Stand and Fight …. No one gets out of this World alive

Heatherg21 said:
Curious as to how Putin will perceive Poland gifting/selling soviet era planes to Ukraine (assuming that deal happens).
Will he see it as NATO being involved first hand?
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He might see it that way. But we need to stop this guy now no matter the cost. I am afraid the cost will be much higher the longer we wait. This is somewhat of a reversal by me.
 
Heatherg21 said:
Curious as to how Putin will perceive Poland gifting/selling soviet era planes to Ukraine (assuming that deal happens).
Will he see it as NATO being involved first hand?
Click to expand...
Well, I wouldn't bet my son's life on this but he might conveniently ignore it. I doubt he really wants to take on NATO, and that's why he's blustering. Then again, he may in fact be a madman, so anything could happen. Have I covered all my bases?

Edit: Glad I'm not the President.
 
kinnem said:
Glad I'm not the President.
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THIS! It’s so easy to be a talking head on television, waxing oh so eloquently about how the US/NATO should do this, should have done that, etc., etc., etc. None of them is actually responsible for the lives of a few million troops, not to mention hundreds of millions of civilians. Bluster, no matter how confidently and adamantly it may be delivered, is still just noise.

Are the President and his NATO counterparts, along with their respective national-security advisors, doing the right thing? Only time will tell. I do know they feel like they have the weight of the world on their shoulders. Because if Putin indeed is a madman — which seems increasingly so each day — then the fate of the world is indeed in the balance.

We’ve spent nearly 70 years avoiding nuclear holocaust. Let’s think and decide and move very, very carefully.
 
I don’t like being blackmailed, and especially not nuclear blackmailed. I am almost ready to vote for a no-fly zone. If Putin declares war in response, we could try a “decapitation strike.” Anyway, since there are no good sports on this afternoon I’m going to sign off and watch Crimson Tide.
 
I think those polish planes are less the issue than the——no fly zone.

Even a 30 hour no fly zone , some time to allow folks to cool, and some time for citizens trying to flee who might have a chance to flee without being killed.
 
Ok, assassination, covert ops,
No-FLY-zone, fight to the death, got all that. And thank you very much.

Several current and former diplomats spoke of how the madman changed during Covid. Madman is distant, bewildered, and frazzled. Maybe he needs a vacation. He was surrounded by Aeroflot flight attendants yesterday. So the next step is to fly to Hawaii for a two week vacation, all expenses paid, compliments from NATO. He can then enjoy the lively sunrises and sunsets while donning an Aloha shirt and surf shorts and cool 😎 sunglasses… while drinking Mai Tais in Waikiki. And the biggest nuke war in human history can be prevented by listening to “Somewhere over the rainbow…” with a ukulele in the background…I’m just saying…
 
Heatherg21 said:
Curious as to how Putin will perceive Poland gifting/selling soviet era planes to Ukraine (assuming that deal happens).
Will he see it as NATO being involved first hand?
Click to expand...
According to Putin and his propaganda machine, EVERYTHING has NATO fingerprints on it and is further evidence of the West's desire to emasculate and dominate the Russian People. That in and of itself, is not a reason to prohibit the transfer.
 
cb7893 said:
According to Putin and his propaganda machine, EVERYTHING has NATO fingerprints on it and is further evidence of the West's desire to emasculate and dominate the Russian People. That in and of itself, is not a reason to prohibit the transfer.
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We are all this together so much so ( I think ) especially in this forum because our DSs and DDs are at the Service Academies in the North East. One nuke to the NE USA, we’re done.
 
One of the pivotal moments in history was probably AOL instant messaging. All of a sudden, we didn't have to think too much before we impulsively spread our views. The second pivotal moment was when Ted Turner started headline news and we looked for sensational stuff to fill every 30 minutes. Once, even in war, we got our update at the movies (pre-show) or on the evening news (6 & 11). I worry that we now shape our national security policy on the best soundbite of the last half hour.
War is horrible, and as my father said, I never worried about war until the day you graduated from the Academy. If spending blood and treasure is worth the cost of one's son or daughter, then fight like there is no tomorrow and win. If not, use any other method. Now THAT is dramatic!!
 
Banzaipipeline said:
We are all this together so much so ( I think ) especially in this forum because our DSs and DDs are at the Service Academies in the North East. One nuke to the NE USA, we’re done.
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Well, if there is one nuke to the NE USA, it will be accompanied by several hundred all over the globe, so you won't have to worry about it for very long.

Positive thinking for the win!
 
If we are giving planes to the Ukraine AF thru Poland and Poland ends up being attacked by the Russians because of this ——we will have run out of good options.

At that point our boys and girls will almost certainly be going to war. Then we will be imposing a deadly no fly zone.

A limited non nuke war I would hope. But war none the less.

I do wonder if Putin thinks he was ever promised that the US would not react this way If he attacked The Ukraine?
 
cb7893 said:
There is a great joke involving a Polish pilot recalling an encounter with the the Luftwaffe. I am a terrible joke teller, but the I remember the punchline, "Those Fokkers were flying Messerschmidts." (Fokker was an aircraft manufacturer)
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An RAF veteran is giving a talk to a class of school children, and was trying to explain what a typical mission would be like.

"So there I was, escorting the bombers to their target, when out of the blue we were attacked by a bunch of Fokkers. There were about 20 of these Fokkers. One took out my buddy, but I managed to shoot the Fokker down. Then one was on my tail and I coukdn't shake the Fokker, but my pal took care of him. Then I took out two more of the Fokkers..."

The teacher interupts "Children I should explain, the Fokker was a type of figher airplane used by the German Air Force to stop the RAF bombers and their escorts."

"Yes, but these Fokkers were Messerschmitts!"


stolen from reddit
 
That 2nd generals death seems to have been confirmed. I realize generals care about losing troops but I bet they really care about losing fellow generals.

“Ukraine seems to be in no mood to negotiate “

A quote from an expert on Putin

He also claims the sanctions are not about getting the elites to revolt and take care of Putin but to make the country ungovernable.

I am old enough to remember the decades long US political charge that could ruin any US pols chance of election

”soft on communism”

For years now on American pols will be defending their caught on tape moments of——soft on Putin, a supporter of Putin, being a member of the Putin wing, or in the $$ pocket of Putin.
 
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