Weighing options of going SMP

[Tbpxece]

That’s certainly not the case just confused and trying to understand from what I’ve been told prior. If I enlist and drill for a year or so before joining the SMP program then why wouldn’t that count as serving in the reserves as an enlisted member?

It would count on paper. It would be serving as an "officer trainee", an O9R, which carries no responsibilities other than pushing paper. You would not serve in the MOS for which you went to AIT.

It's kind of like folks going straight into OCS/OTS saying they were "prior-enlisted" because they were paid as an E-5 during OCS/OTS. Or the AFROTC contracted cadet (who is enlisted as an E-1 in the Air Force Reserves after accepting a scholarship) saying they were prior-enlisted. It's technically correct, but everyone knows it's BS.

Being enlisted is more than going to Basic and AIT. It's actually serving in an MOS for a period of time, being present and active where you are. It's not being in a temporary status while you wait to move to another.

And would years of service be higher because I enlisted through college and commission instead of just commissioning through ROTC?

To get O-1E, you must have 4 years of active duty experience, meaning 365 days x 4 years of active military days. When you are in the reserve component, you are earning 4 military days each month (each drill day counts for 2 active duty days), and 14 or 15 days per year (for annual training). Do the math. You will not have the 1460 days required for O-1E. This is common for prior-enlisted guardsmen and reservists who commission. They may have 6-8 years of active military service, but not 6-8 years of active duty military service.

Meaning, they do NOT receive O-1E after commissioning.

If you've been told otherwise, then you've been told wrong.

As for benefits of doing ROTC while enlisted, there are benefits but they are designed for already-active reserve component soldiers. They are not intended for high school graduates who want to start full-time college within a year or two.

Think of it this way. I can design a really cool hand-pedaling bicycle that provides a ton of benefit to amputees. Although you can use it too, you would be better suited for a foot-pedaled bicycle. Does that make sense? You will go faster using your feet and will get to where you need to go. The other bike is not intended for you, even though you can technically use it. If you use the other bike, you will be hindered as much as helped. It is still faster than walking, but gosh man-- just use the $#@! foot-pedals-- you have feet!

SMP is the same way. It was not intended for people like you. It was built for actively serving reservists and guardsmen who would otherwise be forced to slowly get their degree over 6-8 years and then apply for OCS or WOCS. You don't have that limitation.​

 

[Tbpxece]

SMP if you get enough days per year can give you a boost in your pay when you commission.

Saying it again here, in case anyone misses it in my above too-long narrative...
To get O-1E, you must have 4 years of active duty experience, meaning 365 days x 4 years of active military days. When you are in the reserve component, you are earning 4 military days each month (each drill day counts for 2 active duty days), and 14 or 15 days per year (for annual training). Do the math. You will not have the 1460 days required for O-1E. This is common for prior-enlisted guardsmen and reservists who commission. They may have 6-8 years of active military service, but not 6-8 years of active duty military service.

Meaning, they do not receive O-1E.

Just going to BCT and AIT doesn't make you prior enlisted in anyone's mind, and if you bring it up all the time at your battalion you will quickly become the jerk.

​

Bingo (emphasis mine).

 

[Jcleppe]

To get O-1E, you must have 4 years of active duty experience, meaning 365 days x 4 years of active military days. When you are in the reserve component, you are earning 4 military days each month (each drill day counts for 2 active duty days), and 14 or 15 days per year (for annual training). Do the math. You will not have the 1460 days required for O-1E. This is common for prior-enlisted guardsmen and reservists who commission. They may have 6-8 years of active military service, but not 6-8 years of active duty military service.

Meaning, they do NOT receive O-1E after commissioning.

If you've been told otherwise, then you've been told wrong.

You're absolutely correct, I should have been more clear. The time during SMP can if they have enough days count as TIS in regard to pay but you would not, as you stated, have the O-1E designation.

 

[Jcleppe]

I think the bottom line for the advice you've been given here is whether or not you need to do SMP.

SMP is not a bad program and it has it's place, there are many cadets in AROTC today that are in the SMP program. One big reason a lot of cadets choose SMP is for the financial benefit, if you complete both BCT and AIT you can maximize those benefits to include drill pay, GI Bill and the Kicker or Tuition Assistance (The amount and type will depend on which State) add to this the ROTC Stipend and a cadet can pay for a large portion of college and sometimes match what the scholarship would have covered depending on the cost of tuition. For cadets that do not have a scholarship this is often the path they will choose to help pay for school and it works well.

For a cadet that does not need the financial assistance, doing SMP just for the experience doesn't make a lot of sense for the many reasons that have been stated in this thread. You will be away from school for one weekend a month, while that doesn't seem like a lot you will find out once you start college that it can be an issue depending on when that weekend falls in the month. Once you finish AIT and become MOS qualified you will be deployable until your battalion offers you a contract and you sign it. That means you could go through your entire sophomore year being deployable if your battalion doesn't contract you at the start of the year.

You have to be careful about what TA you take because some may require you remain in the Reserves/Guard. SMP cadets can still compete for Active Duty as long as they are careful with what money they accept from the Reserves/Guard. If you are sure that you want to stay Reserves/Guard then you may want to look at the GRFD scholarship, it pays the same as the regular scholarship but requires you complete your service obligation with the Reserves/NG for 8 years.

As has been mentioned more then once, doing SMP like you are talking about will not give you the "Enlisted Experience" you think it will, it will just add a lot of extra commitments and time that you don't need to do unless you need the financial assistance.

 

[MrNiceGuy347]

I think the bottom line for the advice you've been given here is whether or not you need to do SMP.

SMP is not a bad program and it has it's place, there are many cadets in AROTC today that are in the SMP program. One big reason a lot of cadets choose SMP is for the financial benefit, if you complete both BCT and AIT you can maximize those benefits to include drill pay, GI Bill and the Kicker or Tuition Assistance (The amount and type will depend on which State) add to this the ROTC Stipend and a cadet can pay for a large portion of college and sometimes match what the scholarship would have covered depending on the cost of tuition. For cadets that do not have a scholarship this is often the path they will choose to help pay for school and it works well.

For a cadet that does not need the financial assistance, doing SMP just for the experience doesn't make a lot of sense for the many reasons that have been stated in this thread. You will be away from school for one weekend a month, while that doesn't seem like a lot you will find out once you start college that it can be an issue depending on when that weekend falls in the month. Once you finish AIT and become MOS qualified you will be deployable until your battalion offers you a contract and you sign it. That means you could go through your entire sophomore year being deployable if your battalion doesn't contract you at the start of the year.

You have to be careful about what TA you take because some may require you remain in the Reserves/Guard. SMP cadets can still compete for Active Duty as long as they are careful with what money they accept from the Reserves/Guard. If you are sure that you want to stay Reserves/Guard then you may want to look at the GRFD scholarship, it pays the same as the regular scholarship but requires you complete your service obligation with the Reserves/NG for 8 years.

As has been mentioned more then once, doing SMP like you are talking about will not give you the "Enlisted Experience" you think it will, it will just add a lot of extra commitments and time that you don't need to do unless you need the financial assistance.

Thanks for helping me clear all this up and I will look into the GRFD scholarship!

 

[Dckc88]

You said you don’t need the money for college, meaning you can afford college. My advice would be (not that you want to hear it): so I will be REALLY clear. If you want to enlist, then enlist. If you want to be in the guard, then join the guard. If you want to commission as an officer, then, simply do that. There is another option and this is my advice WAIT to decide.

Why wait? Because if you look at the SMP program on the Army website, you do not join it until you are a sophomore in college. By the time you are a sophomore - you may have changed your mind. People can already be in the guard, or they can join at that time, there is no rush now. If you are serious about going to college next year, then go, learn more. Listen to you cadre, they have all served. You will most likely have commissed officers and non-conmissioned officers to talk to and learn from. Once you sign that paper, YOU CANNOT UNSIGN IT. So what is the rush. You are almost 18. Drilling on the weekend, and the jobs that you would have in the NG is not the same as being active duty, not even close. Yes you get training, but trust me, you will get all the training you need, the Army is not going to short change you on that one.

My daughter was approached by a recruiter her senior year. She had a 3 year AD scholarship. The recruiter had her so excited about SMP and her main reason was respect once she was an officer and prior service, going to basic, etc. her Dad and I said, “don’t do anything until you call the ROO at your school.” She had already accepted to a school, so she called that ROO. It is pretty telling that she never mentioned it again. All she would tell us is that she was told it wouldn’t be until she was a sophomore that she could do the SMP program so not to worry about it, just come to campus in shape for the APFT. The call was long enough I know he told her more, but she never shared it.

Just wait. You are 17. Don’t make any decisions when you turn 18 soon, you have lots of time to make these decisions, seriously, I know you have a million reasons why this is a good idea, but if you truly don’t need the money, and this is about experience, there are may TRULY EXPERIENCED service members above telling you your thinking is false. It is time to listen. There is a reason why your u can leave ROTC after the first year with no obligation, just go check it out, the NG isn’t going anywhere.

 

[Dckc88]

I just saw you other post, and yes, if it is more of a financial need, AND you are sure you nwant to stay NG and not do active duty, then yes the GRFD scholarship is a great option. Just make sure, you don’t want to go active duty.

 

[MrNiceGuy347]

You said you don’t need the money for college, meaning you can afford college. My advice would be (not that you want to hear it): so I will be REALLY clear. If you want to enlist, then enlist. If you want to be in the guard, then join the guard. If you want to commission as an officer, then, simply do that. There is another option and this is my advice WAIT to decide.

Why wait? Because if you look at the SMP program on the Army website, you do not join it until you are a sophomore in college. By the time you are a sophomore - you may have changed your mind. People can already be in the guard, or they can join at that time, there is no rush now. If you are serious about going to college next year, then go, learn more. Listen to you cadre, they have all served. You will most likely have commissed officers and non-conmissioned officers to talk to and learn from. Once you sign that paper, YOU CANNOT UNSIGN IT. So what is the rush. You are almost 18. Drilling on the weekend, and the jobs that you would have in the NG is not the same as being active duty, not even close. Yes you get training, but trust me, you will get all the training you need, the Army is not going to short change you on that one.

My daughter was approached by a recruiter her senior year. She had a 3 year AD scholarship. The recruiter had her so excited about SMP and her main reason was respect once she was an officer and prior service, going to basic, etc. her Dad and I said, “don’t do anything until you call the ROO at your school.” She had already accepted to a school, so she called that ROO. It is pretty telling that she never mentioned it again. All she would tell us is that she was told it wouldn’t be until she was a sophomore that she could do the SMP program so not to worry about it, just come to campus in shape for the APFT. The call was long enough I know he told her more, but she never shared it.

Just wait. You are 17. Don’t make any decisions when you turn 18 soon, you have lots of time to make these decisions, seriously, I know you have a million reasons why this is a good idea, but if you truly don’t need the money, and this is about experience, there are may TRULY EXPERIENCED service members above telling you your thinking is false. It is time to listen. There is a reason why your u can leave ROTC after the first year with no obligation, just go check it out, the NG isn’t going anywhere.

Thank you for the advice!

 

[kinnem]

Many times the 'wanting' is better than the 'having'.