USAFA Mascot Injured in Prank

[emwvmi01]

So a few thoughts and my perspective on this changed over the course of several years but I think most non D1 cadets at USMA/NA/AFA or VMI or the Citadel have no clue what it takes to perform at a D1 level and still meet the demands of a military academy/SMC. At VMI I often heard athletes ragged on for missing out on elements of cadet life. I recently sat down with a classmate of mine who works with a service academy D1 football program and realized that in order to compete at that level and maintain the academic requirements of a top institution and the military requirements requires exceptional effort. A few years back I was teaching at a Career Course. The Captains who were students rotated leadership for Physical Training each morning and one day a student who played in a Big 12 program had us do part of a conditioning work out and tried to keep us at the same level as his peers. For a bunch of combat arms officers it was a wake up call as to what level of condition we were in.

More importantly, over the years I have seen no measurable impact in the quality of officers I have led (now in the dozens) out of USMA who were D1 versus non Corps Squad. The current Supe and last Supe both of whom are pretty well regarded in the Army were both football players and it obviously didn't hurt them to miss a few parades to attend practices or conditioning drills.

 

[scoutpilot]

So a few thoughts and my perspective on this changed over the course of several years but I think most non D1 cadets at USMA/NA/AFA or VMI or the Citadel have no clue what it takes to perform at a D1 level and still meet the demands of a military academy/SMC. At VMI I often heard athletes ragged on for missing out on elements of cadet life. I recently sat down with a classmate of mine who works with a service academy D1 football program and realized that in order to compete at that level and maintain the academic requirements of a top institution and the military requirements requires exceptional effort. A few years back I was teaching at a Career Course. The Captains who were students rotated leadership for Physical Training each morning and one day a student who played in a Big 12 program had us do part of a conditioning work out and tried to keep us at the same level as his peers. For a bunch of combat arms officers it was a wake up call as to what level of condition we were in.

More importantly, over the years I have seen no measurable impact in the quality of officers I have led (now in the dozens) out of USMA who were D1 versus non Corps Squad. The current Supe and last Supe both of whom are pretty well regarded in the Army were both football players and it obviously didn't hurt them to miss a few parades to attend practices or conditioning drills.

About two years ago, 16 of the 36 tac officers were my peers. Lots of stories about the realities of the corps and how these kids perform. They all marveled at how the D1 athletes did it, and at what great cadets populated every USMA team.

In four years of living with corps squadders, I never once had to run up ODIA hill at 0530. My roommates on the other hand...

There is no comparison between the work it takes to be a D1 athlete and a “sluggo” normal cadet. That’s a reason so many quit their sport to become normal cadets. The time demands and the physical exhaustion are too much to handle.

I definitely got a chuckle out of the suggestion that hiding items in your room or falling asleep in class is a “football player thing.” That’s cadet life for every last heart in gray.

In my days it was a contraband PlayStation we had hidden. We also had the last issued tower computers. You wouldn’t believe how much empty space there is in there...

 

[cb7893]

John McCain hid a television at USNA.

In the 1950's that thing would have been the size of Grand Central Station.

 

[Old Navy BGO]

I definitely got a chuckle out of the suggestion that hiding items in your room or falling asleep in class is a “football player thing.” That’s cadet life for every last heart in gray.

I can assure you its not limited to USMA or football players. There is an awful lot that goes on behind the walls that the public and parents will never know. (Great efforts are made to keep Company Officers and other administration in the dark as well, but many were Midshipman/Cadets themselves..so they know many of the tricks....). History is full of stories of how Midshipmen and Cadets fought the system ..... some won, some lost....

 

[UHBlackhawk]

As pointed out, corps squatters get some privelages, but they also give up quite a bit. More than once over a break I’ve given a ride to a lone Cadet stuck due to athletic requirements. Thanksgiving and Christmas missed if your sport is in season. Already short summer vacations cut even shorter for training. Many crummy days spent on an athletic field.

 

[NavyHoops]

I didn’t attend USMA, but I can’t imagine being an athlete is much different between the SAs. As my user name says I was a basketball player at USNA. I actually have a former USMA player working for me and based on stories our experiences are pretty similar. Some athletes do stupid things. So do NARPs. At Navy non-athletes are called non-athletic regular people. It’s a term everyone uses and NARPs embrace it. The thing is we all make our own choices. Especially being an athlete at a SA, you can walk from your sport any day and really life continues like normal. Not like another D1 school and figuring out how to now pay for school. There are more former athletes than current athletes (or at least when I was there). To say all football players or all non-football players are x is ridiculous.

There are certainly trade offs. I lived with NARPs all 4 years at USNA. My two room mates 2/C and 1/C year are my best friends to this day. They had never lived with an athlete until me. After a few weeks they both stated they had no idea how the heck I kept the schedule I did and I wasn’t even in season. Every sport is different, just as every Mids/Cadets schedules vary. It’s all a matter of how much you put on your plate and take advantage of opportunities. Sure you can do the minimum and get through. As an athlete I had at least 2-3 workouts, video sessions, etc a day. If I was injured throw in extra treatments too. Most days my athletic commitment ranged 3-6 hours a day. Road trips... some were fun and others brutal. Sure it’s time away from the yard, but as much class as we missed it was tough. One year the two basketball teams missed 25 more days of class than any other team on the yard (we missed I think 38 days that year). Football from a travel perspective has it nice... most games are Saturday, charter flights and maybe 6-7 road games.

Sure I missed drill, some formations, company tables, etc. I still did my job as a Mid. So did my team mates. Many of us held billets. Some teams have better reps than others. What people don’t see are the 3 hours practice sessions, film review at lunch and then 3 treatments to get healthy to play. They don’t see that I missed every Thanksgiving and Spring Break for my sport. The 3 days I got at Christmas each year. The week or two we each give up of our leave to help coach basketball camps. The Saturday afternoons spent leading community out reach with camps and other things. The 2 am bus pull up on the yard and have to be in class at 8 am with another game the next day so now we have another set of plays, game plans, etc to learn in the next 36 hours. And we are fine with all that because we made the choice just like every other Mid or Cadet who does X, Y or Z. Plenty of NARPs give up time to do things too. Not all athletes are skating and not all non-athletes are perfect Cadets or Mids, those of us who lived inside the walls for 4 years know this. (Sorry for the long post and rant)

 

[Capt MJ]

Hear hear to Hoops!
I traveled with Navy basketball (women’s) as O-Rep. Missed every Thanksgiving at home during that tour, and it was shore duty. I saw the time they put into their sport, the challenges of doing homework on the bus while exhausted from a game and having a first period quiz the next day, working it out with roommates covering their part of the room for inspections while they were traveling, dealing with the tendency to get B and C grades in military performance because they weren’t seen as much in company, working extra hard to be a visible and contributing part of the company to overcome that challenge, figuring out how to make up for missed classes, using summer leave blocks to take summer school to lighten the ac year load.

 

[A1Janitor]

I didn’t attend USMA, but I can’t imagine being an athlete is much different between the SAs. As my user name says I was a basketball player at USNA. I actually have a former USMA player working for me and based on stories our experiences are pretty similar. Some athletes do stupid things. So do NARPs. At Navy non-athletes are called non-athletic regular people. It’s a term everyone uses and NARPs embrace it. The thing is we all make our own choices. Especially being an athlete at a SA, you can walk from your sport any day and really life continues like normal. Not like another D1 school and figuring out how to now pay for school. There are more former athletes than current athletes (or at least when I was there). To say all football players or all non-football players are x is ridiculous.

There are certainly trade offs. I lived with NARPs all 4 years at USNA. My two room mates 2/C and 1/C year are my best friends to this day. They had never lived with an athlete until me. After a few weeks they both stated they had no idea how the heck I kept the schedule I did and I wasn’t even in season. Every sport is different, just as every Mids/Cadets schedules vary. It’s all a matter of how much you put on your plate and take advantage of opportunities. Sure you can do the minimum and get through. As an athlete I had at least 2-3 workouts, video sessions, etc a day. If I was injured throw in extra treatments too. Most days my athletic commitment ranged 3-6 hours a day. Road trips... some were fun and others brutal. Sure it’s time away from the yard, but as much class as we missed it was tough. One year the two basketball teams missed 25 more days of class than any other team on the yard (we missed I think 38 days that year). Football from a travel perspective has it nice... most games are Saturday, charter flights and maybe 6-7 road games.

Sure I missed drill, some formations, company tables, etc. I still did my job as a Mid. So did my team mates. Many of us held billets. Some teams have better reps than others. What people don’t see are the 3 hours practice sessions, film review at lunch and then 3 treatments to get healthy to play. They don’t see that I missed every Thanksgiving and Spring Break for my sport. The 3 days I got at Christmas each year. The week or two we each give up of our leave to help coach basketball camps. The Saturday afternoons spent leading community out reach with camps and other things. The 2 am bus pull up on the yard and have to be in class at 8 am with another game the next day so now we have another set of plays, game plans, etc to learn in the next 36 hours. And we are fine with all that because we made the choice just like every other Mid or Cadet who does X, Y or Z. Plenty of NARPs give up time to do things too. Not all athletes are skating and not all non-athletes are perfect Cadets or Mids, those of us who lived inside the walls for 4 years know this. (Sorry for the long post and rant)

Awesome!

 

[UHBlackhawk]

Hear hear to Hoops!
I traveled with Navy basketball (women’s) as O-Rep. Missed every Thanksgiving at home during that tour, and it was shore duty. I saw the time they put into their sport, the challenges of doing homework on the bus while exhausted from a game and having a first period quiz the next day, working it out with roommates covering their part of the room for inspections while they were traveling, dealing with the tendency to get B and C grades in military performance because they weren’t seen as much in company, working extra hard to be a visible and contributing part of the company to overcome that challenge, figuring out how to make up for missed classes, using summer leave blocks to take summer school to lighten the ac year load.

I once gave a ride to a USMA female basketball player who missed several Thanksgivings and Christmases. She was given “comp” weekends later, but couldn’t really do much with them.

 

[NavyHoops]

The Supt a few years while I was there extended special intersessional leave to us and the Men’s team. It usually was only an extra 3-4 days but for us it was generally glorious. Summer school helped us manage our schedules. All it usually did was allow us to block our key days like Thursday afternoon late as those were heavy travel days. It allowed us to maximize time in class. Do you know how hard it is to do a nav chart on a bus!

 

[UHBlackhawk]

Deleted.

 

[OldRetSWO]

I didn’t attend USMA, but I can’t imagine being an athlete is much different between the SAs. As my user name says I was a basketball player at USNA. I actually have a former USMA player working for me and based on stories our experiences are pretty similar. Some athletes do stupid things. So do NARPs. At Navy non-athletes are called non-athletic regular people. It’s a term everyone uses and NARPs embrace it. The thing is we all make our own choices. Especially being an athlete at a SA, you can walk from your sport any day and really life continues like normal. Not like another D1 school and figuring out how to now pay for school. There are more former athletes than current athletes (or at least when I was there). To say all football players or all non-football players are x is ridiculous.

There are certainly trade offs. I lived with NARPs all 4 years at USNA. My two room mates 2/C and 1/C year are my best friends to this day. They had never lived with an athlete until me. After a few weeks they both stated they had no idea how the heck I kept the schedule I did and I wasn’t even in season. Every sport is different, just as every Mids/Cadets schedules vary. It’s all a matter of how much you put on your plate and take advantage of opportunities. Sure you can do the minimum and get through. As an athlete I had at least 2-3 workouts, video sessions, etc a day. If I was injured throw in extra treatments too. Most days my athletic commitment ranged 3-6 hours a day. Road trips... some were fun and others brutal. Sure it’s time away from the yard, but as much class as we missed it was tough. One year the two basketball teams missed 25 more days of class than any other team on the yard (we missed I think 38 days that year). Football from a travel perspective has it nice... most games are Saturday, charter flights and maybe 6-7 road games.

Sure I missed drill, some formations, company tables, etc. I still did my job as a Mid. So did my team mates. Many of us held billets. Some teams have better reps than others. What people don’t see are the 3 hours practice sessions, film review at lunch and then 3 treatments to get healthy to play. They don’t see that I missed every Thanksgiving and Spring Break for my sport. The 3 days I got at Christmas each year. The week or two we each give up of our leave to help coach basketball camps. The Saturday afternoons spent leading community out reach with camps and other things. The 2 am bus pull up on the yard and have to be in class at 8 am with another game the next day so now we have another set of plays, game plans, etc to learn in the next 36 hours. And we are fine with all that because we made the choice just like every other Mid or Cadet who does X, Y or Z. Plenty of NARPs give up time to do things too. Not all athletes are skating and not all non-athletes are perfect Cadets or Mids, those of us who lived inside the walls for 4 years know this. (Sorry for the long post and rant)

I'd like to co-sign this as your experience mirrors my own. My sport was intercollegiate sailing which has a party reputation and is generally put down as "easy" because people associate what we do
with the knockabout/basic sailing they had during plebe summer. The reality is our sport is to plebe summer sailing as D1 intercollegiate basketball is to shooting around in your driveway. We're in
season both spring and fall with the winter used for advanced workouts/strength/agility training. When in season, we didn't do organized strength, etc workouts but many/most team members did
early morning runs and the like just to keep up their edge. As a point of fact, when I graduated, the record times for completing the USNA obstacle course both Male and Female were held by
teammates of mine. Unlike many other sports at Navy, we often have multiple events on any given day/weekend and thus send two three or even four separate teams out to compete throughout
the region.

We had lots of folks walk away during their later years at USNA to just be "regular mids" which I really didn't think twice about but now, I see some of my university students who are D1 Soccer
and basketball athletes and how hard they work while they can't quit or they lose their scholarships.

(Edited to add) Our party reputation was well deserved/earned. Thankfully I avoided the long arm of the administration in this area but quite a few of my teammates earned "Black N's" to go with their more traditional gold letters. As a one star, my best friend/best man at my wedding had the opportunity to brief a four star who had been conduct officer at USNA when my friend received his Black N and yes, the boss did remember.

 

[scoutpilot]

I didn’t attend USMA, but I can’t imagine being an athlete is much different between the SAs. As my user name says I was a basketball player at USNA. I actually have a former USMA player working for me and based on stories our experiences are pretty similar. Some athletes do stupid things. So do NARPs. At Navy non-athletes are called non-athletic regular people. It’s a term everyone uses and NARPs embrace it. The thing is we all make our own choices. Especially being an athlete at a SA, you can walk from your sport any day and really life continues like normal. Not like another D1 school and figuring out how to now pay for school. There are more former athletes than current athletes (or at least when I was there). To say all football players or all non-football players are x is ridiculous.

There are certainly trade offs. I lived with NARPs all 4 years at USNA. My two room mates 2/C and 1/C year are my best friends to this day. They had never lived with an athlete until me. After a few weeks they both stated they had no idea how the heck I kept the schedule I did and I wasn’t even in season. Every sport is different, just as every Mids/Cadets schedules vary. It’s all a matter of how much you put on your plate and take advantage of opportunities. Sure you can do the minimum and get through. As an athlete I had at least 2-3 workouts, video sessions, etc a day. If I was injured throw in extra treatments too. Most days my athletic commitment ranged 3-6 hours a day. Road trips... some were fun and others brutal. Sure it’s time away from the yard, but as much class as we missed it was tough. One year the two basketball teams missed 25 more days of class than any other team on the yard (we missed I think 38 days that year). Football from a travel perspective has it nice... most games are Saturday, charter flights and maybe 6-7 road games.

Sure I missed drill, some formations, company tables, etc. I still did my job as a Mid. So did my team mates. Many of us held billets. Some teams have better reps than others. What people don’t see are the 3 hours practice sessions, film review at lunch and then 3 treatments to get healthy to play. They don’t see that I missed every Thanksgiving and Spring Break for my sport. The 3 days I got at Christmas each year. The week or two we each give up of our leave to help coach basketball camps. The Saturday afternoons spent leading community out reach with camps and other things. The 2 am bus pull up on the yard and have to be in class at 8 am with another game the next day so now we have another set of plays, game plans, etc to learn in the next 36 hours. And we are fine with all that because we made the choice just like every other Mid or Cadet who does X, Y or Z. Plenty of NARPs give up time to do things too. Not all athletes are skating and not all non-athletes are perfect Cadets or Mids, those of us who lived inside the walls for 4 years know this. (Sorry for the long post and rant)

Awesome!

Apology accepted.

 

[A1Janitor]

I didn’t attend USMA, but I can’t imagine being an athlete is much different between the SAs. As my user name says I was a basketball player at USNA. I actually have a former USMA player working for me and based on stories our experiences are pretty similar. Some athletes do stupid things. So do NARPs. At Navy non-athletes are called non-athletic regular people. It’s a term everyone uses and NARPs embrace it. The thing is we all make our own choices. Especially being an athlete at a SA, you can walk from your sport any day and really life continues like normal. Not like another D1 school and figuring out how to now pay for school. There are more former athletes than current athletes (or at least when I was there). To say all football players or all non-football players are x is ridiculous.

There are certainly trade offs. I lived with NARPs all 4 years at USNA. My two room mates 2/C and 1/C year are my best friends to this day. They had never lived with an athlete until me. After a few weeks they both stated they had no idea how the heck I kept the schedule I did and I wasn’t even in season. Every sport is different, just as every Mids/Cadets schedules vary. It’s all a matter of how much you put on your plate and take advantage of opportunities. Sure you can do the minimum and get through. As an athlete I had at least 2-3 workouts, video sessions, etc a day. If I was injured throw in extra treatments too. Most days my athletic commitment ranged 3-6 hours a day. Road trips... some were fun and others brutal. Sure it’s time away from the yard, but as much class as we missed it was tough. One year the two basketball teams missed 25 more days of class than any other team on the yard (we missed I think 38 days that year). Football from a travel perspective has it nice... most games are Saturday, charter flights and maybe 6-7 road games.

Sure I missed drill, some formations, company tables, etc. I still did my job as a Mid. So did my team mates. Many of us held billets. Some teams have better reps than others. What people don’t see are the 3 hours practice sessions, film review at lunch and then 3 treatments to get healthy to play. They don’t see that I missed every Thanksgiving and Spring Break for my sport. The 3 days I got at Christmas each year. The week or two we each give up of our leave to help coach basketball camps. The Saturday afternoons spent leading community out reach with camps and other things. The 2 am bus pull up on the yard and have to be in class at 8 am with another game the next day so now we have another set of plays, game plans, etc to learn in the next 36 hours. And we are fine with all that because we made the choice just like every other Mid or Cadet who does X, Y or Z. Plenty of NARPs give up time to do things too. Not all athletes are skating and not all non-athletes are perfect Cadets or Mids, those of us who lived inside the walls for 4 years know this. (Sorry for the long post and rant)

Awesome!

Apology accepted.

I argued the three times as hard.

I also prefer less condescending people.

 

[scoutpilot]

I didn’t attend USMA, but I can’t imagine being an athlete is much different between the SAs. As my user name says I was a basketball player at USNA. I actually have a former USMA player working for me and based on stories our experiences are pretty similar. Some athletes do stupid things. So do NARPs. At Navy non-athletes are called non-athletic regular people. It’s a term everyone uses and NARPs embrace it. The thing is we all make our own choices. Especially being an athlete at a SA, you can walk from your sport any day and really life continues like normal. Not like another D1 school and figuring out how to now pay for school. There are more former athletes than current athletes (or at least when I was there). To say all football players or all non-football players are x is ridiculous.

There are certainly trade offs. I lived with NARPs all 4 years at USNA. My two room mates 2/C and 1/C year are my best friends to this day. They had never lived with an athlete until me. After a few weeks they both stated they had no idea how the heck I kept the schedule I did and I wasn’t even in season. Every sport is different, just as every Mids/Cadets schedules vary. It’s all a matter of how much you put on your plate and take advantage of opportunities. Sure you can do the minimum and get through. As an athlete I had at least 2-3 workouts, video sessions, etc a day. If I was injured throw in extra treatments too. Most days my athletic commitment ranged 3-6 hours a day. Road trips... some were fun and others brutal. Sure it’s time away from the yard, but as much class as we missed it was tough. One year the two basketball teams missed 25 more days of class than any other team on the yard (we missed I think 38 days that year). Football from a travel perspective has it nice... most games are Saturday, charter flights and maybe 6-7 road games.

Sure I missed drill, some formations, company tables, etc. I still did my job as a Mid. So did my team mates. Many of us held billets. Some teams have better reps than others. What people don’t see are the 3 hours practice sessions, film review at lunch and then 3 treatments to get healthy to play. They don’t see that I missed every Thanksgiving and Spring Break for my sport. The 3 days I got at Christmas each year. The week or two we each give up of our leave to help coach basketball camps. The Saturday afternoons spent leading community out reach with camps and other things. The 2 am bus pull up on the yard and have to be in class at 8 am with another game the next day so now we have another set of plays, game plans, etc to learn in the next 36 hours. And we are fine with all that because we made the choice just like every other Mid or Cadet who does X, Y or Z. Plenty of NARPs give up time to do things too. Not all athletes are skating and not all non-athletes are perfect Cadets or Mids, those of us who lived inside the walls for 4 years know this. (Sorry for the long post and rant)

Awesome!

Apology accepted.

I argued the three times as hard.

I also prefer less condescending people.

Then perhaps don’t condescend to people with Academy diplomas about how USMA cadet life works, and attempt to use some secondhand anecdotes from an overnight visit to paint cadet football players as lazy, shiftless, poor cadets.

 

[A1Janitor]

I didn’t attend USMA, but I can’t imagine being an athlete is much different between the SAs. As my user name says I was a basketball player at USNA. I actually have a former USMA player working for me and based on stories our experiences are pretty similar. Some athletes do stupid things. So do NARPs. At Navy non-athletes are called non-athletic regular people. It’s a term everyone uses and NARPs embrace it. The thing is we all make our own choices. Especially being an athlete at a SA, you can walk from your sport any day and really life continues like normal. Not like another D1 school and figuring out how to now pay for school. There are more former athletes than current athletes (or at least when I was there). To say all football players or all non-football players are x is ridiculous.

There are certainly trade offs. I lived with NARPs all 4 years at USNA. My two room mates 2/C and 1/C year are my best friends to this day. They had never lived with an athlete until me. After a few weeks they both stated they had no idea how the heck I kept the schedule I did and I wasn’t even in season. Every sport is different, just as every Mids/Cadets schedules vary. It’s all a matter of how much you put on your plate and take advantage of opportunities. Sure you can do the minimum and get through. As an athlete I had at least 2-3 workouts, video sessions, etc a day. If I was injured throw in extra treatments too. Most days my athletic commitment ranged 3-6 hours a day. Road trips... some were fun and others brutal. Sure it’s time away from the yard, but as much class as we missed it was tough. One year the two basketball teams missed 25 more days of class than any other team on the yard (we missed I think 38 days that year). Football from a travel perspective has it nice... most games are Saturday, charter flights and maybe 6-7 road games.

Sure I missed drill, some formations, company tables, etc. I still did my job as a Mid. So did my team mates. Many of us held billets. Some teams have better reps than others. What people don’t see are the 3 hours practice sessions, film review at lunch and then 3 treatments to get healthy to play. They don’t see that I missed every Thanksgiving and Spring Break for my sport. The 3 days I got at Christmas each year. The week or two we each give up of our leave to help coach basketball camps. The Saturday afternoons spent leading community out reach with camps and other things. The 2 am bus pull up on the yard and have to be in class at 8 am with another game the next day so now we have another set of plays, game plans, etc to learn in the next 36 hours. And we are fine with all that because we made the choice just like every other Mid or Cadet who does X, Y or Z. Plenty of NARPs give up time to do things too. Not all athletes are skating and not all non-athletes are perfect Cadets or Mids, those of us who lived inside the walls for 4 years know this. (Sorry for the long post and rant)

Awesome!

Apology accepted.

I argued the three times as hard.

I also prefer less condescending people.

Then perhaps don’t condescend to people with Academy diplomas about how USMA cadet life works, and attempt to use some secondhand anecdotes from an overnight visit to paint cadet football players as lazy, shiftless, poor cadets.

*DELETED BY MODERATOR - INAPPROPRIATE*

I have one observation that my son noticed about a kid watching football film during class.

Get over yourself.

 

[Jcleppe]

Wasn't this thread originally about a Bird?

 

[Capt MJ]

Yes, last year. Thread morph occurred.

 

[Jcleppe]

The Power Rangers of SAF.