armyman736
5-Year Member
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- Jan 1, 2011
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Okay, thank you everyone for your help.
Which is the best public military college?
- Thread starter armyman736
- Start date
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2011
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Armyman,
Everyone here is providing you good advice. Just know that they are also giving the same advice to the thousands of your competitors who are reading these posts. But here's what I would do if I were in your shoes:
Step 1:
Get your ACT score up. Your other stats look good, but your ACT score is your weakest credential and is below average. Regardless of what your peers may tell you about their "desire to serve" or "gung-ho attitude" toward the military, the fact remains that National Test Scores and GPA are the "great equalizer" and the single-most important factor in admissions decisions and whether the schools will elect to offer you financial incentives to attend their school. Heck, I could tell you that I have wanted nothing more my entire life than to be a professional tennis champion -- that ain't gonna make me a professional tennis champion! Although scores are definitely NOT the only factor (i.e., you can't be a book "dweeb" and expect to be viewed by the admissions offices as a potential leader of Soldiers, Airmen, Sailors, and Marines), you certainly can't expect these schools to work overtime to persuade you to attend their school if you have below-average scores. You are totally in the "zone", but you can do better.
As bruno mentioned in Post #7, the average ACT score for VMI is 25 (I expect the others are roughly about the same). You are currently at 23, but you really want to be above average. As soon as possible, you should go to Barnes and Noble and purchase an ACT study guide and practice taking that test. Over and over and over again. You should also find a tutoring center like Huntington Learning Center (http://huntingtonlearning.com/page/sat-psat-act-prep ) to re-teach you what you learned your sophomore year in high school. They will give you a practice test and ask you what score you want to achieve. They will then give you a very good estimate of how many tutoring sessions you need to get you to that stated objective. This tutoring does not come without a price, however. But if it costs you $2000 to earn a scholarship worth $120,000, that is money WELL spent -- a return on investment far better than any single 529 Plan in the country! I did that for my DS, and I was a bit nervous about whether they could deliver. But my DS worked his butt off last summer and it has paid dividends. If you show up to a tutoring center and expect them to spoon-feed you with information, you're totally wasting your money. The choice is really yours.
If you score, say, 28-30 on the ACT the next go-round, you will be above average for the SMCs and should have these schools throwing money at your feet! Do it.
Step 2:
Do well this semester. You have only a few short months left in this semester of your junior year to make or break your chances of gaining admission to an SMC. Do ALL of your homework and ALL extra-credit assignments and study very hard for your tests. Don't let this opportunity slip through your fingers by getting distracted. You can do this!
Step 3:
Get in shape. For the AFROTC and AROTC scholarship applications, you will need to get in shape. Althought there is no "minimum", the boards to look at this. Download the scoresheets for AFROTC and AROTC (do a search on SAF before asking for the link) and search the discussion boards to find out what these services expect in terms of physical fitness standards. The best time to get in shape is in the summer when you are done with finals this year and have extra time.
Step 4:
Learn about ROTC Scholarships. First, start reading the variety of threads on SAF about ROTC scholarships and become familiar with them. Don't start new threads that have been thoroughly discussed before. Save your posts for issues that you truly cannot find elsewhere (or if previously discussed, appear to be dated). I don't mean to discourage you from posting, but please remember that we are volunteering our time here and DO want to answer questions of folks following a noble path (it's a bandwidth issue).
Second, if you are not 1000% sure that you want to serve in a certain branch, apply for the ROTC scholarships for the Army, Navy, and Air Force. You can ALWAYS decline a scholarship, but you will NEVER be accepted for one if you don't apply. You may find yourself only receiving a scholarship in one branch, and that result may actually define your destiny.
Third, if you harbor any thought whatsoever of applying for an AFROTC or NROTC scholarship this year, you should change your SAF name from "armyman736" to something like "Servicemember" -- it will look weird when you start posting on the AFROTC-related threads this fall with a name like "armyman736."
Step 5:
Apply to all SMCs in which you might have ANY interest. Don't worry about whether one SMC is "public" or "private" (which was a really good question, by the way, because you learned that the distinction from an applicant's perspective relates mostly to their posted "sticker price", but not the actual price you pay) or whether one is "better" than the other. For example, you can spend hours learning about the nuances of life at The Citadel, but if you're not granted admission to that school, your time would have been better spent studying for the exam next week. Once you know how you stand in terms of admission, you can start arming yourself with facts on which school to select.
Also, apply for admission on the EARLIEST possible date. You will thank me when you receive scholarship offers to particular schools down the road. Also, for many schools, it is actually easier if you apply early.
Step 6:
Receive offer letters and discard the reject letters (if any). If you happen be rejected from an SMC, don't spend a nanosecond thinking about it. Focus instead on those schools that remain in play. Also, don't let your grades slip because the schools WILL ask you for a copy of your fall and spring grades from senior year. Trust me, cadets with offers in their hand have had their offers revoked because of a student's poor performance during their senior year.
Step 7:
Visit each school. Once accepted, you need visit these schools and talk to the ROTC departments. As bruno has mentioned, your best source of information is the school itself.
Step 8:
Review the financial award letter. Here's where you get down to comparing the REAL cost of attendance (everything else is simply a moving target that can change on a dime). A lot above has been said about the posted "sticker price", but I hope you recognize from Cehr414's post that scholarships happen before, after, and during the admissions cycle.
Step 9:
Make your decision. Congratulations! Be loyal to your new school and NEVER question whether you've made the right decision.
Step 10:
Threads on SAF. Do NOT start a new thread and ask the members of SAF what the previous 9 steps are for gaining admission to an SMC.
Step 11:
Pay it forward. Don't be one of the folks who gain a tremendous amount of knowledge from all the VOLUNTEERS on this website and don't use that knowledge to help others following in your path. Use the experience you gain for the greater good!
Step 12:
If Steps 1-9 don't succeed, start over on Step 1.
Good luck!
Everyone here is providing you good advice. Just know that they are also giving the same advice to the thousands of your competitors who are reading these posts. But here's what I would do if I were in your shoes:
Step 1:
Get your ACT score up. Your other stats look good, but your ACT score is your weakest credential and is below average. Regardless of what your peers may tell you about their "desire to serve" or "gung-ho attitude" toward the military, the fact remains that National Test Scores and GPA are the "great equalizer" and the single-most important factor in admissions decisions and whether the schools will elect to offer you financial incentives to attend their school. Heck, I could tell you that I have wanted nothing more my entire life than to be a professional tennis champion -- that ain't gonna make me a professional tennis champion! Although scores are definitely NOT the only factor (i.e., you can't be a book "dweeb" and expect to be viewed by the admissions offices as a potential leader of Soldiers, Airmen, Sailors, and Marines), you certainly can't expect these schools to work overtime to persuade you to attend their school if you have below-average scores. You are totally in the "zone", but you can do better.
As bruno mentioned in Post #7, the average ACT score for VMI is 25 (I expect the others are roughly about the same). You are currently at 23, but you really want to be above average. As soon as possible, you should go to Barnes and Noble and purchase an ACT study guide and practice taking that test. Over and over and over again. You should also find a tutoring center like Huntington Learning Center (http://huntingtonlearning.com/page/sat-psat-act-prep ) to re-teach you what you learned your sophomore year in high school. They will give you a practice test and ask you what score you want to achieve. They will then give you a very good estimate of how many tutoring sessions you need to get you to that stated objective. This tutoring does not come without a price, however. But if it costs you $2000 to earn a scholarship worth $120,000, that is money WELL spent -- a return on investment far better than any single 529 Plan in the country! I did that for my DS, and I was a bit nervous about whether they could deliver. But my DS worked his butt off last summer and it has paid dividends. If you show up to a tutoring center and expect them to spoon-feed you with information, you're totally wasting your money. The choice is really yours.
If you score, say, 28-30 on the ACT the next go-round, you will be above average for the SMCs and should have these schools throwing money at your feet! Do it.
Step 2:
Do well this semester. You have only a few short months left in this semester of your junior year to make or break your chances of gaining admission to an SMC. Do ALL of your homework and ALL extra-credit assignments and study very hard for your tests. Don't let this opportunity slip through your fingers by getting distracted. You can do this!
Step 3:
Get in shape. For the AFROTC and AROTC scholarship applications, you will need to get in shape. Althought there is no "minimum", the boards to look at this. Download the scoresheets for AFROTC and AROTC (do a search on SAF before asking for the link) and search the discussion boards to find out what these services expect in terms of physical fitness standards. The best time to get in shape is in the summer when you are done with finals this year and have extra time.
Step 4:
Learn about ROTC Scholarships. First, start reading the variety of threads on SAF about ROTC scholarships and become familiar with them. Don't start new threads that have been thoroughly discussed before. Save your posts for issues that you truly cannot find elsewhere (or if previously discussed, appear to be dated). I don't mean to discourage you from posting, but please remember that we are volunteering our time here and DO want to answer questions of folks following a noble path (it's a bandwidth issue).
Second, if you are not 1000% sure that you want to serve in a certain branch, apply for the ROTC scholarships for the Army, Navy, and Air Force. You can ALWAYS decline a scholarship, but you will NEVER be accepted for one if you don't apply. You may find yourself only receiving a scholarship in one branch, and that result may actually define your destiny.
Third, if you harbor any thought whatsoever of applying for an AFROTC or NROTC scholarship this year, you should change your SAF name from "armyman736" to something like "Servicemember" -- it will look weird when you start posting on the AFROTC-related threads this fall with a name like "armyman736."
Step 5:
Apply to all SMCs in which you might have ANY interest. Don't worry about whether one SMC is "public" or "private" (which was a really good question, by the way, because you learned that the distinction from an applicant's perspective relates mostly to their posted "sticker price", but not the actual price you pay) or whether one is "better" than the other. For example, you can spend hours learning about the nuances of life at The Citadel, but if you're not granted admission to that school, your time would have been better spent studying for the exam next week. Once you know how you stand in terms of admission, you can start arming yourself with facts on which school to select.
Also, apply for admission on the EARLIEST possible date. You will thank me when you receive scholarship offers to particular schools down the road. Also, for many schools, it is actually easier if you apply early.
Step 6:
Receive offer letters and discard the reject letters (if any). If you happen be rejected from an SMC, don't spend a nanosecond thinking about it. Focus instead on those schools that remain in play. Also, don't let your grades slip because the schools WILL ask you for a copy of your fall and spring grades from senior year. Trust me, cadets with offers in their hand have had their offers revoked because of a student's poor performance during their senior year.
Step 7:
Visit each school. Once accepted, you need visit these schools and talk to the ROTC departments. As bruno has mentioned, your best source of information is the school itself.
Step 8:
Review the financial award letter. Here's where you get down to comparing the REAL cost of attendance (everything else is simply a moving target that can change on a dime). A lot above has been said about the posted "sticker price", but I hope you recognize from Cehr414's post that scholarships happen before, after, and during the admissions cycle.
Step 9:
Make your decision. Congratulations! Be loyal to your new school and NEVER question whether you've made the right decision.
Step 10:
Threads on SAF. Do NOT start a new thread and ask the members of SAF what the previous 9 steps are for gaining admission to an SMC.
Step 11:
Pay it forward. Don't be one of the folks who gain a tremendous amount of knowledge from all the VOLUNTEERS on this website and don't use that knowledge to help others following in your path. Use the experience you gain for the greater good!
Step 12:
If Steps 1-9 don't succeed, start over on Step 1.
Good luck!
Last edited:
armyman736
5-Year Member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2011
- Messages
- 123
Thank you for the steps! I will try not to post things that have already been mentioned in the threads. Also, I will only be applying to USMA and AROTC scholarship because I am dead set on the army. I have researched the other branches and know that the army is the right choice for me. Once again thank you for your time.
It really depends on the State. My comment was geared more toward the astronomical increase in OOS tuition at many public universities. I went to VMI OOS a decade ago, and it was reasonable, but the price now is equivalent to private colleges. I went to law school at an OOS public university, and that was cheaper than the private schools...but it isn't always the case. This is why I said it was a generalization, and why it isn't necessarily something that holds up anymore.
Sticker at Harvard is certainly more than OOS at PSU, although they are generous with their aid packages and PSU may not be as much. I guess they feel that if you are qualified enough to get accepted to Harvard, you should be able to go. Very few people get into Harvard, though. As far as Norwich, I'm glad to hear they are generous as well. I'm not sure it's the case for all private schools.
I wouldn't discourage anyone from applying to all schools in which they are interested.
- Joined
- Dec 23, 2009
- Messages
- 36
Regarding your question about being “hardest academically”, you should take a close look at the academic requirements in each school’s catalog, because there are subtle differences in “core” curricula – meaning the basic classes all students take regardless of academic major – between schools. For example, The Citadel’s core curriculum has two years (16 credit hours) of lab science (Biology, Chemistry, Physics), while VMI’s core curriculum has only one year (8 credit hours) of lab science. Things like that may make a difference when it comes to determining what you think is academically "hard."
armyman736
5-Year Member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2011
- Messages
- 123
Thanks for the info. I will be taking physics college credit next year in high school, so you know if these military colleges accept college credits?
bjkuds
5-Year Member
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- Oct 25, 2010
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Contact the registrar's office at the school your interested in to see if the credits transfer from the current college you attend and what grade you need to have. Also if you do an overnight at VMI in the spring you may luck out and get an invite to one of their many academic/athletic camps that they hold in the summer. I'm pretty sure physics was one of the camps they held. DS went to Chemistry camp and it was a good experience for him. Not really sure if an overnight visit was the reason for the invite to apply to camp or not, that was our experience anyway.
Last edited:
bjkuds
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- Oct 25, 2010
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- 613
after re reading your post...do you mean AP classes or are you taking college classes in High School? If you are going to a college, my answer stands. If you are looking for AP college credit..not sure if the take a 4 or 5..you may need to take placement tests regardless.
- Joined
- Jan 25, 2009
- Messages
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Here's info on The Citadel's credit policies:
AP: http://www.citadel.edu/registrar/credit-by-examination/advanced-placement.html
CLEP: http://www.citadel.edu/registrar/credit-by-examination/clep.html
Transfer Credits/Dual Enrollment Policy: http://www.citadel.edu/registrar/transfer-policy.html
Specific Transfer credit policy for credits that have been approved in the past:
http://www.citadel.edu/registrar/south-carolina-college-transfer-credit-articulation.html
Overall, the Registrar's office is pretty fair with credit. I transferred in a good amount of AP and Joint enrollment credits, which allowed me to double major. The Citadel does have more core course requirements than most schools (12 hours of English, 16 of Science, and of course 8 semesters of ROTC) but I think it provides a more well-rounded education overall. I also encourage everyone to apply to the Honors Program. The Citadel's Honors Program is fantastic, and I feel that it really pushed me to work harder and do better in my academics. Though I'm only a sophomore, I'm already seeing tangible results.
AP: http://www.citadel.edu/registrar/credit-by-examination/advanced-placement.html
CLEP: http://www.citadel.edu/registrar/credit-by-examination/clep.html
Transfer Credits/Dual Enrollment Policy: http://www.citadel.edu/registrar/transfer-policy.html
Specific Transfer credit policy for credits that have been approved in the past:
http://www.citadel.edu/registrar/south-carolina-college-transfer-credit-articulation.html
Overall, the Registrar's office is pretty fair with credit. I transferred in a good amount of AP and Joint enrollment credits, which allowed me to double major. The Citadel does have more core course requirements than most schools (12 hours of English, 16 of Science, and of course 8 semesters of ROTC) but I think it provides a more well-rounded education overall. I also encourage everyone to apply to the Honors Program. The Citadel's Honors Program is fantastic, and I feel that it really pushed me to work harder and do better in my academics. Though I'm only a sophomore, I'm already seeing tangible results.
Marianne65
5-Year Member
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2011
- Messages
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Norwich is private; however, it is the birthplace of ROTC and therefore covers room and board if you get a 4 year ROTC scholarship. Not all other schools will cover room and board, but some do.
armyman736
5-Year Member
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- Jan 1, 2011
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Um, I am not sure. I take these classes at my high school but my school calls them college credit classes so I do not know. These college credit classes i take I have to pay the college separately from my school tuition that sponsors the class through my school.
armyman736
5-Year Member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2011
- Messages
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NGCSU
I have researched the senior military colleges and have decided that North Georgia College and State University is where I want to go (if West Point falls through). How do my chances look to become accepted into their Corps of Cadets?
-3.825 GPA (unweighted)
-9 of 53 class rank (small private school)
-23 ACT composite
-Cross country captain and varsity letter
-Student government
-Youth Group member
-Almost 200 service hours
-part-time job during school year and over 40 hours a week in the summer
-I am in all honors classes that my school offers and in 3 college credit classes currently.
I have researched the senior military colleges and have decided that North Georgia College and State University is where I want to go (if West Point falls through). How do my chances look to become accepted into their Corps of Cadets?
-3.825 GPA (unweighted)
-9 of 53 class rank (small private school)
-23 ACT composite
-Cross country captain and varsity letter
-Student government
-Youth Group member
-Almost 200 service hours
-part-time job during school year and over 40 hours a week in the summer
-I am in all honors classes that my school offers and in 3 college credit classes currently.
equestriangrl93
5-Year Member
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2011
- Messages
- 77
I am interested in Valley Forge Military College. Can someone tell me about their experiences there? Thanks for your help.