Never Thought I'd see the Day--Pagans at USAFA?

they don't follow Christian beliefs. It's not so much the cross itself as it is placing the cross at their place of worship. in a way you can try relating it to putting a yankee flag over the field at Fenway Park, although sports it not nearly as strong a link. It's just a sign of disrespect toward their beliefs.
 
I found another site discussing this topic and here are some interesting quotes from self-professing pagans:

Watch out, once you get out of the big cities, you’ll find several of us Wiccans and other flavors of Pagans who are meat-eating-boot-wearing-animal-killers (I kill what I eat and I eat what I kill) as my teacher used to tell me, ‘we are not nambi-bambi-pambi wiccans’. It would take a whole lot more than a couple of sticks in an ‘X’ to desecrate my circle.

A wooden cross.
I mean, Please….
Is that all you got?!?

See, what the Christians were probably doing, all be it the wrong way to get their point across, was just adding the cross as an expression of freedom of worship. After all, wasn’t it an “Outdoor” worship area? Who says a Cross can’t be Pagan? After all, most if not all Christian holidays, symbols etc came from Pagan ceremonies and rites. Lets try preaching tolerance to ALL religions and not only when it’s convenient to a cause such as this one. I too am a practicing Pagan with Christian parents and family members. They would never know what a Wiccan Sanctuary looked like if they stepped into it, cause all the ones I use are natural and untouched by artificial signs or crafted symbols. Just 2 cents worth. “An it harm NONE, do as ye will”. Does the presence of the cross REALLY desecrate a sacred space? Doesn’t it lend to the fact that the space is truely “sacred to the God’s of old and in it the old ways live again?” Just a thought.

And my personal favorite:
Funny that they think this will anger any wiccan or pagan out there. As an active pagan myself, i say they make it a permanent fixture at the site. Pagans (the majority) are very open and accepting of other religions. As for the builders of the site, welcome the addition into our rich faith, or as it says in the Bible, Turn the other cheek.

I'm not saying they don't have a right to be offended, but here is an opportunity for AFA pagans to show the world they are different from the rest of the thin-skinned religions out there. Embrace the cross in the name of acceptance and tolerance; make it a badge of honor. Maybe I've read too many Orson Scott Card books...
 
As for this subject...I'll keep my personal opinions to myself. But I will say that this country was founded under God...thats where I hope it'll stay.
 
TruCadet - Just a suggestion - in your spare time read up on Thomas Jefferson.
 
JAM; I think you are correct. But also, so is truecadet22. Our country was not founded under god, so much as it was founded with one of the principals being freedom of religion as well as freedom of no religion. In other words, a country where the government was not aligned with a national church. Thus, forcing their religious beliefs upon the citizenry.

However, truecadet22 is correct in the premise that many of our founding fathers did in fact have a faith in god. And their faith most definitely affected their moral choices and what later on would become social norms and a societal value system.

But the main premise was that citizens could worship and believe any way they wanted to, or not at all, in a supreme being; god; or other form of purpose of existence. And that the government could not endorse or mandate any one particular belief over another. But most definitely, our founders, as well as every other person on the planet, is affected by their beliefs. Their beliefs affect their choices, decisions, and recommendations every day. There is no way to get around that.

It is important that all religions or beliefs (That don't infringe on the rights of others) are given a forum in which they can exercise their rights. I do believe however that sometimes political correctness is a problem. Then again, I think political correctness has been one of the biggest contributors to our declining social system, thus increasing crime, poverty, and other social issues. The government needs to ensure that while offering the opportunity for individuals to exercise their right to worship or practice a faith, that they don't diminish another faith in the process. I.e/E.g A "Christmas Tree" is in fact a representation of "Christmas". It is NOT a "Holiday Tree". The proper way to include other beliefs and religions would be to promote their icons, such as a menorah. You don't "Neuter" one belief to make it even with another belief. You allow the additional beliefs to rise. But this is political correctness and government officials. There are some things our government is very good at. Such as the military, foreign affairs, inter-state commerce, etc... However, political correctness and other social issues are things the government has totally screwed up and made worse. They do control social growth a lot more than many people want to realize.

And that is something that some posters here have eluded to. While the government shouldn't endorse 1 religion or belief over another, totally neutering a religion or belief is the same thing as endorsing "atheism" which by many atheists is "Their Belief". Which many atheists have argued that they should be given the same respect as other religions. So in their attempt to be politically correct, and try to not promote one belief or religion over another, they actually have promoted one over the other. It is definitely a tricky circumstance. I'm glad the academy has made a forum for non-traditional beliefs and religions to exercise their right. I just hope they don't get into the business of neutering any particular belief or religion, in their attempt to balance them. What were we taught growing up? "2 Wrongs, Don't make a Right".
 
So, I wonder what will happen when a group of military personnel; cadet or active duty; want a place where they can sacrifice live animals. Don't snicker; christian, judaism, and islam religions still practice this in many parts of the world.

Just a short correction; there never has been or ever will be a “Christian” religion that offers any sacrifice other than the Eurcherist (the one and only sacrifice of Jesus’ crucifixion). Any group that entertains any other “sacrificial ritual” is NOT Christian.
I just stumbled upon this thread and started reading through it. IMPO, while I know little about Wicans, they should be free to exercise that belief provided it does not interfere with their ability to perform their duties or the duties of their fellow service members. Same goes for every other religion. The idea that the best and the brightest of our country NOT having a moral or ethical core before accepting the the challenge of a military career and a service academy education is a non-starter for me. It is my belief that these kids go to the SA's with a strong spiritual core and that it would be improper for that core to be compromised by an atmosphere of religious intolerance. Just my personal opinion.

Don : I have no idea where you get your information from, but Jews have not practiced any form of animal sacrafice since the second century and even then the intent was to have a religious feast. The idea that contempory mainstream Jews practice any form of animal sacrafice is dangerous misinformation.
 
TruCadet - Just a suggestion - in your spare time read up on Thomas Jefferson.

Just a Mom, if you are just a mom then you should try acting like an adult please. You are bickering with people about something that you are not going to be able to change at all. Let it be.
 
Just a Mom, if you are just a mom then you should try acting like an adult please. You are bickering with people about something that you are not going to be able to change at all. Let it be.

Have you noticed this thread is over a year old? We all moved on long ago. I suggest you do the same.
 
yay! i love reviving old threads! brings back good memories... lol
 
Maybe they just want a legal avenue to take drugs!! haha

I hope this is only in jest and not a real opinion on these people. If so, such types of jests don't come across as intended online. Take it elsewhere.
 
I hope this is only in jest and not a real opinion on these people. If so, such types of jests don't come across as intended online. Take it elsewhere.

Well said.

Steve
USAFA ALO
USAFA '83
 
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