THE END OF THE LINE...

usnagrad1988 -- I think I know how you feel. Been betrayed by the school you love. Took me a while to get over it.

Our story. DS was headed to USAFA, My wife (his mom) and I are both USAFA '83 grads. He had gone to USAFA football games as an infant and toddler. His uncle and aunt are USAFA grads. In his case, USAFA admissions wanted him bad. He had gone to Summer Seminar and loved it. Had a great record with great SAT scores, great athletics and leadership. Had interest from the football team. They were going to offer an early appointment using his Presidential Nom . . . then DoDMERB happened. We told the truth about a slight reaction to pistachios when he was 6 and he was DQ'd and USAFA docs denied a medical waiver. Absolutely crushed him and us. He had wanted USAFA since 7th grade. He then found out Army gives medical waiver for his condition, so he switched everything over to USMA and AROTC. He really wanted to serve as an officer in the military. He got one of the MOC nominations from Northern VA to USMA, but no appt. (USMA never submitted him for the waiver, but they kept him on the line until late April/early May). The good news is he was awarded one of the ~600 4 yr AROTC scholarships and he chose to use it at VMI. (Army Cadet Command granted the medical waiver.) Why do I tell you all this? My DS is where he was meant to be. He is thriving at VMI. Very tough school and he is thriving. Majoring in Physics. He even walked on to the football team. I am so proud. No doubt, you will be too. Your DS may reapply to USNA . . . he may just knock the lights out at Auburn.

Best wishes to you and your DS for his NROTC scholarship, his time at Auburn or whatever he decides, and his Navy career.
 
USNANOLE said:
I really appreciate reading your input and commentary over the past month I have been a member of this forum. Did they indicate what they consider to be too qualified for NAPs and Foundation?
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His grades and ACT were too high. They said he fell in that "middle" area. As a financial guy it reminds me of when people wanted to refi their houses that were underwater a few years ago, but the banks said, "you have to stop paying your mortgage for a few months and be a potential foreclosure candidate" to do so. My brother and I both went to NAPS for grade and SAT improvement, unfortunately my son was "too good," but didn't fit the final mix of what USNA was looking for.
 
Thanks for all the well wishes. When I posted yesterday, I hadn't talked to my son yet. We had a long conversation last night. He went through many emotions. Like someone else mentioned on the post, who had a similar lineage with the Air Force Academy, when you have focused your plans since the 7th grade, to get in, it's hard to comprehend the rejection notice. He knows how proud I am of his ROTC scholarship plus another 24K from Auburn to add to that, so I told him I feel sad his plans were altered, but that I feel mad about my alma mater. They truly are losing out on a great kid. He deserves to go there way more than I ever did.

It burns me up when I read such superficial posts on this forum, like: "I've been accepted to all 3 SAs, help me decide which one to go to. I think Navy's uniforms are cool..." Kids like that have no clue, respect, or gratitude for what they've been offered versus someone who has focused on this for 6 years.

I also think USNA is damaging the legacy support structure for donations and other support from alumni. Notre Dame has a 24% legacy acceptance and USNA is less than 5%. As long as they are taking into account race, ethnicity and gender, they might as well add in legacy as a significant component (all else being equal). While I will continue to go to reunions and be proud of my accomplishment, I won't ever be able to view USNA the same way and provide the same level of excitement and support for potential applicants that I once had. Not really sour grapes, but a realistic look at the process.

ON A POSITIVE NOTE... this could be a whole new post, but when my wife and I talked about NROTC late last night, the realization came about how different things will be than what we were expecting:
1. No reporting on June 30
2. We'll be packing up the Suburban with "regular college" stuff, refrigerator and all the extras. USNA you just show up. They give you underwear and your tooth brush, etc.
3. He'll have to manage his schedule and make decisions. USNA tells you were to be and how to dress 99.9% of the time.
4. Vacations and leave will be a lot easier. USNA completely controls your time off. I remember going to ProDev to see about getting my brother (USNA '90) a different summer period off so he could be the Best Man in my wedding. The LT said, "Tough luck, needs of the Navy."
5. He'll have a choice in finding a roommate versus being assigned one.
6. He noted that he always imagined getting up early every day for class and military duties. Now he can schedule classes at 10 am if he wants to.

Anyway... thanks again to all. Good luck to those still waiting to hear. I'll be leaving this part of the forum and going over to the ROTC part! :)
 
I, also, would like to say sorry for the disappointment. I wouldn't doubt that USNA is losing out on a great kid. No one can blame you on how you perceive USNA...I think any alumnus, in your shoes, would at least feel some of the emotions you are going through, regardless of how much we know about the process.

In addition to the benefits you listed (the tradeoffs), there is the opportunity to re-apply (an option), and if that is not the course, he will make many friends (NROTC and alike) at AU, and ultimately, commission into the same exact organization. The 4-star ADM AU alum, is a VERY well respected leader among many officers. He got to where he is today by hard work and outstanding leadership, not by graduating on the Severn.

It burns me up when I read such superficial posts on this forum, like: "I've been accepted to all 3 SAs, help me decide which one to go to. I think Navy's uniforms are cool..." Kids like that have no clue, respect, or gratitude for what they've been offered versus someone who has focused on this for 6 years.
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I could not agree with you more! Seriously. Many months ago, I posted something very similar...candidates needs to be cautious on how they post with multiple appointments (and even just one). Sometimes the information isn't even necessary to the question being asked. For the exact reason you stated, discretion/respect needs to be considered when posting "I have multiple appointments" or words to that affect. Some candidates are very competitive, who aren't in the same luxury, and would do triple back flips for an appointment.
 
If a zoomie may intrude again . . .

usnagrad1988 said:
He deserves to go there way more than I ever did.
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I felt exactly the same way with my DS. He is a better athlete with higher SATs than I ever was. (Don't tell him that ;))

I got lucky. I got into USAFA coming from Kentucky. He had to compete to get in from Northern Virginia.

usnagrad1988 said:
While I will continue to go to reunions and be proud of my accomplishment, I won't ever be able to view USNA the same way and provide the same level of excitement and support for potential applicants that I once had. Not really sour grapes, but a realistic look at the process.
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I'm right there with you. I'm very proud of being a USAFA grad. Worked hard to get in. Worker harder to graduate; but our money and our support now goes to VMI.

On the process, it has become important to me to try and get the message out that gaining an appointment is a bit like winning the lotto, but you only get to play after you've worked really hard to get into the game -- and that in the end, somewhere between 2400-3000 of you are in the finals but only 1200 will get a ticket.

The main message is, if you get one, don't be smug -- be grateful and use the opportunity. Even if you have multiple nominations and/or appointments to multiple SAs, that may be more related to the competitiveness (or reduced competitiveness) of the area you are coming from, than due to your "superior" record. For instance, in Northern Virginia, the MOCs will not let you apply to multiple SAs. You can only apply to one, and they will coordinate with each other so no one gets more than one nomination. Absolutely be proud you got an appointment, but don't assume you tower over those that didn't. Be humble. And when you start to get destructively cynical while serving as a midshipman or cadet at the SA, think back and remember how lucky you were to get the opportunity.

If you were in the "qualified academically and in physical aptitude" group but don't get one, know that it isn't a reflection on you. It is the process.

usnagrad1988 said:
I'll be leaving this part of the forum and going over to the ROTC part!
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I have learned so much on the ROTC part from Pima and Kinnem and others . . . and of course still learning. The major things I learned is how ROTC is more "order of merit based" for a national scholarship selection since there isn't a geographic/nomination factor like at the SAs, and how getting such a scholarship, especially a 4 yr scholarship, typically takes a SA quality record. The quality of the ROTC experience I think has more variables that can affect it (quality of unit, school, instructors, etc.) vs the SA experience. I also think for the ROTC experience a lot will depend on the student staying motivated and avoiding the distractions. DS has just started his AROTC journey . . . RAT Line now completed and finishing up freshman year. So far, it has been a pretty good year.
 
Our family was right there with you at this time last year. My husband is an USNA grad, and had a lot of the same feelings as you did when our son was not accepted. He definitely felt our son was much more qualified than he ever was. Take some time, absorb it, then get excited about NROTC and the scholarships!! My son loves it, he is doing well and has not looked back. He feels he has the best of both worlds and yes there are a lot of positives! good luck!
 
So sorry to hear the news. I cannot add anything else to what has already been said. Auburn/ROTC will be a better place with your DS attending. Good luck to him.
 
I read something a year ago on this forum that really resonated with me. A USNA grad commented that his 4 years at Navy were spent with two thoughts : How'd that guy get in? and How'd I get in? As the mom of a current Foundation kid I bristle when I read "he's too qualified for NAPs or Foundations" because we were told a lot of it comes down to "the slate " and in fact many 3Qs go into Foundations. And. . .Foundations kids fare the best of any group entering USNA over the four years. I understand your disappointed but no need to dis another group.
 
nodiva said:
I read something a year ago on this forum that really resonated with me. A USNA grad commented that his 4 years at Navy were spent with two thoughts : How'd that guy get in? and How'd I get in? As the mom of a current Foundation kid I bristle when I read "he's too qualified for NAPs or Foundations" because we were told a lot of it comes down to "the slate " and in fact many 3Qs go into Foundations. And. . .Foundations kids fare the best of any group entering USNA over the four years. I understand your disappointed but no need to dis another group.
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Asking "how" or "why" others got in is a no-win exercise. Unless you are an admissions officer, YOU WILL NEVER KNOW! Speculation just fuels bad feelings and gossip.

Eventually most of the folks who got TWE's will commission one way or another. They might reapply to USNA, graduate from an NROTC program or go OCS.

I agree that indirectly or directly "dissing" a group, whether they are NAPS, minorities, or other genders is certainly not productive because ultimately upon commissioning, they ALL belong to one group: Ensigns in the United States Navy.
 
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The first question the B&G officers wanted to know was how badly did my DS want the academy. Would he try again next year if he was rejected? How many times would he try? Had he applied for the NROTC scholarship? They weren't testing him, they were preparing him. They made it abundantly clear that a great kid has no guarantees. They have no control or insight, just experience to offer. They just wanted to make sure he would try again. The fact that you DS/DD was in the hunt at all means there was some reason for that. 2021 is going to be blessed with kids who tried next year. It is not surprising that the kids who have to try twice or three times, go to Foundation or NAPS programs do so well when they get to the academy.
 
usnagrad1988 said:
Well, it has been fun everyone. Thanks for your input and comments since January. Checked the portal this afternoon (1:30 pm) like always and this time it was different. I had to do a double take...
"Turned down by USNA"
:blowup:
Since I have been having dialogue via e-mail with our Regional Officer over the past year, after meeting with him in person during my son's Junior Year, when we went to the Army-Navy game, I put a call into him to get his feedback. Mostly the party line, but he confirmed that my son is in that middle group that is qualified, but too qualified to go to NAPS or Foundation. So.... he is going to be an Auburn Tiger with his NROTC Scholarship plus another $24,000 they awarded him in scholarship $$$. Not sure that he will reapply or not. My guess is that he will make a lot of friends and will have fun being at a "regular" college, to want to start over. In this day and age, performance in the fleet trumps USNA vs ROTC, plus he's been in Sea Cadets for years and went through a 2 week Special Warfare SEAL training last summer and earned his Trident pin (authorized by the SEAL community), so he already has a leg up on military bearing and gone through training tougher than Plebe Summer.

Wishing all the best to those still in the process AND those already accepted, good luck and enjoy the experience!

Go Navy - War Eagle!
:groupwave:
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War Eagle!! Proud alum '92. My son got a TWE from USNA about 3 weeks ago. It was a bad day. My daughter is at Auburn and she loves it. My son received $32k tuition scholarship from Auburn. He was planning on reapplying after his freshman year. I really don't think he would have. Auburn is a great place and he would be a 4th generation graduate. He was fortunate to receive an appointment from USMMA. It is hard knowing he will not attend Auburn, he grew up Orange and Blue. Even swapped knuckles with Cam at Tiger Walk the first game of 2010. Be proud he's at Auburn. WDE!!
 
My DS had the dream of attending USMA since 5th grade, applied last year and got denied by all academies. He has Army and AF ROTC scholarships and been accepted to several universities, that would have cost only several thousand a year to attend. We visited NMMI and NW Prep. After a lot of conversations and advice who told us our DS was so close, we (he) chose to pursue his dream, turned down the scholarships (gulp), and go to NW Prep. I told him I'd hate for him to get to me my age, and look back with regret of not pursuing his dream. He went to NW Prep, worked incredibly hard, road the roller coaster with nominations (a very competitive district in CA), and this year he received an appointment. I've been amazed at how many people I've met to this point who took at least two and three attempts to get in. I know it is very easy for me to say, but if it's your dream, don't ever give up.
 
My son graduated from Auburn University and Commissioned in Dec. 2016. He loved his time at Auburn NROTC. See how much he grew and learned from the Unit at Auburn, I'm sure your son will have a great experience. My son is now in Japan and loving his Navy life. WAR EAGLE
 
Wishing you all the best but have no fear. The best two officers on my ship are not USNA grads, and after all that is what we are here for, to become Naval Officers.
 
'88...can't privately e-mail you yet as I'm still too new to the forum.

Colleague's son had similar circumstance...without repeating the same song and dance, both he and his brother (1 year younger) are now both NROTC scholarships at Penn State.

The Yard and the USNA experience has changed drastically (in my opinion) since we were members of the Brigade. My classmates are now O-6's in both services and I try to remain current on what's going on in our military.

My 10-year old visited the Yard for the 1st time last week and told me that he wants to follow in my footsteps. We'll see what happens in a few years.

Embrace everything Auburn for the sake of your family, my 1st XO in the Corps was an Auburn NROTC alum (USMC tanker 1st through the breech during DS/DS while I was in Plebe Summer).
 
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