Advice for a Freshman 3 yr. Army ROTC scholarship winner who wants out although doing well

Tomboysuze

Tomboysuze

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My DS is just completing his second month of ROTC at a very competitive battalion that was often ranked as no 1 in the Country - when they used to rank them. He is doing very well and his mentor told him he is "high speed" and "impressive." He has dreamed of being in the Army since he was five, but after two months, he just does not like many aspects of ROTC and is deciding to get out. He is also in the Honors College at his school - so he has very little time to make friends and have a social life. His battalion is VERY TIME CONSUMING as their standards are over and above what most ROTC programs require. Since he hasn't signed a contract, that's not a problem - but we are encouraging him to stick it out for his Freshman year because he's in a transitional stage. Just looking for some opinions here: Is this a standard reaction for most 18 yr olds? College is a huge transition anyway - and he is lonely because of the time commitment. FYI - in high school he had lots of close friends - both male and female - so he's not shy. He just doesn't have time to connect with other students. This past weekend was homecoming but instead of being able attend his first freshman homecoming, he was in the woods on an overnight field training. Normally, he'd like that kind of thing - but PT five days a week and two ROTC classes a week on top of his honors classes burning him out quickly. Advice? Thanks!
 
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Sounds like just part of adjusting to college life to me. Give it time. He'll make friends and he'll also master the time management side of things. It can't hurt him trying to stick it out for a year unless his grades really take a plunge. Also, I'm not sure why dropping ROTC solves the friendship problem. He's spending time with people while participating in ROTC, right?
 
Thanks for responding, kinnem. He's doing well on time management and his grades are very good thus far. Yes, he's spending time with the other cadets but they are always either in PT or in class - not socializing. And, although he's giving it 110 percent of his effort, he is not as obsessed with ROTC as 90% of other cadets appear to be - so he's wondering if this is a good fit for him. Also, I think the tough part for him is that he has to be in bed by 9-10 every night so he can get up and do PT 5 days a week - and that's when people socialize on campus and get to know each other. (And other things that I don't mind if he misses, frankly.) I guess my question is not easy to answer, but in general, do people know if this is a good fit for them pretty quickly? He's having issues with the lifestyle and how it separates him from 'civilian students'. He also doesn't like being part of a bureaucracy - but he knows he'd have to accept that loss of control to be successful. He's not sure he can do that. And, I agree, with you on the time thing. We are encouraging him to give it a full year, but he's becoming convinced that he may not be an "Army guy" after all.
 
Your son is in the honors college, so perhaps he's also living in the honors dormitory, in which case he may be exposed to highly intelligent, creative young people, many of whom who have no understanding or use for the authoritarian, hierarchical, and disciplined nature of the military, even the diluted version offered by ROTC. Some may even be intrigued by the challenge of luring him from his ROTC responsibilities. I bet these people are a lot more fun and less critical of him than the MS3s who order him around and evaluate him.

If you want to deal successfully with the competing pressures in college, you have to become efficient, even ruthless, in how you use your time. My son set a goal for himself of Active Duty and a competitive branch. He would not deny he partied hard in college, but not between Sunday night and Friday afternoon. Until well into his MS4 year, he never missed a morning PT, cut an academic class, or turned in an assignment late. His first roommate during his freshman year loved computer games and illegal substances and would often be going to bed as my son was rising for PT. He lacked stamina, however, and was gone by Thanksgiving.

The 6 a.m. thing is a fact. As the days get shorter, your son will learn the phrase "o-dark thirty." Now an infantry platoon leader on active duty, my son has to be ready for his soldiers well before 6 a.m. five days a week, and, yes, sometimes his weekends are spent in field exercises. He says he really likes his job.
 
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Thanks, EDElahanty. You're right. He is in the honors dorms at a Catholic University where the student body is very dedicated to their faith - so a majority of them understand the role of authority in their lives. But they are also regular college students who want to party. And, like your son, my son wants to party as well. But also like your son, he is ruthless with his time and is following the same kind of exacting routine. He's doing well, he's just not happy. He's a very fit, nice looking, spiritual, kind guy - so one would think that he'd be becoming more settled, not less, as he doesn't have many struggles that most kids his age have to deal with. He is one of the creative, intelligent types, but also very old school in respect for tradition and logical thinking. But, I guess this is just going to take some time to see if this is the right path for him and there is no way to know if you fit in unless you give it time. Thanks again.
 
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I guess my son made a point of socializing with NROTC guys. He had plenty of friends who were non-NROTC bt he would hang out with the ROTC folks for breakfast after morning PT, Sun AM breakfast after stadium cleanup, Friday night after their Boat Crew workout. They also partied hard on Saturday night (usually in someone's apartment with a rotational lookout outside). There were plenty of non-NROTC folks with them, and certainly his girlfriend and her friends were non-NROTC and they'd spend lots of time together on weekends with that group doing outdoor things. I guess you establish friendships where you are and socialize while your together or make a point of getting together. Again, give him time. I'm sure the lure of partying and missing a "normal" college experience is weighing heavily on him. At some point he'll probably figure out that the ROTC kids have it together while the party-hearty fun crowd really doesn't. There's a happy medium somewhere for him.
 
"Again, give him time. I'm sure the lure of partying and missing a "normal" college experience is weighing heavily on him."

Nail on the head comes to mind...thanks!
 
Tomboysuze: Your DS sounds like a great young man. I read through all your posts and wanted to make some comments back. First off, you asked a couple times about whether this is a "standard reaction" and whether people know ROTC is a good fit quickly. Honestly, the spectrum is wide: some know right away, others take time. This, in part, is why the students get some discernment time. The pendulum will swing and those that love it will become disillusioned, and vice versa. This is normal and Uncle Sam allows for time to come to a conclusion before signing a contract.

A little more troubling for me were your observations that he doesn't like being part of a bureaucracy and adapting the lifestyle. ROTC is not "real" military life - it is an approximation of certain aspects of what an active duty lifestyle will be like. But if he really doesn't like being part of a bureaucracy he will not be happy in the army (or in any corporate work environment)!

You mention he is unhappy, lonely, and feeling separated from civilian students. Only you can know for sure, but perhaps he is homesick, or just having difficulty transitioning to college life. You mentioned that he is in an honors dorm. I would bet half of those kids see the grass as greener over in the standard dorms. Everyone is finding their place and perhaps feeling a little overwhelmed. But as far as mixing with civilian students you son has ample opportunities in the dorm, class and the dining hall if nothing else.

Like the others, I support the suggestions to stick this out for the semester - and even for his entire freshman year. I would urge him to give this a real chance before deciding to drop out. If it were my son, I might appeal to the commitment he made at the start and urge him not to quit early (out of respect to his peers and the unit) - but that is my approach and may not fit into yours. Finally, as kinnem notes above, if he is truly unhappy, grades are suffering, etc then you may need to counsel your son differently.

Best of luck to you and your DS.
 
USMCGrunt - Thank you so much for your thoughtful response. He is having a difficult transition - in part - because we are very close. I should mention a mitigating circumstance. He is our youngest child out of four. Our oldest son was accepted to VMI in 2006 and was very, very excited to go - but was killed in a car accident three weeks before his HS graduation. He was a fantastic kid, natural leader and very charismatic - much loved, fun, spiritual, selfless and popular - a poet/warrior temperment. Anyway, DS I'm referring to above was only 8 yrs. old at the time of our eldest son's death and stepped up like a man to take his brother's place (so to speak) for our family. There is a lot going on here, obviously. While the military was a perfect fit for our oldest - we're being careful about our youngest feeling like he must fill his shoes. Thank you - all - for taking the time to give me the benefit of your experience. It is very much appreciated. I'm grateful, too, for the bit about reminding him of his committment - that is our style as well.
:) PS... my 'avatar' is a picture of the patch one of my oldest son's best friends wore through his ranger training in his memory. My oldest son had convinced him to go to VMI with him and become airborne rangers together. His friend did every jump with this patch to honor him. What a guy!
 
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@Tomboysuze your family has had a difficult journey, and you are handling your youngest son with such grace, I admire that.

I agree with the above, time is his friend. It is possible he is processing a lot more than any of us can imagine. Time gives him the space he needs to have all the right information to make a decision. Maybe suggest to him that during the long winter break while he is home might be a good time to talk about a decision whether to stay in ROTC or not. Just a suggestion, but a change of scenery and a break from the grind might help him to see the full picture.
 
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I can speak from experience. DS was high speed in high school, lots of awards, outstanding junior blah, blah. Half way through his first semester
 
Sorry fat fingers causes me to send the message before it was complete. DS was a 4 yr national winner. Around mid October he called almost in tears over how overwhelmed he was. His mom talked him off the ledge and he finished the year very well. My advice is to let him know there are many who walked his path prior and came out great . I would highly encourage him to finish the year in ROTC and only then can he make a truly informed decision . Best of luck.
 
Our dau is 4 year AROTC winner nursing major. I want you to know I totally understand!! This is by far the hardest thing she has ever done. While I believe she is physically stronger, mentally she is working it out...still. The balance of academics, ROTC, roommate, sleeping and eating properly. She enjoys ROTC and nursing but I'm not sure she is having any "college" fun. I agree, TIME is their friend. Everything will settle in and feel more normal. TIME.....until then we love the stuffing out of them, send them food and be there!!
 
I understand that he is having troubles because there simply isnt enough time. At my school we are simply told to sleep less. It is not uncommon for students to not ever get more than 5, 6 hours tops, of sleep sunday-thursday nights. If he tosses his bedtime back from 9-10 to say 11-12 thats two hours he can socialize. Cost benefit analysis, and for many less sleep and more interaction is worth it.
 
October freshman year...I don't think that's a wise time to make quick decisions. Tell him to gut it out till December...then tell him to finish the year. That's what my dad told me, I met a girl and stayed for my degree. Remind him that AROTC is not the Army. If my DS had not had prior enlisted in his battalion or trusted NCO's as cadre, I think he wouldn't have lasted either. As a matter of fact there may be summer training opportunities that will give him a glimpse of the real Army. Lastly, if he's in an honors program or dorm, it could be that he's coming to grips with the fact that he's not as special as he thought he was. I mean that in the nicest way possible.
 
Thanks nofodad and Kronk. Just to be clear, he's not getting out now - he's just thinking about it. His plan is to stick it out till the end of his Freshman year....or at least till the end of the semester. Actually, now that he's been able to express his feeling about getting out - he's making lists of what he'll regret if he does. He knows he has to give himself more time and that he doesn't have enough information to make a clear decision. And, his high school was full of guys who were much higher achievers than he is - so if anything, he's hoping that he is special enough! ;) .....But, I get your point, nofodad - that's always something to be aware of.
 
My son was a 3YR AD scholarship winner. He was also a high speed JROTC cadet, BC, many awards etc. We also lost a teenage child so I understand both your pain and the profound effect this has on the other siblings.

My son had to fight hard to get in, due to a medical DQ. He finally got the waiver and after fighting so hard he wasn't sure he was happy with what he got. He went in all high speed, wanted AD Infantry and was that classic cadet. His unit is also tough.. they are near Ft. Bragg and always have a few high speed AD (82nd AB/Ranger/SF) Green to Gold cadets who push them far beyond what most other units go through. But in the middle/end of his Freshman year he felt the same way. Wasn't sure what he wanted to do. Wasn't happy with ROTC because the reality didn't quite fit the fantasy. He almost quit but his grandpa (retired COL) talked him into sticking it out after his first year.

He stuck it out, and by his sophomore year was in a better place... then he went to CEIT. I think coming from a high speed unit actually hurt him here.. He did very well, got an amazing OER etc.. but was frustrated with the whole training situation. His unit has 4 FTX's a year, and spends a lot of time in the field, so there was nothing for him to really learn tactically. He is already fit, and an expert marksman (shot 40/40 in both CEIT and Advanced Camp). After that experience he wanted to go into the Guard/Reserve. He had a little better time in Advanced Camp where he got to be on the Opfor team, but again the garrison portion of camp really frustrated him.

Until his CTLT rotation. He was assigned to a down in the dumps transportation unit at Ft. Sill who is between missions, just lost several popular soldiers due to drug tests, and having morale issues. He saw first hand the LT he was working rebuilding the unit, and making it better. He decided that was what he wanted. He now has a burning desire to be that LT. That person leading the troops and having an impact on their lives. He saw in just 3 weeks the impact that one person could have on 40 others. For him it isn't bang bang games anymore. Shooting guns and blowing stuff up was fun he says, but he really just wants to be a leader.

He also changed majors from Criminal Justice to Physics, and will be an MS5 next year (got and education extension). He finally found himself, and his goal. He is hoping for AD Engineering or Chemical.. something with varied missions but ultimately he just wants to lead in whatever capacity they need him.

4 years is a long, long time at that age. He is going to ebb and flow. Sometimes he is going to be ROTC all day all the time, and sometimes he will be burned out. Fortunately he has until the end of his Freshman year to make a decision without causing any impact to himself.
 
My DD is now a sophomore with a 3 year AFROTC scholarship. We received an email after 2 weeks of school in her freshman year. Mom and dad this isn't what I want, etc. she went and talked to her cadre and they talked her off the ledge. Both of us were perplexed on how to handle the situation. We told her to get through 1st semester and would re-evaluate. She came home for long winter break. When she went back she was determined she was going to quit at the end of year but she would finish the year. We told her to keep an open mind. When she came home for spring break her tone had changed....by the end of year she decided to stick with it. She contracted at the beginning of this year and is happy with her decision. This may not be for everyone but I think they need that first year to make that decision. Either way we would have supported her and we told her that. We just wanted her to take her time and make sure she makes the right decision. There is A LOT of changes happening their freshman year and then throw ROTC in with the time commitment and at least 4 years after college. It is huge.
 
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