Odds of getting pilot slot on 2 year AFROTC Program

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by AFfuturehopeful, Sep 24, 2017.

  1. AFfuturehopeful

    AFfuturehopeful New Member

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    I am coming into college out of high school as a junior. This makes things complicated because it would be silly for me to stay longer than necessary. My plan is to major in philosophy and graduate from college in 2 years from now. My goal is to become a pilot in the air force, however, I would enjoy doing lots of other things if that does not work out. I am wondering if the 2 year AFROTC program will make it harder for me to become a pilot in the big picture. I would appreciate hearing from anyone with some background in this particular area.
     
  2. Wishful

    Wishful "Land of the free, because of the brave..." 5-Year Member

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    The Academy has the greatest # of pilot slots.
     
  3. Humey

    Humey Member

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    That may be true but first, who knows if he would get in, secondly he never said he had the desire to do so and finally he already said he didn't want to go to school for four years . I think Afrotc has a new 2 year program . Since it is relatively new, I would imagine that stats aren't in yet about number of people in that program who get pilot spots . I have to imagine that those who have been in the program since freshman year are going to get higher scores only because those in charge will have a better understanding of the cadet. As a junior, you would have maybe a year to make an impression . If it is a choice between one person who the commander has worked with for 2.5 years compared to a person who has been there for six months , I have to imagine the advantage goes to the first guy .
     
  4. Maplerock

    Maplerock Proud to be an American 5-Year Member

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    Try not to start as a 2nd Lt. You'll advance much faster if you start as a Captain or Major. You could maybe be a General by age 25.
     
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  5. Thunderbolt462

    Thunderbolt462 5-Year Member

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    Class of 2017 for the Academy had 386 pilots. AFROTC had 350. I wouldn't advise going to the Academy just to get a pilot slot. If you want the Academy's rigorous military experience, go for it. If you would prefer an education from a civilian institution, it's not as hard as you would think to get a pilot slot through ROTC. I also wouldn't advise breezing through AFROTC in two years especially graduating high school early. The two-year program is typically designed for students who have already had two or three years of college to get a lot of their coursework done and mature a little bit. You'd be surprised how much you mature in those four years as a cadet and student. Speaking as a fellow humanities major, I'm also not sure how well only two years of philosophy would prepare you for the technical rigors of pilot training where you're competing with men and women 3-4 years older and more experienced than you. The way I see it, you only get one chance at pilot training, so you want to make sure you're fully ready for the grueling experience that it is in order to do well. I personally would regret going early and finishing at the bottom of my class because I didn't spend those extra years solidifying the basics of studying and leadership.
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2017
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  6. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator 5-Year Member

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    So, I'm assuming you're still in high school and graduating this spring with college on tap for the fall. What makes you think you are entering college as a junior? You cannot assume that any college you attend will accept all the college credits you have accrued, from wherever you accrued them. If you already have a particular college in mind and know they will accept these credits, then congratulations on entering college as a junior.
     
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  7. AFfuturehopeful

    AFfuturehopeful New Member

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    Thank you for the advice. Right now I am a freshman in college and trying to decide what major I should do. 70 college credits transferred from high school, leaving me with only a few more credits remaining to get my AA. I must admit that I am very excited to become an officer and more specifically a pilot. Unfortunately I think that this is clouding my decision making. I applied to the Academy last year and missed it by a hair according to my rep, so I am past that. The college I am attending has 4 technical majors and none particularly interest me. What excites me the most is ROTC and my future in the Air Force. There are other older cadets who are entering their as400 year also getting liberal arts degrees, so i assumed it wouldn't hurt. But after hearing the advice it sounds like a technical major would make me more competitive. I am not confident in the idea of me doing philosophy, and really confused about what my next step forward should be with my college career.
     
  8. AROTC-dad

    AROTC-dad Moderator 5-Year Member

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    What did the AFROTC detachment commander at your college recommend?
     
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  9. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator 5-Year Member

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    +1 to AROTC-dad. Also, regarding assumptions... don't assume you're going to complete your major in 2 years because of the credits you've amassed. Not saying you can't do it, but frequently, because of required courses, prereqs, and when particular classes are offered, you will find it impossible to do in two years through no fault of your own. This is perhaps especially true of science and engineering majors. I suggest that once you decide on a major and know what courses will be required, etc. that you map out a plan against the calendar. This way, you would know what you are dealing with. You would need to do this as part of being enrolled in AFROTC anyway.
     
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  10. Humey

    Humey Member

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    Choose you major wisely. Dont choose a tech major because you think it is going to get you a pilot spot. Choose a major you are interested in which will provide you with a career if you becomes a pilot or not. My son younger son went to high school with a kid whose father (was drafted) served as a pilot in the military. Never flew a day after he retired
     
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  11. Tex232

    Tex232 Member

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    Short Answer: your chances are pretty damn good right now. The AF is desperate for aviators and frankly, they're accepting a lot of people that probably aren't qualified to be aviators. With that said, you should have little trouble.
     
  12. Miss Sue

    Miss Sue New Member

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    I got to this thread through a Google search, so forgive me if I'm a bit off the original topic. My son is set to get his AA this December from our local JC. He wants to be a pilot in the Military. He applied to the ASAFA his senior year in high school but did not gain acceptance (even with 2 senatorial recommendations), he applied last year to the Naval Academy, was nominated , done all the required medical and physical requirements but was not chosen.

    He has been attending JC and working to pay/save for college, he would like to be able to do a 2 year Air Force ROTC or Navy ROTC, but he is getting conflicting information in regards to 2 year programs. He has taken Calculus, Chemistry, Physics....so he hasn't been taking it easy ( he started college with over 20 credits from AP and concurrent credit classes). He is also tutoring at the college for Math and Science and is a supplemental instruction aide for an Algebra class---what I'm trying to make clear, is that he chose the JC route to be smart about future college debt, not because he couldn't handle classes at a University . Is there a "transfer" program for a ROTC (Navy or Air Force) or would he have to enlist in the Air Guard/Navy Reserves and use the GI Bill to help pay for college?

    We know Army has a 2 year ROTC, but my daughter is Army (enlisted, Sergeant, she is an MP in a AF community) and she has seen how much better Air Force is treated. I'm not saying Army ROTC is not an option, it's just not a first choice.

    Advice would be greatly appreciated.
     
  13. Humey

    Humey Member

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    Depending on the major, the Air Force does offer 2 year scholarships so the money is available. The bigger issue is him having to compete with the other cadets. My son got a pilot spot around Feb/March of junior year. There are many factors that go into getting chosen for the spot. Some of them are grades, how he does in Field Training and how he does in PT. There are also two Air Force tests that he needs to do well on also. It also helps to have a pilot's license and having over 100 flying hours. My son has 201 which is the max before it stops making any difference. All of these are on him so he is responsible for how he does. The other factor is the recommendation by commander of his detachment. While not being the biggest part of it, it is still a good percentage of his overall resume. That means you son between September and December (m0re or less) of Junior year, is going to have to impress the hell out of the commander. Maybe they have different rules when it comes to 2 year programs, but i have to imagine he will be at a disadvantage compared to those who have been there for a while. Now maybe it is different for these people and they apply for spots in their senior year ,giving them a full year to show what they got. He needs to speak to someone who understand these situations
     
  14. Pima

    Pima 10-Year Member

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    Personally, as a Mom of an AF pilot and a wife of a retired F15E AF WSO. I would say do not THINK about doing this at your age right now.

    The flying world is known to EAT its' young. Great if you can graduate in 2 yrs., but I don't believe you will make it emotionally at UPT when you are only 20 compared to the other students that are entering at 23+. Some UPT students are prior enlisted (@27), some did ED (got their Master & @25), some are OCS, some xtrained from CSO to UPT (@28)
    ~ Maturity/life experiences between 20 and 23 is HUGE, 20 and 25/27/28 is really big.

    When I say they eat their young, it is not said lightly. You will need a very hard skin to make it through UPT. As a Mom of 3. I don't think any of them would have had that skin at 20.
    ~ IPs will tell you daily that you and your class are the worst class they ever saw in all of their years in the AF!
    ~ Bust a test, and it is not like college where you average out the grade. Bust it and tomorrow you will re-take it. Bust it tomorrow and you are gone! Bust is not 50%, it is 80 or 85%. Pass it, GREAT, but realize they are not slowing down for you. While you were studying for the re-take, your classmates were studying for the next test. which will be the day after your re-take.
    ~ Bust a flight and it is the same deal.

    The thing is UPT is an emotional killer. If you can't dust yourself off and say it was a bad day, than you are in trouble. See above about being 20. Please read Raimius's blog (signature line) about UPT life.

    I am sorry if I offended you by stating I think 20 is too young emotionally, but I really do feel that way. My kids are AF brats. My DS did not live at home all 4 yrs in college. Fencers twins were USAFA. Stealths DS was USAFA too. However, the one thing all of us would say is somewhere during their 54 weeks at UPT we received phone calls telling them okay dust yourself off and tomorrow is a new day. They were all 23, not 20.

    Finally, my pet peeve!
    I hate when people state this. Yes, there is a shortage. HOWEVER, the AF is NOT adding anymore UPT bases, nor more UPT IPS, or T1/6/38s into their inventory. Currently the pipeline is producing @1000 pilots a year at full max. The shortage is not from 1st tour op pilots, but the O4 IPSs that are not accepting the bonus and fleeing to become a busdriver in the sky!

    Secondly, AF pilots are required to be FAA FC1 qual'd. As I stated they have a large pool to select from. When they did not have a large pool, they could fight for a waiver, but now if you need a waiver and they have more than enough applicants they can just say NEXT! Because everyone believes that there is such a shortage the pool size is getting larger.

    Next, the way the rated board system works is that a candidate must apply for ALL 4 rated positions. You may place UPT at the top, but they may come back and hit you with CSO or RPA. If you decline that slot the AF will tell you that you will forever be ineligible to apply for UPT. It is a risk.

    Lastly, even today with the shortage, they do not have 100% winging, not even 70%. What they do have is WE OWN YOU. If you bust than you will serve out your commitment as an AF officer flying a desk. Flip side, if you do wing you will owe a decade of your life before you can bolt.
     
  15. Miss Sue

    Miss Sue New Member

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    What are the 2 tests that you speak of? He won't have any problem with the grades, PT or Field Training, he is an athlete and a "farm boy" so he thrives on challenges. He probably won't have his pilot's license, but out of curiosity, how long does that take to acquire? Also, how do you verify that AF has a 2 year ROTC program? I have only found a couple references to it (on the Iowa State web page) and it says that it isn't dependent on his major (which I understand as "he can major in anything he wants, not just the AF tiered majors"...which is not what we know about ROTC.
    Thanks!
     
  16. AROTC-dad

    AROTC-dad Moderator 5-Year Member

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    I believe that @Humey is referring to the Air Force Officer Qualifying Test (AFOQT) and the Basic Attributes Test (BAT).
     
  17. Humey

    Humey Member

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    Yes, I was referring to the AFOTQ and the TBAS (Test of Basic Aviation Skills). They take the TBAS score, add it to the Pilot score from the AFOQT test and mix it with with flying hours and pixie dust and you come up with the PCSM score. I say pixie dust, because no one really understands how the score is really calculated. That number which ranges from 0-99, is a big factor in getting a pilot spot. My son scored a 95 on the Pilot portion of the AFOQT and without any flying hours received a 70 PCSM score. When they added his 201 hours, his score got kicked up to 98 As for pilot license, I cant remember the exact number, but the minimum number of hours to need to get a private pilot license is something like 40. I read the average is something like 71 and my son did in 65 hours or so. He was able to do so because he spent summer before starting college in obtaining his license. I think it is usually takes more than 40 hours because people stretch it over time and more practice is needed to obtain the required results. As for the majors, I think they can major in anything they want. However in order to receive a scholarhip, I think it needs to be a STEM major. My son's degree in in Professional Flight which is basically a fancy way of saying he got a degree in learning how to be a pilot. The Air Force doesnt recognize it as a STEM degree
     
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  18. Wishful

    Wishful "Land of the free, because of the brave..." 5-Year Member

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    Would you please explain how you were able to earn 70 college credits in a HS where you graduated in only 3 years??
     
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  19. DesertCaliMom

    DesertCaliMom Member

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    Pretty easy to do in California, not sure about OP. Concurrent enrollment credits count for double, so 1 semester of college Algebra is a whole year for high school.
     
  20. Wishful

    Wishful "Land of the free, because of the brave..." 5-Year Member

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    12 college credits/semester x 6 semesters in HS might be pretty easy for you!