenty of very qualified candidates and many are disappointed each year. I also know that there has to be some flexibility built into the system, since it impossible to predict how many Presidential Nominations (probably a lot) or Medal of Honor Appointments (probably rare) are used each year.

    So, with that preamble ..what is the basis for the National Pool, and how many Appointments come from it ?
     
  2. USMA 1994

    USMA 1994 Member

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    There is a guide posted on the USMA Admission's section called congressional guide that explains this process. You do not need an special access to view the document.

    http://www.usma.edu/admissions/SitePages/Cong_Reps.aspx

    1. Basically all applicants who are 3Q with a nomination are in the pool called Qualified Alternates.
    2. If the class size is not full with primary slate winners, the next 150 Qualified Alternates are offered based on OML
    3. If the class is still not full, Additional Appointees are select not necessarily in OML. They must keep a 3:1 Congressional to Service Connected nomination source Ratio.

    If you read through the document, it also covers these exceptions that you mentioned about moving nominations.
     
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  3. Old Navy BGO

    Old Navy BGO 5-Year Member

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    Thanks USMA...good information there. Will have to look at the USNA website, I don't think I have ever seen this there before, but obviously a joint effort. OF course I could have overlooked it since it is identified as info for MOC.

    The lead in "if the class is not full..." begs the question....how many really get in via this pool ? Seems it depends largely upon the number of Presidential and MOH appointees. The number of nominations from other sources is largely fixed, and probably approaches the authorized class size.
     
  4. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    What things are considered for ranking the Qualified Alternate List? Do the number or type of nominations factor in?
     
  5. USMA 1994

    USMA 1994 Member

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    It is by WCS Number. I do not think the number of nominations impact your WCS.
     
  6. USMA 1994

    USMA 1994 Member

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    Nominations are unlimited but appointments are capped at 100 for both presidential and service connected.

    Doing the rough math

    1: 635 MOC Spots (535 plus 20% to account for two openings every four years)
    2: 100 Presidential
    3: 100 Service Connected
    4: 50-100 Superintendent (I do not know the actual number)
    5: 50 MOH/100% Disabled etc (Just guessing here but that number cannot be that high)

    That gives you right around 1000

    They take 150 of the NWL and then another 100 or so as Additional Appointees.

    That gives you a class of 1250. (Unless I missed a category that I do not know of)

    Now just assuming here, the first 150 of the NWL list probably happen each year.

    The Additional Appointees slots are saved for LOA winners that did not win a slate, athletes, prepsters, sponsored alumni scholarships and specific diversity candidates.

    If you do not get in with the first 150 of the NWL, then your chances are very slim unless you have one of those special situations.
     
  7. DesertCaliMom

    DesertCaliMom Member

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    These numbers aren't reflecting those that don't accept after LOA, too, from which I understand new appointments happen off the NWL
     
  8. usna1985

    usna1985 10-Year Member

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    The numbers above are correct for the number of appointees that COULD come from each category. A smaller number does. For example, not every MOC has 5 mids at USNA at one time. Some don't have a sufficient number of qualified candidates. The Supe's nom typically only goes to a handful, not 50. There also aren't likely to be the full number of appointees of a parent with a service connected disability. You also need to consider ROTC noms and the ~270 each year who come from NAPS/Foundation.

    To answer the OP's question . . . those who don't win their MOC slates go into the National Pool. 150 appointees can come from the pool, chosen based on WCS (merit).
     
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  9. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO 10-Year Member

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    Depending on how you look at it...there are two “national pools.” The first, is the 150 MOC (and MOC only) qualified alternates, in order of merit. The second, is the remaining spots to fill the class — 75% of those being selected from this pool must be a VP/MOC/US territory qualified alternate, as well; the remaining 25% can be from other sources (Presidential, J/ROTC, etc). This is why it is important to apply for ALL nominations (emphasis on MOC), because a candidate is significantly disadvantaged if they don’t have a VP/MOC nomination and they aren’t a primary slate winner from another source. This is all governed by Title 10, USC.

    https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/6954
    https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/6956

    Also, if a MOC does not have any qualified candidates or doesn’t submit a slate (apparently this happens), candidates from a different district or state CANNOT be charged to that MOC’s count. It’s a myth that they can do this; it just goes unfilled for that year.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2018
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  10. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    So, the number/type of MOC nominations doesn't affect the WCS for the National Pool, but it does determine whether the alternate gets on the "A" list with a MOC/VP or the "B" list with a non-competitive nomination. Very interesting.
     
  11. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO 10-Year Member

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    The type of nomination could have an impact within the second national pool, however, the type (or number) of MOC nomination(s) doesn’t matter in either of the national pools.
     
  12. Ptsv

    Ptsv Member

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    Not sure if this helps, but the attached .pdf goes into depth on the Nomination process.
     

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