LDAC 12th Regiment

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by agp312, Jul 8, 2014.

  1. agp312

    agp312 Member

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    Well, DS's turn finally arrived, after long rehab of re-graft of ACL injury for Fall FTX and final clearance a week ago...
    12th Reg is nothing to be excited about, but he's thrilled to be going this year so that he will be commissioned with his ROTC classmates.
    Reading all that had/has/is happening to adjust for heat conditions and the like, can anyone explain to this Army novice mom how/if this affects cadets' scoring, and how it may/may not result in an Active Duty commission.
    Thanks in advance!
     
  2. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

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    Great news that your son was cleared for LDAC.

    As far as scoring, this is anyone's guess. I have a feeling there are going to be a lot of meetings and briefings about LDAC when the dust settles.

    There have been numerous rumors on this board and others regarding what is happening and how the scoring will happen.

    Some have said that everyone will get a S, others from 1st and 2nd Reg. have said they received an E, so nobody knows for sure what is going to happen when it comes to the overall score.

    It seems it would be difficult to give the same E for the later regiments considering they are only doing a fraction of what the earlier regiments have done. My son is in the 7th, I have seen pictures of them doing the APFT but now hear it was cancelled for all following regiments. Land Nav has changed drastically. The biggest issue is the patrolling lanes, they have been cut way back and some are led by the cadre, this makes it hard for anyone to be in a leadership role and give little to be evaluated on compared to the earlier classes.

    In short, LDAC seems to be a mess which will most likely take time to sort out when it's all over.

    My guess is that it will take longer to complete the branching process this year due to all the LDAC issues, cadets will test their patience this year while they wait.

    Even when it's all said and cone, nobody will really know how they made their decisions. When my older son went through this it was a very transparent process, they knew their OMS score, where they were on the National and Active Duty OML, they knew their exact number. The process is nowhere near transparent anymore, Cadet Command does not release either the National or Active Duty OML, cadets have no idea where they are on the list. Now cadets have to wait until the branches are released before they even know if they've made Active Duty, and that's all the info they get, they will never know where they were on the list. Not a good process in my mind when it has so much effect on the cadets future, their future is in the hands of those hidden behind the curtain.

    Best of luck to your son, I guess we'll know more as more cadets finish LDAC.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2014
  3. QA1517

    QA1517 Member

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    DS is in 11th reg. He called last nite (phones are taken away this evening). No APFT, Land Nav is buddy system and only have to find 3 out of 5 to pass. Training lanes and cut down to just 5 and 2 of them are walk thru's. Does not appear that they will spend any nites in the field.

    I agree with Jcleppe as far as scores, even though the first couple of reg's might have been scored and evaluated, they will have to go back make changes to them based upon the reg that does the least. (I would think anyways).
    It might be that everyone's OML score might be based upon their battallions score, since everyone appears to be equal at LDAC.

    Good luck to your ds.
     
  4. agp312

    agp312 Member

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    Thank you for your explanations! I have read the threads regarding LDAC and basically it seems like it's a learning process for Cadet Command (I am being polite).
    I did wonder what the General meant by her remarks at graduation - watched online as DS's ROTC buddy was in Reg 2 (stream was terribly blurry and out-of-focus, hope that improves!) - when she said "Your the first of the last". Now I understand.
    So another question, we were told at DS school that all GPAs are weighted equally, no matter the caliber of the college/university, then how exactly, without much of an LDAC score this year - something all cadets this years worked extremely hard for - will the Active/Reserve cut off be determined??
    Again, DS school explained it was cut and dry (prior to this year!), CC took the # of cadets, those about a certain # were offered Active, those below, not.
    Thanks again from a not-savvy Army mom, living in Columbus, GA
     
  5. Thompson

    Thompson Member

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    I don't think anyone has the answer to that question, either here or CC.

    I'm sure as you've read, there's a lot of things that will have to be considered due to the issues this summer at LDAC.

    But even prior to that there's been talk about doing an overhaul to the current model. Apparently the use of GPA for OML will be slashed for something in favor of a standardized test similar to the GRE's ... but who know's at this point, we are still a LONG ways off from anything remotely near a decision.
     
  6. Jcc123

    Jcc123 Member

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    GPA only makes up 40% of the OML score. The majority of the balance is unaffected by what's going on at LDAC. The evaluations that each cadet received at the battalion level weigh heavily, as do PT tests taken during the school year, and activities the cadet has participated in such as sports, clubs, Airborne or Air Assaults school, CULP, etc. Each cadet will still receive a score from LDAC based on their performance. It just won't be made up of all the components that past years were due to the difficulties they've had with heat, etc.

    The Army usually does a good job evaluating cadets of an equitable set of criteria. This year will be no different.

    As far as the AD cutoff, the process will really be no different than last year. The Army has a need for X amount of AD lieutenants. After removing all the GRFD and volunteer Reserve cadets from the accessions list, the ones who remain comprise the active duty OML.

    After lots of magic and voodoo, some of those on the list will actually get AD. I'm a little unclear on the last step, but have a little faith in the system. For the most part, those cadets who want AD and did enough to earn it will, and those who didn't, won't. For those who fail to get AD, LDAC will most likely not be the reason.
     
  7. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

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    I always hate starting a post with "This is how they used to do it" but here goes.

    Prior to last year LDAC and the Battalion score were equal at 22.5 points each. This year it is 18 for LDAC and 27 for the Battalion.

    It's good to remember that 27 points is the max from the battalion. This score includes many categories including leadership and EC's. While things like CTLT, CULP, and summer training are good, they only account for a small portion of the score. A SMP cadet will get more points the a cadet that went to Airborne or other training. These extra things do not add extra points, they are just a small part of the battalion score.

    As far as how much LDAC can have an effect, I can tell you how it worked with my older son who commissioned under the previous point totals.

    My son's stats were:
    3.5 GPA
    Ranked 2nd in the battalion
    Went to Airborne and CTLT
    Color Guard Commander
    Superior Cadet Sophomore year
    300 both battalion APFT and 287 at LDAC (This was when the APFT at LDAC carried more weight and was graded by newly minted 2LT's, they have since corrected that fiasco.)

    My son received an E at LDAC......3 S's and 3 E's with 12 dimensional E's (There were 6 categories then unlike the 4 now.)

    To compare, another cadet at my son's school had a higher GPA, and was ranked #1, the rest was about the same. This cadets received a S at LDAC.

    My son was at 6.4% on the final OML, the other cadet was at 22.9%. LDAC made a big difference. For some cadets an E at LDAC was the difference between AD or Reserves. LDAC had a big effect on branching.

    While LDAC is worth less points there would have still been a big effect on the cadets ranking had things worked as planned this year. With the mess they have now it will be difficult to gauge where a cadet ends up.

    Word is that every cadet will get a 300 for the LDAC APFT, even those that failed the test. That alone will have an effect on the rankings.

    The point is LDAC is only a part of the whole score, but it can still have a big effect on where the cadet lands on the OML. For my older son LDAC was the difference when it came to getting his desired branch.

    My big concern for a lot of cadets is the lack of transparency with the OML. Given that cadets that fall below the AD cutoff can still receive AD if they have a major that matches a certain branch and meet those requirements. Cadets that are at the lower end on the AD OML will find that they are moved to Reserves to make room for these cadets, depending on the branch selections some that are farther up the OML may get forced reserve because their slot will be taken by a cadet that meets the major/branch requirements with the ADSO. Without ever seeing the OML cadets will never know where they actually were on the list. I can understand why CC is doing this, if the list were published there would be a lot of very angry new 2LT's, not a good way to start your career.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2014
  8. Ohio2015Parent

    Ohio2015Parent Member

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    The score of 300 on the APFT is acting as a place holder of sorts, TACs at DS's counseling explained that end of camp commissionees must have a record score to commission. The rest of the cadets will have a score entered either by averaging the Fall and Spring campus record APFT scores or a "re-test" APFT administered shortly after arriving on campus. Which method will be used to determine the actual score of record for LDAC is still up in the air....at least that's the latest until we hear from CC and/or other cadets graduating stories.

    I have a feeling many cadets from 2015 commissioning will be angry 2LTs - the abrupt changes and mess from LDAC will always leave them wondering(especially if they do not receive a desired position). Branching and commissioning will be interesting!
     
  9. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

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    Thanks for clearing up the APFT, that actually makes sense....scary.

    Glad everything went well with your son.
     
  10. QA1517

    QA1517 Member

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    It makes sense that they would administer one when they get back to school.

    Averaging the fall and spring would not show the improvement (or lack of) for some cadets. My personal opinion.
     
  11. paradoxer

    paradoxer Member

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    Buy a little Blue Sky

    I realize the Army is not in the Blue Sky business, and it will be what it will be, but why not allow the cadet to choose since this situation was beyond their control. Allow them to average the previous two semesters or if someone has been working their little butt off to have an amazing score let them retest upon returning to school. This could help to reduce the anger possibly felt by this class of 2015.
     
  12. wildcatmom

    wildcatmom Member

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    Paradoxer,
    +1...I know my DS had plans to completely unwind for a few weeks after LDAC. It has been a very intense year, and while waiting 7 weeks for LDAC he was unable to come home because he is allergic to our dog/tree pollen in our community, and didn't want that to disrupt his training. Now that all of his youngest friends are finally able to enjoy a trip to Las Vegas, he would be very depressed if he had to behave/stay focused, and not enjoy his potentially last chance to have some fun before real life hits...My DS will vote for the average, but I can see a case for giving the option as well.
    If they do have to wait for batallions to get back to school, administer another PT test (even if optional), and get results turned in, then Jcleppe is right...It will be January before any Accension results are released.
     

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