What a Joke

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Yes, unfortunately my hypothesis is confusing. So let's change it.
They are 100% equally qualified, except the non-URM has an SAT 10 points higher.

From the words of MLK:
"I have a dream that my four children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."

Whether using URM to discriminate or whether using URM to favor, you are judging by their physical characteristics and not their character. That is wrong, especially when those involved grew up in the same neighborhood, school, etc..... (in other words - they had the same opportunity).
And yes, two candidates growing up on the same block, attending the same schools.. the Academy has selected the URM...

Oh, I see now. You're right. What was I thinking? :rolleyes:
 
In a perfect world.....

In a perfect world none of this would have to be debated! In a perfect world the competition would be national, like the ROTC Scholarship. There would not be a nomination requirement, that may be political and surely is geographical. Nor would there be DI athletics, where recruiting plays into the process. And, lastly, there would not be a "check box" for race or gender. However, that is not the world in which we live, and unfortunately for the taxpayers who fund the service academies, this is how our government works. On a positive note, I am so encouraged by all of these amazing kids who want to serve our country by whatever means they can.....God bless you and many thanks! You are the best of the best!
 
Lets say a URM and a non-URM work at the same part-time job and spend their breaks comparing notes during the application process. Then lets say that the non-URM is better in academics (GPA, SAT, etc), better in athletics (champion varsity athlete), both passed CFA and DODMERB with flying colors, both attended NASS and both invited to CVW, both get Sen noms. But the URM gets an appointment. It does make one wonder how the selection process was done.
And of course, no one can confirm or deny the effect of the URM status, nor the contents of the interview, etc..... But yes, I believe it happens....

Or how about this. White father, hispanic mother create a URM growing up in same area with same quals as a non-URM. Yet one gets the influence of a URM.
At what persentage does the URM no longer exist???

I am not against URM WHEN it can be proven that they truly grew up disadvantaged (i.e. inner city, single mother, etc.). But URM as a checkbox does not prove a need for a helping hand.....Use of URM negatively is against the law, but then using it positively is wrong.

Finally, I want to repeat this STRONGLY, no where have I said a URM is not qualified or selected ONLY because they are a URM or that a URM is stupid or that URM is only about race. I am saying that a URM may be given a "bonus" that exceeds a non-URM's better academic and athletic stats and that is reverse-discrimination.

One would only wonder about it if they choose to, apparently you have chosen to.

You really need to proof read because you are not only saying it, your saying in in the same paragraph.

I certainly hope you didn't come across like this in your interview.

I'm curious, is being in the Navy as an officer your goal, or just attending the USNA?

It sounds like if you were to attend the academy, every time you see a URM Mid, it would make you "Wonder"

It's time to move on, if you don't like how this system works and the politics that are played, well, your really going to hate the Military. If you can't learn to brush it off and find a new path to your goals then you have chosen the wrong career path.
 
Probably not because at that time I thought the process was fair.

Life lesson #1 life is not fair. You should try walking a mile in the shoes of URM's. It tough being responsible for all the injustices in the world. You are so busy making others responsible for your life instead of picking yourself up and doing what you can to reach your goals.
 
Probably not because at that time I thought the process was fair.

Maybe you are not ready for something that is so intense, like the USNA? First take it as a challenge to improve yourself next year, if you decide to re- apply. First thing is don't make excuses. I hated excuses from my guys when something didn't turn out like they wanted. Be strong and deal with it. Come back even harder next time.
 
How is it discrimination if the URM is qualified? Many URM don't apply to the academies because they are unaware that they exist. What is the acceptance rate for Women, Asians, Native American versus applicants. Is the problem just African American being accepted at a higher percentage or is it a problem with women, Asians, Native Americans, etc. If USNA is able to find qualified URM to admit what is wrong with that?

As a FFR, I get to see some numbers and candidated data

Several things, there is a big difference between qualified vs best qualified. I can't speak for Navy, but for West Point this year so far about 2000 candidates are qualified with nomination, of those only about 1300 +/- will get appointment offers. So although 700 +/- candidates qualifed will not be offered appointments.

The differences between SAs should be minimum, for USMA

http://www.usma.edu/bov/SiteAssets/Meeting Minutes/Signed Meeting Minutes 20120614.pdf

for class of 2012

81% of fully qualifed men were offered appointments
88% of fully qualifed women were offered appointments
97% of full qualified African-Amercian were offered appointments
100% of full qualified Amercian Indians were offered appointments
75% of full qualified Asian/Pacific Islanders were offered appointments
90% of fully qualified Hispanics were offered appointments.

The numbers are similiar for pervious classes dating back to class of 2008.

I am not a statistician, but I think for most things in life any deviation beyond 5% from the average is not normal.

Lastly, in a way there is nothing wrong Navy "find[ing] qualified URM to admit." Except to another qualified candidate that worked hard to get into Navy. There is no a problem of any group getting accepted at a higher percentage than the norm. The problem is SAs not explaining what they are doing.
 
How is it discrimination if the URM is qualified?

Anytime race is used as an admissions factor, discrimination is involved.

You cannot "affirm" one race without discriminating against another.

Using skin color as an admissions factor is wrong, period.

And don't kid yourself, "diversity" as used in the context of USNA admissions, is 100% about race.
 
I am not a statistician, but I think for most things in life any deviation beyond 5% from the average is not normal.

Bingo.

When 91% of qualified minority applicants are offered appointments, while only 55% of qualified non-minorities are offered appointments, it cannot be denied.

Using race as an admission factor is wrong - as wrong today as it was 50 years ago.

SCOTUS will be soon be ruling on 2 important cases involving race-based admissions policies in higher education.

Fisher v Texas - the case of Abigail Fisher, a white student who claimed she was denied admission to the University of Texas based on racial preference.

Schuette v. Coalition to Defend Affirmative Action - the constitutionality of a Michigan voter initiative that banned racial preferences in admissions to the state’s public universities.

The Fisher case addresses whether affirmative action practices in admissions are constitutional, while the Michigan case addresses whether banning such practices is constitutional.

:cool:
 
Folks,

This thread has outlived its usefulness. I understand that diversity and its role in USNS admissions is a subject of much interest and controversy. However, as I said a couple of days ago, we won't solve it on this forum.

Instead, posters inevitably start to attack one another over heart-felt beliefs. That doesn't help anyone.

Views on this thread have been aired and re-aired for more than 15 pages. Time to move on.

Your friendly mod.
 
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