I believe since you did not take the scholarship you would be eligible for the GI Bill after your initial commitment. There are some older threads addressing GI Bill eligibility on this forum that may shed better light. But I am not 100% sure, so best to do some research, so don't take my word as gospel. Best to find the direct website and publication that covers this from the VA for direct info.
Nurse Option ROTC Ed delay
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Pima
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Not to veer too far off topic, but I am just wondering about opting not taking the scholarship for the GI Bill will end up in a fiscal difference, especially if they need to take a loan to attend college.
For example, let's say that they use it at an IS where tuition costs 14K a year. or 56K (without tuition increases while in school). Plus, you need to add in stipend and book allowance. That would be an additional non-taxable amount of @16.5K more. A total of @71K for the scholarship.
~ Taking loans for the undergrad degree to use the GI Bill will incur interest starting 6 months after graduation.
~~ Whereas, taking the scholarship means you can bank that money you did not spend on the student loan that includes the interest payment. One option is paying yourself that payment and banking it with earning a small amount of interest for four years where you can pull out later. The other option is paying the bank with interest and investing less, or maybe not at all.
I am not taking a side in this, I am just saying from a fiscal aspect, I think the decision needs to be evaluated long term before you decide. A subsidized stafford loan if memory serves me, will not incur interest until they graduate. A personal loan via Sallie Mae or Wells Fargo, etc. will incur interest the minute it is paid to your college. That means 4 years of interest accumulating from minute 1 of attending school. Plus, the repayment over 10 years upon graduation.
~ That also will have an impact after 4 years if you take the GI, because that loan will show up every month regardless if they are now a student now earning a Master degree using the GI Bill. You will need to add that into your budget.
Plus, as an O1-O3 that amount in student loans can take a nice chunk out of their paycheck. If they take the career starter loan, to purchase a car and set up their 1st house, that can take another chunk. The career starter loan if I recall correctly is paid back over 4 years.
I am not saying that they shouldn't do it that way. I believe that this decision is personal. I am just saying that I can understand why some will do the TA over the GI Bill if possible. Let's say that they can get through their grad program in 2 years. Now for rated, they realistically can't start their grad program for the 1st 2-3 years, but for other career fields it maybe possible to start at the 18 month marker. If they finish it at the 3 year marker, since it runs concurrent, it would be walking @ 6 years with the degree.
~ Probably the same time if they left at 4 and used the GI Bill.
Additionally, what I know of the new GI Bill, unlike the old, it is transferable to dependents. I do not know the specifics. In other words, if it can be transferred to a spouse for grad degree, or just to children.
Finally, this is the thing that I don't believe most cadets understand, especially AFROTC cadets. The clock does not start until you arrive at the 1st assignment. The clock is not like an SA clock. SA grads are seen ADAF upon commissioning. ROTC grads are not.
~ Commission in May 2016, report Feb. 2017. The 4 year clock will release you Feb 2021, not May 2020.
~ If the AF in May 2019 says you will PCS Sept. 2019, than because you are more than a year out from separating you will not be able to do a non-volunteer option, and you have to stick it out for the duration of that assignment. Iows, maybe to 9/2022, or 18 months more than you expected.
~~ Or at least that is what I have always understood.
~ The clock also changes if your career field has a specialty school. IE, some schools will say that you owe back time once you graduate from it. It runs concurrent with the ROTC commitment.
~~ Let's say that they send you to the school in Feb. 2017. Your school is 6 months long, and upon completion you owe 4 years. Now the real date is August 2021, not Feb.2021.
Just saying that you need to look into the true details for your career field. How long of a wait time before you get to your 1st assignment? Is there additional commitment for training for that career field upon completion?
I do want to say that for CRNA, it probably will be the best option to go GI because I highly doubt that TA is going to be an option if they are assigned to Lakenheath or Enid. It maybe possible if they were assigned to places like Randolph or Andrews. My reasoning is that they would want to be attending a college that offers their program, instead of doing it on base via the education dept.. Randolph and Andrews are located in large cities, with multiple colleges.
For example, let's say that they use it at an IS where tuition costs 14K a year. or 56K (without tuition increases while in school). Plus, you need to add in stipend and book allowance. That would be an additional non-taxable amount of @16.5K more. A total of @71K for the scholarship.
~ Taking loans for the undergrad degree to use the GI Bill will incur interest starting 6 months after graduation.
~~ Whereas, taking the scholarship means you can bank that money you did not spend on the student loan that includes the interest payment. One option is paying yourself that payment and banking it with earning a small amount of interest for four years where you can pull out later. The other option is paying the bank with interest and investing less, or maybe not at all.
I am not taking a side in this, I am just saying from a fiscal aspect, I think the decision needs to be evaluated long term before you decide. A subsidized stafford loan if memory serves me, will not incur interest until they graduate. A personal loan via Sallie Mae or Wells Fargo, etc. will incur interest the minute it is paid to your college. That means 4 years of interest accumulating from minute 1 of attending school. Plus, the repayment over 10 years upon graduation.
~ That also will have an impact after 4 years if you take the GI, because that loan will show up every month regardless if they are now a student now earning a Master degree using the GI Bill. You will need to add that into your budget.
Plus, as an O1-O3 that amount in student loans can take a nice chunk out of their paycheck. If they take the career starter loan, to purchase a car and set up their 1st house, that can take another chunk. The career starter loan if I recall correctly is paid back over 4 years.
I am not saying that they shouldn't do it that way. I believe that this decision is personal. I am just saying that I can understand why some will do the TA over the GI Bill if possible. Let's say that they can get through their grad program in 2 years. Now for rated, they realistically can't start their grad program for the 1st 2-3 years, but for other career fields it maybe possible to start at the 18 month marker. If they finish it at the 3 year marker, since it runs concurrent, it would be walking @ 6 years with the degree.
~ Probably the same time if they left at 4 and used the GI Bill.
Additionally, what I know of the new GI Bill, unlike the old, it is transferable to dependents. I do not know the specifics. In other words, if it can be transferred to a spouse for grad degree, or just to children.
Finally, this is the thing that I don't believe most cadets understand, especially AFROTC cadets. The clock does not start until you arrive at the 1st assignment. The clock is not like an SA clock. SA grads are seen ADAF upon commissioning. ROTC grads are not.
~ Commission in May 2016, report Feb. 2017. The 4 year clock will release you Feb 2021, not May 2020.
~ If the AF in May 2019 says you will PCS Sept. 2019, than because you are more than a year out from separating you will not be able to do a non-volunteer option, and you have to stick it out for the duration of that assignment. Iows, maybe to 9/2022, or 18 months more than you expected.
~~ Or at least that is what I have always understood.
~ The clock also changes if your career field has a specialty school. IE, some schools will say that you owe back time once you graduate from it. It runs concurrent with the ROTC commitment.
~~ Let's say that they send you to the school in Feb. 2017. Your school is 6 months long, and upon completion you owe 4 years. Now the real date is August 2021, not Feb.2021.
Just saying that you need to look into the true details for your career field. How long of a wait time before you get to your 1st assignment? Is there additional commitment for training for that career field upon completion?
I do want to say that for CRNA, it probably will be the best option to go GI because I highly doubt that TA is going to be an option if they are assigned to Lakenheath or Enid. It maybe possible if they were assigned to places like Randolph or Andrews. My reasoning is that they would want to be attending a college that offers their program, instead of doing it on base via the education dept.. Randolph and Andrews are located in large cities, with multiple colleges.
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I think OPs understanding is correct. From http://www.newgibill.org/faqs/am-i-...bill-benefits-as-an-officer-rotcacademy-grads
The service commitment to pay back an ROTC scholarship and the service commitment to earn GI Bill benefits do not run concurrent, one must be completed before the next commences.
My DD is in a similar situation with NROTC. If she accepted a scholarship, her first five years of AD would be to pay back the scholarship, and she would need an additional three years to earn her full GI Bill benefits. As she plans to go to grad school and wants the freedom to choose her school and major, she chose to not take an NROTC scholarship. She will owe three years AD and can then utilize her full GI Bill benefits, and then go back to AD if she chooses. The reality is that she will likely choose a designator which requires five years AD. As she can use the yellow ribbon program on top of her GI Bill, the financial benefits for grad school are a good bit higher than for undergrad, though if a person planned to serve eight years active duty before grad school, certainly it would be wiser to take the ROTC scholarship for undergrad. My DD was in the fortunate position to have another scholarship covering tuition for her undergrad so she didn't need the ROTC scholarship, but I realize the vast majority don't have that option.
My DD is in a similar situation with NROTC. If she accepted a scholarship, her first five years of AD would be to pay back the scholarship, and she would need an additional three years to earn her full GI Bill benefits. As she plans to go to grad school and wants the freedom to choose her school and major, she chose to not take an NROTC scholarship. She will owe three years AD and can then utilize her full GI Bill benefits, and then go back to AD if she chooses. The reality is that she will likely choose a designator which requires five years AD. As she can use the yellow ribbon program on top of her GI Bill, the financial benefits for grad school are a good bit higher than for undergrad, though if a person planned to serve eight years active duty before grad school, certainly it would be wiser to take the ROTC scholarship for undergrad. My DD was in the fortunate position to have another scholarship covering tuition for her undergrad so she didn't need the ROTC scholarship, but I realize the vast majority don't have that option.
Pima
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When did ROTC change to 5 year payback? Are you including the report time after commissioning?
Unless something has changed for AFROTC, it is not 3 years like it will be for your DD in NROTC, but 4 yrs ADAF. Klone is AFROTC.
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Actually, NROTC Navy Option has been a 5 year service commitment for at least 3 years now. Marine Option is still 4 years.
Pima
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I am totally confused now. My assumption has always been that as a junior (POC) they had to be contracted or would be disenrolled. However, the way bman is posting their DD could leave at 3 years after graduation
Can you walk me through the whole system, regarding how some may owe 5 years Navy in ROTC and some will only owe 3?
Can you walk me through the whole system, regarding how some may owe 5 years Navy in ROTC and some will only owe 3?
AROTC Parent
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AROTC NonScholarship ADSO is 3 years. Kinnem can confirm but NROTC NonScholarship Navy Option ADSO is likely 3 years too. It's a faster option to qualify for the GI Bill.
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Well, I'm really not sure I know the answer, but being contracted (as you know) is not the same as being on scholarship. My assumption is that she would face the same service obligation as someone who graduated from OCS, which is 4 years. So I really think Bman is incorrect about the 3 year obligation, unless he's just referring to the amount of time before the benefits kick in. However I didn't really read his post that way. I read it as a 3 year commitment which, again, I believe is incorrect.
Pima
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AROTC parent when did it go to 3 year? I always was under the assumption that it was 4 AD, or they could do Reserve or Guard with different pay back commitments.
NROTC is like AFROTC. There is no Guard or Reserve option. It is AD only if you commission via ROTC/OCS. For the AF, USAFA owes 5 years, ROTC owes 4. However, for AFROTC, it can take 6-9 months to report, thus it really is close to 5 years.
NROTC is like AFROTC. There is no Guard or Reserve option. It is AD only if you commission via ROTC/OCS. For the AF, USAFA owes 5 years, ROTC owes 4. However, for AFROTC, it can take 6-9 months to report, thus it really is close to 5 years.
AROTC Parent
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Navy - http://www.nrotc.navy.mil/military_requirements.aspx - I realize it says 'at least'. However, based on title 10 if no other ADSO obligations like flight school or PCS increase the commitment then it is a three year ADSO
NROTC College Program
Midshipmen who pay their own educational expenses or have a non-Navy source of educational funding may participate in NROTC through the NROTC College Program. Upon graduation and commissioning, this individual will be required to serve at least three years on active duty.
Army - http://www.apd.army.mil/jw2/xmldemo/r350_100/main.asp and http://www.apd.army.mil/pdffiles/r350_100.pdf
From AR350-1 also verified in Title 10 USC
2–2. Precommission
The ADSOs will vary according to the program under which the officer was commissioned.
a. Reserve officer training corps (ROTC).
(1) The ROTC scholarship graduates selected for active duty incur a 4-year ADSO.
(2) Nonscholarship ROTC graduates selected for active duty incur a 3-year ADSO.
NROTC College Program
Midshipmen who pay their own educational expenses or have a non-Navy source of educational funding may participate in NROTC through the NROTC College Program. Upon graduation and commissioning, this individual will be required to serve at least three years on active duty.
Army - http://www.apd.army.mil/jw2/xmldemo/r350_100/main.asp and http://www.apd.army.mil/pdffiles/r350_100.pdf
From AR350-1 also verified in Title 10 USC
2–2. Precommission
The ADSOs will vary according to the program under which the officer was commissioned.
a. Reserve officer training corps (ROTC).
(1) The ROTC scholarship graduates selected for active duty incur a 4-year ADSO.
(2) Nonscholarship ROTC graduates selected for active duty incur a 3-year ADSO.
DS had a 2 year sideload NROTC scholarship and his commitment is at least 6-7yrs. He is doing subs and has almost 2 years of training before deployment. Navy is a bit different but they also start full pay at day of commissioning. I think the minimum commitment is 5 years and that would be for surface warfare as you are deployed immediately.
AROTC Parent
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Terp1984- Key is your son has a Navy Scholarship....right away that puts them at 5 years. The additional time is likely for Sub training.
There are numerous training situations like aviation and Subs that add to the initial NROTC Scholarship 5 year ADSO.
Per the Navy links the starting Non Scholarship ADSO for Navy is 3 years and 'Additional requirements may be required for specific job assignments.'
NROTC commitments are for eight years total. If on scholarship, five of those years must be AD. If non-scholarship, three of those years must be AD. For anyone who goes to nuclear power school (i.e. all sub officers and SWO nukes), the minimum AD service requirement is five years, regardless of how they commissioned or whether they had a scholarship or not. The five years looks different depending upon designator. For those going subs, they attend nuke school their first year prior to deployment, for those going SWO nuke, they go to nuke school following their first deployment as a regular SWO and then serve their second deployment aboard a carrier working as a SWO nuke.
Y'all are all making me question whether or not my DS should take his scholarship next fall. He began school (an affordable in-state) with 30 hours from dual credit. He has an academic scholarship and we have a small college account. We could scrimp and pay his tuition. He could (if he takes summer classes) start nursing school next fall and graduate at 21. If he stays in ROTC without the scholarship he only owes 3 years? That puts him in grad school at 24 instead of 26 and he will have the GI Bill to pay for grad school? He could be out of grad school by 26?
I'm not familiar with AROTC as DD is in NROTC. In NROTC, if you are not on scholarship, there is not a guarantee that you will be able to commission. After your sophomore year, you have to be selected for "advanced standing" to continue in the program. This year, they only approved eighteen slots nationally to be filled in the class of '17 through advanced standing. I also don't know how nursing runs as in NROTC it is a separate track from the regular students and there are not very many slots. Perhaps someone more familiar with AROTC could answer your question.