Off to LDAC

The "everyone gets an S" comment was just passing on what was reported on another forum and not official by any means. Hopefully they are keeping the traditional evaluation process in place for this summer.
 
Vista123 said:
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USNA midshipman son is at CFT at camp Buckner and he arrived with Army ROTC cadets. I think it is about 9 midshipman, 50 ARTOC and the rest WP Rising Yuks
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I think it is awesome that the different branches work together. I know for DS Army was the only way to go and I know many other cadets feel that way about their chosen branch. So I think it is great that they mingle and learn camaraderie. Many a new friendships can be created.
 
gstudent99 said:
I just got a letter from my son at LDAC. He is 6th Regiment so he is halfway through. He sent it on June 28th which makes it relatively up to date.

In it he mentions that his instructors have told him that he is on track for an overall E which would indicate they are still evaluating in some way. This makes me wonder about the comments saying everyone is getting an S.
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The news about the S for all cadets came out on Sunday the 29th, I believe from someone that was going through an inprocessing brief. I would imagine it takes time to make it down to the instructors.

Guess nobody will really know until this whole mess is over.

After hearing that so much of the training has been shortened or cut, shrinking the land nav course and having buddy teams, cutting the APFT and reducing the patrolling way back, I would think it would be difficult to equate E's for the early regiments to E's for the later regiments. Sounds like a mess that will take a while to figure out.

I'm betting cadets will not hear accession results before the first semester ends.
 
LDAC/Accensions

Jcleppe,
I hope you are wrong, but nothing will surprise me...
Hopefully Cadet Command will be upfront with Battalion cadre and Cadets on the timeline, so they can make informed decisions. If it is known early on that announcements will be delayed longer than Thanksgiving, it may cause some cadets who are on the fence for AD/Reserve, to just declare Reserve and move on...Some cadets have families to support, and need to take advantage of Campus placement resources to start action on Plan B...
It doesn't have to cause delays. They just need a prompt decision (before school resumes) on how to handle this small % of OML points related to LDAC.
 
1ST REG HAS THEIR PHONES BACK:thumb:

Just spent a lovely half hour talking with DS son. Highlights-

PT test thrown out, fall diagnostic at schools will be used instead - running area for PT HORRIBLE, mostly gravel with ruts and sand bags filling them, a few cadets with injuries everything from falls/cuts/bruises to a few broken ankels...

The everyone gets an S rule seems to be standing, no RECONDO, most of the rest we're hearing is also true. The new OMS (50% GPA etc...) he's not sure of and says TACs are looking into this too.

Ticks a huge problem and only medic staff allowed to remove - Lyme disease issues and they want to see the actual ticks that are being pulled.

Otherwise - tent city not really to be used any more, taking cadets to barracks at night, schedules being changed to work around heat issues. Afternoons are spent sitting in shade on any day over 90 actual temp.

Will update if I hear from him on any other issues.

Goes without saying - amazing to hear his voice:biggrin:
 
Thanks for the great intel.

I would assume anything dealing with the GPA and OMS scores would not be part of the 2015 class but would start for the 2016 class, but then again I guess anything is possible now.

Glad to hear he made it through ok, bet he can't wait to leave that garden vacation spot.
 
Jcleppe said:
Thanks for the great intel.

I would assume anything dealing with the GPA and OMS scores would not be part of the 2015 class but would start for the 2016 class, but then again I guess anything is possible now.

Glad to hear he made it through ok, bet he can't wait to leave that garden vacation spot.
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Yeah, the vacation spot leaves a lot to be desired. The tent city seems to be the big problem - no air movement due to the spacing of them, yet the tents are the only shade available in that area so you sit in the tent and sweat, sweat outside doing nothing and sweat even more when asked to do any actitivity:rolleyes: He did say water was typically ready available(he's drinking 10-12 liters/day) but still sweating out everything going in. There were a few training locations they had to tote their own water in and this was the only time water wasn't plentiful enough for all of his platoon. PLT 2 only had 2 heat cas., nothing serious - simple heat exhaution(spelling...) that cleared quickly.

He is due to have final counseling tomorrow/next day so maybe there will be some clarification about OMS/accessions for 2015. At least the PT situation seems to have been resolved. DS is thrilled to have a "do over" since he admits the run wasn't a good situation in his case.

He's already to go and head to CTLT out at Ft. Sill - no cooler but hopefully a better living arrangement:wink:
 
A cadet posting on another board stated that he received his counseling this afternoon and received an E, also said that Top 5 was still in effect although Recondo is not being given. Land Nav is still going on but on a much smaller course now only requiring 3 out of 5 points and done with a buddy.

Guess with 1st and 2nd Reg getting their phones back there will be more info to follow.
 
Jcleppe said:
A cadet posting on another board stated that he received his counseling this afternoon and received an E, also said that Top 5 was still in effect although Recondo is not being given. Land Nav is still going on but on a much smaller course now only requiring 3 out of 5 points and done with a buddy.

Guess with 1st and 2nd Reg getting their phones back there will be more info to follow.
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Hope the E rating holds - DS was on track to overall E after first counseling - so maybe he'll hear good news this time too.
 
NorwichDad said:
This will result in "Never trust an officer with a map"
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With the plan to get rid of Battalion FTX and a large number of the Labs, it makes you wonder when and if they will be able to effectively teach Land Nav at the battalion level. If Land Nav is not a large focus at the summer training these cadets will not have much if any experience when they graduate,

I assume Land Nav is a big part of branches such as Infantry, Armour, Field Artillery and so on. It sounds like a lot more effort will need to be shifted to teaching Land Nav during BOLC rather then just evaluating what they know.

Even in Aviation BOLC they had to do Land Nav, just a short review and then out on the course. I shutter to think of the number of new 2LT's that will be lost in the woods during their BOLC.

My younger son went to Winter Mountain Warfare School, if he had not been taught Land Nav and had used it during their FTX, he would have never passed the school, a very extensive Land Nav was a big part of that school. How will cadets be able to pass some of these schools without the practical training at the battalion level.

I guess time will tell.
 
Jcleppe said:
With the plan to get rid of Battalion FTX and a large number of the Labs, it makes you wonder when and if they will be able to effectively teach Land Nav at the battalion level. If Land Nav is not a large focus at the summer training these cadets will not have much if any experience when they graduate,

I assume Land Nav is a big part of branches such as Infantry, Armour, Field Artillery and so on. It sounds like a lot more effort will need to be shifted to teaching Land Nav during BOLC rather then just evaluating what they know.

Even in Aviation BOLC they had to do Land Nav, just a short review and then out on the course. I shutter to think of the number of new 2LT's that will be lost in the woods during their BOLC.

My younger son went to Winter Mountain Warfare School, if he had not been taught Land Nav and had used it during their FTX, he would have never passed the school, a very extensive Land Nav was a big part of that school. How will cadets be able to pass some of these schools without the practical training at the battalion level.

I guess time will tell.
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DS and classmates at Norwich (and I assume most AROTC cadets) worried about Land Nav for LDAC. So they would always discuss with upperclassmen and cadre. They would always train for it. They would research, read and watch videos on their own. They were motivated. And they became very good at it. After all it WAS really important for LDAC Score. The score was important for branching. These cadets worked to make themselves better at for a reason. That reason is gone.

Never trust an officer with a map
 
Spoke with DS (8th Reg) last night. He commented that his Ranger Challenge team will be picking up a lot of the slack as far as teaching tactics, land nav, etc.

It seems there will be a great disparity in knowledge among cadets who commission from different programs, and even cadets within the same program who choose not to avail themselves of the opportunities given them.
 
Jcc123 said:
Spoke with DS (8th Reg) last night. He commented that his Ranger Challenge team will be picking up a lot of the slack as far as teaching tactics, land nav, etc.
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I foresee a lot of "Clubs" popping up in ROTC battalions, Land Nav Club, Patrolling Clubs, Tactical Clubs, and so on.

Just curious, how did you speak with your son, did they get their phones back. LDAC must really be changing, when my older son went through there was no contact allowed until the end when they were given their phones.

Bet it was nice to get a call though, did he have any other news on how things are going there now?
 
I don't think LDAC has changed that much - It was a quick phone call from his TAC's cell phone to request some needed paperwork for follow-on training. We didn't get to chat for long, but yes, it was great to hear from him!
 
Didn't realize that Labs are being cut too. If that's the case then a lot of cadets may lack land navigation skills as everyone previously mentioned.

Although I can see the idea of "land nav" clubs coming about, I'm partly worried about stuff like this affecting bigger Battalions. The nice thing about Lab was that it was mandatory - so everyone would get the same information as everyone else. Changing it so you'd only be able to get instruction via club seems problematic - from a logistics standpoint.

If it's a club event, it's not mandatory. This leads me to believe that, at least a decent chunk of cadets wont participate in the club for one reason or another (ie: class conflict, don't care since it's not mandatory, other commitments,etc).

One possible idea is to host land nav club functions on the weekends. But, it's the weekends; not sure if they'd want to spend an afternoon doing land nav (now granted there will always be those who will take the time out to do so, but others may not for one reason or another). I guess the club could meet during the lab's old time, but we'll see how this all unfolds I guess.

Suffice to say, it will be really interesting to see how ROTC will start to change over the course of the next few years - and eventually big Army.
 
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