Truth or not? - Football
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kp2001
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I would start the question with your son more than the coach.
-Do you want to have a career in a sea-going profession?
-Will you be happy studying a maritime career?
-Where do you see yourself in 10 years? Does that include spending time at sea
-Are you flexible enough to potentially put off what you see yourself doing for a career for 5 years after graduating KP if what you decide on isn't part of the graduation agreement?
-Do you want to go to one of the best schools in the country and play football?
-Will you be happy at KP if you aren't playing football? (injuries, grades, etc)
Coach questions:
-How do you help mold my son into a young man?
-What are your priorities in the development of the young men you lead?
-How do you see my son fitting in with the program/school?
-What programs do you offer to help with academic problems?
-What can my son do now/continue to do to best prepare him to succeed in your program?
In my opinion asking sports questions are easy, and really the least important questions. Will my son play, etc etc, sure have some impact for the next few years, but it is much more important to find out where you child will be four years from now. Will they be a better person for having also participated in football? And even more important for KP is to figure out IF you actually want to be there even without football.
Just my 0.02
Thanks KP2001. Good Stuff! My sister and Bro-In-Law were Navy Docs. Who knows.. You may know them.
In my experience (though not vast) working with college bound athletes and the the coaches during the recruitment process here are some additional questions/tips, in addition to the questions already suggested:
-Worth repeating- if you suffer a career threatening injury on your first work-out, can you see yourself spending 4 years at the school.
-Can you handle the significant increase in time demands from playing a sport in college? Even though KP is "only" D3, the coaches find a way to engage the athletes all year.
-Is the SCHOOL really what you want, or did the coach "sell" you? (they give the "you are going to be a key part of the program" speech to many recruits)
-If the coach leaves, and a new coach comes in with a style of play that does not match your skill set as well as it did the former coach's style, can you manage that?
-Coaches really only care about what can you do for them at the collegiate level. Can you live with a recruit coming in the next year, and perhaps taking your job?
-Unlike "normal" schools, you don't transfer out of SA's to improve your athletic prospects.
-Are you dedicated enough to stay in shape during sea year? This is a question unique to KP. You will be on a ship for 120 ish days after your 3C (soph) season, and 200 ish days after your 2C (junior) season. This will require working out on your ship, which more than likely has limited gym equipment. Anecdotally, most ships have something, but less than what you might want/need.
-If you came from a popular winning program, can you manage in a program that may not be as good as the one you left? Not saying that is KP, but if you went 18-2 in HS varsity, how would you feel if you went 1-8 in your first year?
Understand the time commitment. The Academy's regimental structure is it's own entity, and does not care if you are the star football player.
TALK TO OTHER PLAYERS ON THE TEAM/IN THE SCHOOL NOW. This will likely give you some of the best insight as to the difference between the honeymoon (recruiting) speech, and what happened in reality.
Good luck in your decision making and future
-Worth repeating- if you suffer a career threatening injury on your first work-out, can you see yourself spending 4 years at the school.
-Can you handle the significant increase in time demands from playing a sport in college? Even though KP is "only" D3, the coaches find a way to engage the athletes all year.
-Is the SCHOOL really what you want, or did the coach "sell" you? (they give the "you are going to be a key part of the program" speech to many recruits)
-If the coach leaves, and a new coach comes in with a style of play that does not match your skill set as well as it did the former coach's style, can you manage that?
-Coaches really only care about what can you do for them at the collegiate level. Can you live with a recruit coming in the next year, and perhaps taking your job?
-Unlike "normal" schools, you don't transfer out of SA's to improve your athletic prospects.
-Are you dedicated enough to stay in shape during sea year? This is a question unique to KP. You will be on a ship for 120 ish days after your 3C (soph) season, and 200 ish days after your 2C (junior) season. This will require working out on your ship, which more than likely has limited gym equipment. Anecdotally, most ships have something, but less than what you might want/need.
-If you came from a popular winning program, can you manage in a program that may not be as good as the one you left? Not saying that is KP, but if you went 18-2 in HS varsity, how would you feel if you went 1-8 in your first year?
Understand the time commitment. The Academy's regimental structure is it's own entity, and does not care if you are the star football player.
TALK TO OTHER PLAYERS ON THE TEAM/IN THE SCHOOL NOW. This will likely give you some of the best insight as to the difference between the honeymoon (recruiting) speech, and what happened in reality.
Good luck in your decision making and future
I just want to say how much I appreciate this forum and everyone who shares their expertise on here. It is such a help. We are flying out to KP on the 22nd. My DS will stay with a football Doolie overnight so he can get a firsthand look for himself. Considering they are graduating their starting QB they've suggested he'll have a lot of "opportunity" right a way. Obviously the exact words any 18yo wants to hear from a football coach, right. I keep hearing that KP is a great place to be from but a horrible place to be. I know the opportunities in the maritime industry are great once you graduate from there.
I'm really trying to be objective considering his AF option and I'm former AF. Ultimately, it is his decision to make and to live with. As a parent, Long Island is a long way from rural Missouri. I sure would appreciate the "real scoop" from those of you that are there or have been to USMMA. How is morale in general? Are the facilities in as bad of repair as some seem to suggest? I heard they were shut down during sequestration, is that true? With budget considerations, is it in danger of being closed or under funded in relation to the other academies? I don't mean to be disrespectful in any way but it seems to be the red headed step-child to the other SAs. Help....
As a side note, can someone transfer from one SA to another or start at one and then re-apply to a different SA next year?
I'm really trying to be objective considering his AF option and I'm former AF. Ultimately, it is his decision to make and to live with. As a parent, Long Island is a long way from rural Missouri. I sure would appreciate the "real scoop" from those of you that are there or have been to USMMA. How is morale in general? Are the facilities in as bad of repair as some seem to suggest? I heard they were shut down during sequestration, is that true? With budget considerations, is it in danger of being closed or under funded in relation to the other academies? I don't mean to be disrespectful in any way but it seems to be the red headed step-child to the other SAs. Help....
As a side note, can someone transfer from one SA to another or start at one and then re-apply to a different SA next year?
beyond
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FYI. They're called plebes here. I had to google what a "Doolie" was.
I believe the starting QB is going to be a senior next year.
Can't really comment on this because I haven't gotten out yet, but with that being said I have different worries than those people I graduated high school with. Finding a job and student loans aren't real concerns for me.
The saying goes if you aren't miserable here than you aren't happy. I can firmly say I don't want to live in New York for the rest of my life, but going out of state for school has been a huge opportunity that I don't think many people can afford anymore. I really don't know if morale is bad or not, I don't know what to compare it to, I'm happy to be here, there have been some hurdles and bureaucracy to navigate but it's par for the course I suppose. I don't regret for a second the decision to come here.
My room is nice and all of the rooms have been renovated more recently than the dorms at my sates big universities. We were shut down during the government shut down but if there are money problems that affect us more than the rest of the government I don't see it. We have plenty of great simulators and equipment, the Kings Pointer is headed to the yard this Friday for even more work, the facilities are the least of a midshipman's problems.
You can re-apply to go somewhere else and start over as a freshman. That being said, you if survive your entire plebe year at KP I think you'll be too invested to want to leave.
Long story short. I'm damn happy I decided to become a Kings Pointer.
THANKS! Plebes. Doolies are AF. Good to know. ;-)
That really helps! Thanks. What year are you?
Interesting.... I just checked and you are correct. Thanks
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DS graduated in 2012 and I think there was only one pilot slot and that was Navy. FYI, my daughter was a recruited athlete for USAFA and she was also guaranteed a pilot slot - and that was before eye exams and academics were evaluated. I would take that offer with a grain of salt.
For starters, KP is controlled by the Dept. of Transportation, and NOT the DOD (who manages the other's), so when shutdowns occur (very rare) each department makes it's own decisions. Since KP has more civilian faculty then the other SAs, it will always be more vulnerable. Having said that, KP brings to bear significant weight in Washington, so this should be the least of your concerns. The current capital improvements are part of a $385 million Strategic Plan funding package, which would seem to indicate a closure of the school anytime soon is highly unlikely. Besides, as long we need licensed mariners trained to serve the military if needed, USMMA will be around quite some time. In fact, there have been more cuts to the military recently. The beauty of KP, is the number of options available upon graduation. Far more than the other SAs, but if your DS really wants to be a pilot, and not a merchant mariner, AFA would be better choice.
As a local parent of a '16, the capital improvements are significant. I was told (hear say of course), that when the other SAs visited KP recently, the West Point folks said, "WOW, please don't complain about your barracks again...they kill ours". Of course, a school like West Point has spectacular, world renowned facilities (not barracks...LOL) and is much bigger.
I don't know about transferring from one SA to another, but I know the KP curriculum is very rigid and highly specified to serving the US Merchant Marine as and engineer, or deck major. I'm sure you can start over as a plebe, but I would expect most of the credits would not transfer. I'd also go out on a limb and say voluntarily going thru a second plebe year is a tough ask IMHO.
Finally, morale is more of an issue for plebes, and less so for 1C. It improves with increased class rates in each subsequent year. Unlike the other SA's, the biggest city in the world is a 35 minute train ride away (not always a good thing
). They get over all the issues, and do fine...if they focus on their studies and keep their noses clean. Good Luck to your DS, whatever he decidesI will tell you, if your son, like ours, is spoiled but mom's home cookin', then yes, the food will disappoint him. Oddly enough, it seems almost like it's cool to have that to complain about.
17TexasMom
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I know there have been several responses to the post about the facility of USMMA compared to AFA, but as a Mom to as Class of 2017 midshipman, I wanted to add my perspective.
My personal opinion is the campus is beautiful and is getting a lot of attention in re models and construction. There are old buildings (not just the “old Chrysler mansion”, but the medical facility comes to mind) that hold a lot of the history of campus and just add the flavor of the pride of the academy. Where they sleep and eat is air conditioned and heated and clean and safe. The barracks rooms are larger and better equipped than my older DS’s freshman dorm room on Purdue’s campus.
The “plebe year” is tough and my son’s plebe year included the government shutdown, but it is apparent that he is proud of USMMA and is glad that he made the choice to go.
My personal opinion is the campus is beautiful and is getting a lot of attention in re models and construction. There are old buildings (not just the “old Chrysler mansion”, but the medical facility comes to mind) that hold a lot of the history of campus and just add the flavor of the pride of the academy. Where they sleep and eat is air conditioned and heated and clean and safe. The barracks rooms are larger and better equipped than my older DS’s freshman dorm room on Purdue’s campus.
The “plebe year” is tough and my son’s plebe year included the government shutdown, but it is apparent that he is proud of USMMA and is glad that he made the choice to go.
USCGA_2018
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AMF, Coast Guard is also not under the DOD. CG is Dept. of Homeland Security.
QBsdad, what kind of QB is your son? What type of system has he played in and what does he really expect at either USMMA or USAFA?
Have you looked at their play calling? AF averaged under 16 pass attempts per game for 145 yards. That's a run and gun offense for a service academy. How about USMMA? Only 56 passing attempts on the season for a 44 yards per game average.
These are great service academies that will offer your son incredible experiences and education. The football should really be negligible.
My son visited USAFA his junior year and visited USMMA several times in his junior and senior years. He likened AFA dorms to a hotel compared to MMA. Then again, AFA were pretty cozy compared to West Point, VMI and Citadel as well. But like football, the facilities should not be the driving factor. IMO, the service and the mission of the service should prevail as the most important factor in choosing to attend a service academy.
The soccer coach at MMA made a great point to my son. You are only 17 years old and if you go to another service academy you will be making a commitment that will last until you are 27 years old. People can and do change their minds about their career goals and aspirations. He stressed that at 22 you might feel differently than you do currently. He talked about the flexibility upon completing MMA. You can work in the maritime industry as many do, or join active duty in another branch of service.
Perhaps there are pilot positions in the public sector that would/could constitute a maritime related industry? I got the sense that there were many things that folks could do to satisfy their 5 year payback other than going out on big water. Maybe somebody else more knowledgeable can comment on this for you? I'd be curious to learn myself.
QBsdad, what kind of QB is your son? What type of system has he played in and what does he really expect at either USMMA or USAFA?
Have you looked at their play calling? AF averaged under 16 pass attempts per game for 145 yards. That's a run and gun offense for a service academy. How about USMMA? Only 56 passing attempts on the season for a 44 yards per game average.
These are great service academies that will offer your son incredible experiences and education. The football should really be negligible.
My son visited USAFA his junior year and visited USMMA several times in his junior and senior years. He likened AFA dorms to a hotel compared to MMA. Then again, AFA were pretty cozy compared to West Point, VMI and Citadel as well. But like football, the facilities should not be the driving factor. IMO, the service and the mission of the service should prevail as the most important factor in choosing to attend a service academy.
The soccer coach at MMA made a great point to my son. You are only 17 years old and if you go to another service academy you will be making a commitment that will last until you are 27 years old. People can and do change their minds about their career goals and aspirations. He stressed that at 22 you might feel differently than you do currently. He talked about the flexibility upon completing MMA. You can work in the maritime industry as many do, or join active duty in another branch of service.
Perhaps there are pilot positions in the public sector that would/could constitute a maritime related industry? I got the sense that there were many things that folks could do to satisfy their 5 year payback other than going out on big water. Maybe somebody else more knowledgeable can comment on this for you? I'd be curious to learn myself.
USCGA_2018, these days maritime industry means maritime. They're typically denying them offers and billets even in the offshore industry in the GOM. It seems to ebb and flow over the years; I understand when jobs are tight they'll occasionally waive the requirement, but if anything the mandate to work directly in the industry is tightening. I see more pluses than minuses to it actually. It's hard enough to make the case for the taxpayer to underwrite the education. Con Ed and other utilities would love to pick up these kids to work in their power plants. Lots of other outfits too, they come out with great quals. Fort Schuyler (NY Maritime) places grads in those jobs constantly because they can. But thats the way it is.
tankercaptain
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There are some great pilot positions available to graduates that fulfill their maritime obligation. There are about 60 pilot organizations.
http://www.uscg.mil/proceedings/fall2008/articles/9 SHIP PILOT.PDF
A great video on pilots.
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The one job that would almost make it worthwhile to be a deckie.
tankercaptain
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Almost? You know how I feel about that!
Good info as always Tanker, but I think posts were referring to flying pilots rather than sailing pilots. My point was if you really want to fly AFA is better, if you really want to sail, MMA(or CG, or NA) is better. And I disagree slightly with KP soccer coach, all SA's require the 4 year commitment (from 17-21), and KP has 5 year sailing requirement, and 8 year reserve requirement. So minimum commitment for KP is 9 years. The only difference, outside the reserve commitment, the KP grad does not go active duty, while the other SA grads do.