New Cadet BBQ

This thread right now has everything to do with a new-4th class BBQ. :rolleyes:

Well, at least people know how the cadre are trying the BBQ the new cadets now.:rolleyes:

I'll apologize for hi-jacking the thread, but I think some things needed to be said as well. Thanks for the opportunity to discuss it.

Now back to the normal pleasantries.
 
A combination of pre-existing heart condition, extremely high heat, and Jake running from point to point (of his own free will), not unsupervised cadet cadre, resulted in his death



1. It is. Extremely so.
2. Maybe you should focus on asking more questions about what happened and less on trying to find a cadet to blame.


Not so. This has and continues to happen :rolleyes:

BigBear offers some valuable perspective here. My fiends who just started as Tac officers are embarrassed at what beast has become, and its being dictated from top down.

Taking care to ensure safety is one thing. Giving soft, pudgy New Cadets candy bars, letting them fall out in Central Area, and posting the pics gleefully on Facebook as though it's some kind of triumph to be happy about is quite another. Hard need not be unsafe. Easy need not be part of the experience.
 
You betcha, were the same darn school except for the fact that Dixie is required 4th class knowledge and is regularly played during parades :wink:

In all seriousness, The Citadel is embroiled in the same controversy of the weakening of the 4th class system as USMA. I will ask though, do plebes or parents ever try to get TAC's or cadre in trouble for hazing (either through the school or legally)? That's where the big deal is in our case, where the legal system gets involved; granted I'm sure it's very different between a public college and an SA however.
 
I always enjoy these annual Beast is too easy “discussions” on the forum.

From my recollection of Beast in the late 1970s, there were no BBQs for new cadets and a painful absence of officers and NCOs supervising cadre. The cadet cadre was allowed to do what they felt was necessary to correct perceived or imagined transgressions in behavior. Most corrective sessions seemed to do more for the cadre than the new cadets. Compare this to reports from my cadet who was a CBT I squad leader this summer who reported that many decisions by cadet cadre leadership were overruled by the officer chain of command. An example of how far the pendulum has swung is the report that 0-4s and 0-5s were detailed to patrol the mess hall to ensure that the new cadets were allowed to eat in relative peace and not have to shout, for instance, that the “sauce is the boss” or do the PB&J “dance”.

From personal experience, I would recommend erring on the side of too much supervision by experienced officers.

I can’t imagine that Beast can go too much further in the current direction. On the other hand, I don’t know how far a more demanding Beast will go in producing a better officer especially if many ROTC programs don’t have similar indoctrination programs.
 
About The Citadel being the same thing as USMA or about the national anthem of the CSA? :biggrin:

Definitely one more than the other. The Citadel is probably as close as a public college can get to the SA experience, but no, the 2 schools are not the same thing. About Dixie, however.....that's pretty much true.
 
:rolleyes: okay bud.

In other New Cadet News, I helped run some training for Alpha and Bravo Co. (the "Football" companies) over the past two days. Apparently the football New Cadets are done with Beast after today, almost two weeks early.
 
Finished with BCT two weeks early?

The football team starts practice this week. I do believe tomorrow they begin the road to victory over Navy. It’s a love-hate relationship. The corp of cadets love their football team but resent the fact the football team gets a little bit more attention. They still are participating in March Back. BCT is not going down hill. Same thing every year.



Push Hard, Press Forward
 
EVERYONE knows that the degree of difficulty in Beast is very low compared to past years for all Cadets- especially for women. I know this is a "politically incorrect" statement but ask ANY upperclassman if you do not believe this is true. My son (now a Cow) was very surprised and disappointed at the lack of difficulty and the low standards.
Try coming down hard on a woman in Beast - if she gets too emotional the upper class cadet is in trouble - ask any upperclassman in beast for confirmation.
My son was just a Cadre at Buckner - he said that it is a losing proposition to try to be as hard on a female as a male Cadet -
There are many outstanding women Cadets but many just get by because other Cadets are not hard on them because of fear of getting in trouble. Lets quit pretending that the military and physical standards for men and women are equal.
 
This year's Beast is easier than last year's Beast. Last year was easier than the year before. Lather, rinse repeat until the you get to "the second-ever Beast was easier than the first-ever Beast."

Start again next year.

It's like singing 99 Bottles of Beer on the Wall.
 
This year's Beast is easier than last year's Beast. Last year was easier than the year before. Lather, rinse repeat until the you get to "the second-ever Beast was easier than the first-ever Beast."

Start again next year.

It's like singing 99 Bottles of Beer on the Wall.

Yup, so it's totally pointless to discuss changes that are detrimental to the corps...
 
Yup, so it's totally pointless to discuss changes that are detrimental to the corps...

I didn't say that.

"Easier" is in the eye of the beholder. And "harder" is not necessarily better for the Corps. "Smarter" or "more sensible" are.
 
I didn't say that.

"Easier" is in the eye of the beholder. And "harder" is not necessarily better for the Corps. "Smarter" or "more sensible" are.

If you remove the challenges from something that is supposed to develop confidence through achievement, in order to preserve someone's little snowflake...ah hell, I already know the answer.
 
I have been stunned at reports of mommies sending birthday cakes or special goodies with their NC's name on it to Chaplain's Time with instructions to give it to their precious darling!:confused:

It's just like summer camp.....
 
I didn't say that.

"Easier" is in the eye of the beholder. And "harder" is not necessarily better for the Corps. "Smarter" or "more sensible" are.

So is "smarter" or "more sensible"

No more black combat boots. When we had black combat boots, the "smarter" or "more sensible" crowd will argue that why do we need to shine our "combat" boots, the time spent to shine those boots can be used for more productive purpose.

My reply is how much time would you have spent on shining your boots and if you don't have to shine your boots, what you would do with your time, and what other lessons can you learn from shinning boots?
 
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The football team starts practice this week. I do believe tomorrow they begin the road to victory over Navy. It’s a love-hate relationship. The corp of cadets love their football team but resent the fact the football team gets a little bit more attention. They still are participating in March Back. BCT is not going down hill. Same thing every year.



Push Hard, Press Forward

CBT. BCT is the few weeks of pattycake they play at Air Force (grueling 3 mile marches, baseball caps, etc.)

Beast is definitely a far cry from what it used to be. Some of that is good. Most is not.
 
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