Service obligation across SAs

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usmagirl118

Member
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Jun 22, 2020
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152
Hi All,

Please correct me if I am reading something wrong

USMA: 5 years AD plus 3 years in Reserve
USAFA: 5 years AD plus 3 years in Reserve
USNA: 5 years AD, no Reserve

Am I reading this correct if no additional commitment due to Aviation etc?
 
Understand that what you are listing as RESERVE is not 100% correct. What you are classifying as RESERVE is really inactive ready reserve or IRR. This is a bucket of separated military personnel who potentially be recalled to Active Duty under serious circumstances. This could be a major war, it could be medical personnel to assist with COVID, it could be any number of special situations but it is RARE. Typically, you are not a card carrying member and you are not collecting a check.

During my time in IRR, I was given orders to participate in 1 mass-recall drill at a base 3-hours away from where I was living. It was a 1-day thing and there were various OUT clauses that would excuse me if I had a legit conflict. The intent is to have a tier of trained and qualified people who could be brought back into the service during a time of national crisis. Once you are complete with your IRR time, you are considered fully out. IRR time is very different than being a military reservist who does one weekend a month and two weeks per year in uniform.

However, if you were fully out and WWIII broke out - we likely all would raise our hand again or expect Uncle Sam to come calling to ask for a voluntary recall.

www.military.com

Trump's IRR Recall Order: What You Need to Know

Will you be recalled to active service?
www.military.com www.military.com
 
So I get it right, it is going to be IRR for 3 years? So this IRR is different from non-IRR where you serve 1 weekend a month for 3 years in order to meet your SA obligation?
 
I would add here that USMA experimented with a 6yr commitment for the Class of 2024 - some applicants were surveyed and those who said they would still attend did get a 6 year service commitment from what I understand.

There are additional service commitment details to understand, and it varies by school so I can only comment on USAFA.

Students attending USAFA who graduate and enter a non-pilot career field incur a 5 year service commitment and 3 years in IRR.
Students attending USAFA who graduate and enter a pilot career field incur a 10 year service commitment and 3 years in IRR.

Historically, should a student go onto graduate school program funded by the Government either immediately after USAFA or any time during their Active Duty career, you will add 2-for-1 to your commitment. For example, if you attended a Masters Degree program for 18months, you would tack on 3 years to your service commitment. These things are served concurrently, but realize you just spent 18 months of your 5 year commitment in school again. So a graduate in the class of 2024 would expect to complete their service commitment in 2029. However, if they went to grad school for 18months during that time, their service commitment would extend to 2032. The student then went onto earn a PhD and their service commitment was extended to.... There are multiple ways to go to grad school and they impact service commitment differently - government funded full time (i.e. it is your job again to be a student), self-funded nights and weekends, and a time-out to leave the service while you pursue your degree on your own and return. Needless, to say -- it depends.

"What is the Air and Space Forces commitment after graduation?
Although the length of commitment depends on a cadet’s career and other opportunities, including graduate or medical school, all graduates must serve at least five years on active duty and three as inactive reserve after graduation. Graduates who complete pilot training have a longer service commitment. The Department of the Air Force policy in effect when newly-graduated second lieutenants enter flight training determines the length of their commitment, which is currently 10 years after completion of training."

www.usafa.edu

Frequently Asked Questions

www.usafa.edu www.usafa.edu

USMA lengthens service obligation to 6 yrs??

I received my appointment to USMA 2024 yesterday. LGT Williams's letter, sent along with the BFE, says "Graduates are obligated to serve on Active duty as Army officers for at least six years after graduation." Do other people have to same wording on their appointment letter? I have not had...
www.serviceacademyforums.com
 
USNA has the same obligation, 5 years active duty, 3 years IRR. IRR is different the Reserve. You do not drill 1 weekend a month, 2 weeks a year. You might get recalled for a muster check in that is a few hours long. It is there in case of war and extra service members are needed. The Marine Corps did this during the height of Iraq and Afghanistan in the Mid-2000s. They recalled some critically short MOSs.

Also remember things like aviation contracts, in the Army there are some additional things to allow Branch/Base picks that extend obligations, follow on grad school and a variety of other things that can extend a commitment. As you progress things like specialty schools and PCS moves can add a commitment throughout your career.
 
usmagirl118 said:
Hi All,

Please correct me if I am reading something wrong

USMA: 5 years AD plus 3 years in Reserve
USAFA: 5 years AD plus 3 years in Reserve
USNA: 5 years AD, no Reserve

Am I reading this correct if no additional commitment due to Aviation etc?
Click to expand...
USNA has the same three years Reserve. Its actually federal law that places a total 8 year obligation on everyone and the services over the years have settled on the five and three. The IRR described above is non-pay. If you choose to affiliate with an active reserve unit, you'll get paid and accrue what can be a significant pension benefit. In practice, the five years is more of a starting point than an exact date due to personal timing factors for instance, you could be scheduled to be deployed when your five years are up and feel an obligation to bring your people safely home or meet other requirements. Actually you need to submit a request to be released from active duty well in advance of your "date". As my five year point approached, I was headed overseas as Navigator of a large ship and we ended up in the middle of the Lebanese Civil War. I didn't want to leave Active Duty right from an overseas deployment as I wanted to have a chance to job hunt, etc so I waited and returned from deployment and transferred to shore duty where I was able to catch my breath, job hunt, AND THEN leave active duty at the 7 year point with a transfer directly to a Reserve Unit that I had found and applied to. I then stayed a reservist for another 20 years which was, interesting, rewarding ($) and something that I'm very proud of.
 
usmagirl118 said:
Hi All,

Please correct me if I am reading something wrong

USMA: 5 years AD plus 3 years in Reserve
USAFA: 5 years AD plus 3 years in Reserve
USNA: 5 years AD, no Reserve

Am I reading this correct if no additional commitment due to Aviation etc?
Click to expand...
I certain that the USNA commitment is 5 years AD, 3 years IRR ust like the other academies and the NROTC commitment. Unfortunately I can't find a primary source for it. You'd think it would jump off the page somewhere.

EDIT: Cross posted with multiple folks.
 
Ok, so assuming no other additional commitments ( grad school, aviation, ed delay etc etc) a 3 year IRR is for all SAs.
Thank you for the clarifications today. I was under the impression that 3 year reserve service for SA cadets meant 1 weekend/month and 2 weeks/year obligation.

So theoretically, someone on IRR may never have to go back again once out. Correct?
If someone choses to be active Reservist after 5 year obligation, then it's a different scenario altogether.
 
usmagirl118 said:
Ok, so assuming no other additional commitments ( grad school, aviation, ed delay etc etc) a 3 year IRR is for all SAs.
Thank you for the clarifications today. I was under the impression that 3 year reserve service for SA cadets meant 1 weekend/month and 2 weeks/year obligation.

So theoretically, someone on IRR may never have to go back again once out. Correct?
If someone choses to be active Reservist after 5 year obligation, then it's a different scenario altogether.
Click to expand...
You are correct, in theory. Fingers crossed there is no shortage in your branch and no wars!
 
Also, service commitment can vary by branch. USMA Cyber is currently a six-year AD commitment, and that may be increasing. Aviation is another branch that incurs longer service from the various academies.
 
As pointed out IRR carries no normal obligation. While it counts for time in service it does not count towards retirement unless you earn enough points by “drilling” in a year. Details of the IRR vary by service, but if you desire you can see about picking up “musters” and earning points toward a “good year” for retirement.
Widespread call ups of the IRR are not common, but sometimes they will ask for volunteers. Or do short call ups for exercises, or perhaps call up certain specialities. While on active duty I once participated in an exercise (Team Spirit), that had me go through a mobilization and deployment to Korea for a 2 week exercise. I was an active duty volunteer as my DW was based in Korea so it gave me a free trip to see her. However, most of the people at the mobilization site were IRR, most volunteers, some “voluntold”. I think even the non volunteers could have gotten out of it with a minor excuse. I know there were Army, Air Force and Marines involved.
But again, that’s unusual.
Again, this obligation is for the “five and dive”. If you stay in longer the IRR obligation diminishes. But... when you get out the military will put you in the IRR unless you specifically tell them you don’t want to and want a clean break. I know more than a few who didn’t pay attention to this and later got a surprise letter in the mail.
 
Would somebody be allowed to transfer to another branch of the military after the initial 5 years?
 
KiwiBird said:
Would somebody be allowed to transfer to another branch of the military after the initial 5 years?
Click to expand...
The first thing to keep in mind is the needs of a particular service drive all things. And, what is true this year may not be in existence or different 9 years down the road. The losing service must be able to afford to lose your skills in your year group, and the gaining service must have holes to fill.

There are interesting programs out there. It happens. Here’s an example:

m.goarmy.com

Find Your Career in the U.S. Army

Whether you’re interested in Army Reserve or Active Duty, there are many ways to serve in the Army. Explore the possible Army careers and contact an Army Recruiter.
m.goarmy.com m.goarmy.com

You also have to think about having five+ years invested in knowing how to fit into one culture, and being at a certain point in a professional path, and coming into another service strange to you where you are playing catch-up ball. Age can occasionally be a factor.

Some people do one field in one service for x years, get out, use their post-9/11GI Bill to get another degree, apply to come back into the same or another service. I have seen a prior enlisted Marine come back as a Navy chaplain, a Navy dentist who was a Marine helo pilot, Navy sub officer who became an AF dermatologist and so on. In a truly unusual career path, one of our USNA sponsor sons went Navy air, switched to Marine air because they were running short of bodies (this is truly a once-in-blue-moon thing), went to the rank of Major as a Marine pilot, and then got out and was picked up as full-time Air National
Guard pilot wearing AF blue.
 
There are other circumstances that can change things, as well. Back in 1991, the Army was trying to draw down forces and were looking for junior officer who would volunteer to get out earlier than their initial active duty obligation. I got out after just 3 years and 4 month and did the rest of my 8-year commitment in the IRR. I was shocked to get a letter telling me I was promoted to Captain while in the IRR, too! I didn't even know that could happen.
 
KiwiBird said:
Would somebody be allowed to transfer to another branch of the military after the initial 5 years?
Click to expand...
Are you asking branch or service? In the Army we consider branches to be parts of the Army (infantry, aviation, cyber,... etc). Services are Army, Air Force, Navy, Marines and Coast Guard. Should we add the Space Force now?
Within the Army it is sometimes possible to change your branch as a Lieutenant, and sometimes it’s planned. A newly commissioned 2LT might be branched quartermaster but detailed to armor for a few years. They would initially serve in armor, then go to the Quartermaster Captain Career Course and switch over to Quartermaster.
Each year Aviation branch normally takes some lieutenants from other branches.
Transferring to another service is not all that uncommon either. Sometimes you actually transfer, but most times there is a break, even if for a day.
I’ve know Army officers who have transferred to the Air Force (active and reserve) and Coast Guard. The Navy isn’t as common but it happens (a West Point graduate and former Army pilot just took over command of an aircraft carrier). It will probably become more rare for pilots due to the increased ADSO and the age cut off. Sometimes there is a waiver for that, sometimes there isn’t. But I know a bunch of Air Force pilots who started out as Army pilots.
Normally when you do these transfers you have to have enough “age” left to advance. If you are a O-3/4 the Coast Guard would make you revert to an O-2 I believe, but this was to help you as you would need to learn the Coast Guard way of doing things before advancing to O-4 billets.
Also, it sometimes happens after additional schooling such as medical schools or some other skill set a service might Ned. I know Army docs who started out in the Navy, Air Force docs who started out in the Army... you name it.
So yes. It happens. But it’s not something I would count on.
 
Last edited:
Too late to edit. A couple addendums.
1. If I didn’t make it clear, aside from a few exceptions it’s not common in the Army to change branches.
2. The Army does often take people from other branches and services for their warrant officer flight school track. I’ve known a number of Army WOs from other services over the years. But I would roll this into the “specialty” column.
 
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