Probation academically

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SledgehammerB

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In Plebe year (1st) Semester, very difficult two classes as end of 1st Semester approaches. Picking grades up and maintaining through semester. What is is the Norm , Academic Probation and/or an F in one class. What Assistance - Tutoring ect., to raise class grades is available for New Cadets? Thx for any information. 🇺🇸
 
The rules are spelled out in the Red Book. You can then ‘control F’ for Academic Probation. There are QPA metrics that you have to hit each semester that vary by class year. If you fail a class you are likely to go before the academic board. Ask for advice here. . (You an either re take the class right away or during summer school: STAP). (STAP is great but you don’t get to do as much as you would like like air assault.)
Here is the link to the Redbook.

Good luck. Head in the game. GO FOR AI. ARRANGE FOR TUTORING W THE CEP. If you are struggling w procrastination let me know in a response to this, there is a center that can talk you through that w a few tricks. The secret is to NEVER QUIT. NEVER QUIT. NEVER QUIT. Remember why you are there. It is mid October. You have two more months of school and finals. Do not quit. Do not let a bad class or two make you feel like a loser—it is West Point and academics and life are hard! You will meet all sorts of senior Army leaders who did not earn above a C for the first two years.
HEAD IN THE GAME. ASSESS WHY YOU ARE NOT DOING WELL. SEEK HELP NOW. AI AND TUTORING.
BOTH.
You have plenty of time. Keep going. Write again soon. Let us know how it is going for you.
 
SledgehammerB said:
In Plebe year (1st) Semester, very difficult two classes as end of 1st Semester approaches. Picking grades up and maintaining through semester. What is is the Norm , Academic Probation and/or an F in one class. What Assistance - Tutoring ect., to raise class grades is available for New Cadets? Thx for any information. 🇺🇸
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Get as much AI time as you can with your instructors. Really cannot stress that point enough. Then attend your class/subject study groups. Meet with your Academic Officer as a resource as well. Jefferson Library is full of resources look into them and use them. This scenario is very common and rest assured, more than anything else, you are by no means alone in this situation. Should you be required to meet with an academic review board, you will be able to ensure them that you are making a valid effort to improve your status. Make it clear also that you will STAP any classes you were deficient in not only to improve your academic grade but to improve your overall class rank. Your Plebe year is meant to try you in all ways and this is one of the indicators that it is working. Don't let it consume you. You will be fine. Find peers to study with and to commiserate with. There are strategies. The thing is though, you have to go get the help you need. Remember this, you were chosen for USMA and they believe you are worthy. They are gonna make you work for it though. Just so you know, many of the parents here have also heard these same questions you have from their sons and daughters. Embrace the Suck! It gets better.

Best.
 
DrMom said:
The rules are spelled out in the Red Book. You can then ‘control F’ for Academic Probation. There are QPA metrics that you have to hit each semester that vary by class year. If you fail a class you are likely to go before the academic board. Ask for advice here. . (You an either re take the class right away or during summer school: STAP). (STAP is great but you don’t get to do as much as you would like like air assault.)
Here is the link to the Redbook.

Good luck. Head in the game. GO FOR AI. ARRANGE FOR TUTORING W THE CEP. If you are struggling w procrastination let me know in a response to this, there is a center that can talk you through that w a few tricks. The secret is to NEVER QUIT. NEVER QUIT. NEVER QUIT. Remember why you are there. It is mid October. You have two more months of school and finals. Do not quit. Do not let a bad class or two make you feel like a loser—it is West Point and academics and life are hard! You will meet all sorts of senior Army leaders who did not earn above a C for the first two years.
HEAD IN THE GAME. ASSESS WHY YOU ARE NOT DOING WELL. SEEK HELP NOW. AI AND TUTORING.
BOTH.
You have plenty of time. Keep going. Write again soon. Let us know how it is going for you.
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Thank you, will update.🙏
 
Walman888 said:
Get as much AI time as you can with your instructors. Really cannot stress that point enough. Then attend your class/subject study groups. Meet with your Academic Officer as a resource as well. Jefferson Library is full of resources look into them and use them. This scenario is very common and rest assured, more than anything else, you are by no means alone in this situation. Should you be required to meet with an academic review board, you will be able to ensure them that you are making a valid effort to improve your status. Make it clear also that you will STAP any classes you were deficient in not only to improve your academic grade but to improve your overall class rank. Your Plebe year is meant to try you in all ways and this is one of the indicators that it is working. Don't let it consume you. You will be fine. Find peers to study with and to commiserate with. There are strategies. The thing is though, you have to go get the help you need. Remember this, you were chosen for USMA and they believe you are worthy. They are gonna make you work for it though. Just so you know, many of the parents here have also heard these same questions you have from their sons and daughters. Embrace the Suck! It gets better.

Best.
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Thank you🇺🇸
 
Our DS at WP is going through the same thing as a yuck, but possibly has three F in academic classes. He’s doing good in his military ones. He did good his plebe year. Will he get probation and be able to retake the F classes or would they separate him? Thanks
 
I’m so sorry to hear this as a fellow parent. I think this year is ESPECIALLY challenging. But it’s challenging everywhere. Hopefully he is seeking out help. From professors, etc, the obvious. But something else that’s helpful for an overall outlook are the chaplains. They are confidential and tuned in to the current climate. A great resource!! And you don’t have to be a person of faith...they aren’t going to try and convert anyone. But are helpful in guiding. Listening. Directing. I think sometimes a person can get themselves into such a hole they don’t see any way out.

And, BTW, they are an excellent resource for parents, too. They are amazing.

Hugs, I feel like this year there are going to be a few that aren’t going to want to go back once home on break. Many of my Mids buddies at State U are taking next semester off...online virtual isolated learning just isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.

The GOOD NEWS? I think change is on the way. Back to “precedents times”.
 
justdoit19 said:
I’m so sorry to hear this as a fellow parent. I think this year is ESPECIALLY challenging. But it’s challenging everywhere. Hopefully he is seeking out help. From professors, etc, the obvious. But something else that’s helpful for an overall outlook are the chaplains. They are confidential and tuned in to the current climate. A great resource!! And you don’t have to be a person of faith...they aren’t going to try and convert anyone. But are helpful in guiding. Listening. Directing. I think sometimes a person can get themselves into such a hole they don’t see any way out.

And, BTW, they are an excellent resource for parents, too. They are amazing.

Hugs, I feel like this year there are going to be a few that aren’t going to want to go back once home on break. Many of my Mids buddies at State U are taking next semester off...online virtual isolated learning just isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.

The GOOD NEWS? I think change is on the way. Back to “precedents times”.
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Thank you for your kinds words and advice. He’s doing the AI and extra things, but still having a difficult time. It’s the isolation that is also hard for him and has an affect. He’s always a good student or else he wouldn’t be there. He has also considered a different path. Praying for the best for him and all cadets.
 
cvdo10 said:
Our DS at WP is going through the same thing as a yuck, but possibly has three F in academic classes. He’s doing good in his military ones. He did good his plebe year. Will he get probation and be able to retake the F classes or would they separate him? Thanks
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Good Evening, I am so very sorry. Listen, do not lose hope. EVER. I know a lot about this sort of thing--and I know how your heart may be aching right now for the uncertainty and the separation.

It is hard to be at home and they are struggling at school-especially this year when we have not seen them since July. There is so much going on. So, this is how it works--and please read the Red Book, I describe how to find it earlier in this thread--First, welcome your kid home...and take the time to relax. Next, prepare for the academic board. He has the ability to write a letter in which he describes why he did not do well and what he did not do well--and also WHAT HE WILL DO DIFFERENTLY TO MAKE IT BETTER--and last but most importantly, he needs to remind the Dean of the Academic Board that he wants to be a West Point graduate and he wants to be an Army officer--because if not that, then what is the point? (So, he writes a very formal letter). Then, he can ask his TAC and his teachers (so he needs to bring home his school laptop and ask his professors NOW) to write letters of support for him. If he is in a club or a sport, the coach can write a letter of support. (They will know what to say). Then the PACKET (not your cadet, just the cadet's packet) goes to the Academic Board and is reviewed. Your cadet will receive feedback from the board through his TAC. Also, your cadet should reach out to the USMA Registrar for advice. He should make a visit NOW before he heads home on Sunday.

At the minimum, your cadet will have to repeat those three classes. Some in the academic year and some during summer school. Hello Summer School (Called STAP...they do PT and go to classes, that start the week of graduation.) This is not an impossible number of classes to make up and graduate on time.

However, he could also be turned into a December grad or turned back a year (a one year delay), which seems like the end of the world, but it is not. Eye on the prize.

Your cadet could also be separated for good (unlikely if he had a good plebe year--look at the RedBook for the GPA cut off points) but he could also get 'Separation with Readmission'--in which case he will be separated, spend a semester and summer at home (during which I strongly suggest he spend his time working out and TAKING CLASSES AT COMMUNITY COLLEGE IN THE SUBJECTS HE FAILED) AND re-applying completely to West Point (yep, the essays, the physical, the CFT, the nomination...everything.) If this happens to your cadet, just send me a message and we can talk on the phone. (If he is accepted again--and the plan when they do this is that the kids will be back--the first day is an APFT--so your kid better be working out like crazy at home because if he fails the APFT, they will send him packing with no mercy. We have seen it happen and it is horrible.) I wonder if the Academic Board will be generous to cadets who fail classes because of the unusual nature of this academic semester with all of the restrictions. We will see.

So, that is everything I know. Again, let's hope your cadet pulls out a D or two or three or surprises you. However, Stats, Chem, Physics, etc are hard classes. Importantly, this is both not the end of the world and not the end of your cadet's West Point journey. There is a lot of time and a lot of options. You all are not alone. Stay strong, keep faith. Beat Navy.
 
Also, because I am feeling the love & just posted this on the West Point Moms FB page. Here is the link to the RedBook: https://www.westpoint.edu/academics/curriculum
If you search for 'Probation' it will take you to the academic point thresholds and the procedures for the Academic Board and describe Academic Probation. I would like to share that a cadet that I love very much has been very well suited for this 'stay on post/quarantine' life because of so many semesters spent on academic probation. ❤️ (Allow me to also say that the other cadet who taught me how to be the mother of a cadet managed to swing a 'Best in Class' award every term, graduate in the top of his class, and go straight to grad school on a scholarship...Just a completely different journey--with a lot of praying different prayers.)
 
bookreader said:
My son lived this motto. He loved WP for the military training but he just isn't an academically oriented kid. He ended up with the branch he wanted, so he doesn't regret his gpa.
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It’s also a choice to some as well. Quality of life. Nothing wrong with it, either imo. You only get one chance to live your best life!!
 
Just to be a little more compassionate, the super smart, high achieving young men and women who become West Point cadets are not used to failing. Getting C's, D's, and F's is frustrating and humiliating. We can make pithy statements like, '2.0 and go' or 'Hey the Goat gets all that money'--and is celebrated but no one wants to be at the bottom of the class or be on the painful journey that lands him or her in the 'Comma Club'...(Class rank so low, you have a comma in it...so below 1,000)...It is important that these cadets and their parents understand that they are not alone, that USMA has 'full grade replacement' for any class retaken--so get a 'D' or 'F' the first time but get a 'C' or 'B' the second time and that is the number that goes into your GPA (or QPR...)...other academic programs average the original grade with the new grade. None of these cadets wish to fail. So, hang in there cadets--and parents.
 
SledgehammerB said:
In Plebe year (1st) Semester, very difficult two classes as end of 1st Semester approaches. Picking grades up and maintaining through semester. What is is the Norm , Academic Probation and/or an F in one class. What Assistance - Tutoring ect., to raise class grades is available for New Cadets? Thx for any information. 🇺🇸
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First, I understand you are in a difficult situation, but it's not the end of the world.
Second, take a deep breath and stay strong/positive/motivated.
Third, if you are on probation, you lose some privileges but plebes don't really have many privileges and Covid is still a thing, so I think you won't really notice a difference in life.

If you fail one class, you generally retake it next semester or over STAP, so you still have opportunities to recover. Reach out to your classmates, team/squad leader, platoon sergeant, any Firsties. Go to AI or CEP in the library. Have a notebook/tracker and record dates you met with each person with a brief description of what you guys went over. This way, if there ever is a board, you have something to prove that you are working hard in trying to do better.

Keep in mind that just because your plebe year grades don't end the way you originally hoped, you still have the rest of your cadet career to do well. Once you get into your major, you will take classes you enjoy. You will have other physical classes, in which maybe you are gifted physically. Many more military grades from different leadership positions/trainings. WP is a marathon of MANY obstacles/hills. It's going to be a long and difficult run, but try to find ways to enjoy it. It will make the experience better.
 
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I hope most of you realize the OP has not been on the forum since 22 Oct 2019.
 
Capri120 said:
I hope most of you realize the OP has not been on the forum since 22 Oct 2019.
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Yea, maybe I should've looked at the post date 🤷‍♂️ maybe OP hasn't logged in since then and is just lurking. Whatever the case, hopefully what I said is helpful to OP or anyone else going through similar situations. Academic deficiencies can last a long time and flag someone for many months.
 
DrMom said:
Just to be a little more compassionate, the super smart, high achieving young men and women who become West Point cadets are not used to failing. Getting C's, D's, and F's is frustrating and humiliating. We can make pithy statements like, '2.0 and go' or 'Hey the Goat gets all that money'--and is celebrated but no one wants to be at the bottom of the class or be on the painful journey that lands him or her in the 'Comma Club'...(Class rank so low, you have a comma in it...so below 1,000)...It is important that these cadets and their parents understand that they are not alone, that USMA has 'full grade replacement' for any class retaken--so get a 'D' or 'F' the first time but get a 'C' or 'B' the second time and that is the number that goes into your GPA (or QPR...)...other academic programs average the original grade with the new grade. None of these cadets wish to fail. So, hang in there cadets--and parents.
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I think it hardly shows a lack of compassion. I know quite well the struggle as a college student. I took time off to enlist in the reserves because I had to. I was on academic probation and either had to attend a community college or take time off before returning. I took the enlistment route as a forced "kick in the rear" as I feared the CC route might lead me down a path of no return.
Even then it was an uphill battle. I had to make the dean's list my first semester back to even qualify for ROTC and to get off probation. I fought and clawed for every .01 improvement in GPA. To this day I'm not sure how I got Aviation branch and active duty. If I wasn't the last one selected I was close to it. Or perhaps they mixed up my file with someone else's.
Thirty-five years later I pay the price for goofing off my first two years. Some companies in my industry require a 3.0 GPA, or a 2.5 for graduates of Ivy Leagues and SAs. This is not a "maybe". Your application does not even make it past the computer screening if you don't meet those minimums.
I've watched academic struggles as a parent as well. One, a direct entry from the ranks. struggled the first year due to being away from academics. The spring was tough as well, doing distance learning.
But I try to pass on the lessons I learned. Every .01 can make a difference. In graduating. In branching. In assignments. Who knows where else. Fight and claw to the finish. Never give up.
 
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