Likelihood Of Commissioning From Norwich?

Discussion in 'Publicly and Privately Funded Military Colleges' started by jnr, Jan 9, 2014.

  1. jnr

    jnr Member

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    Can anyone shed some light on the likelihood of earning an active duty Navy or Air Force commission upon graduation from Norwich? DD has been accepted at NU with a very generous merit based scholarship. DD intends to study computer science and is pursuing NROTC and AFROTC scholarships, as well as USNA and USAFA appointments.

    I realize there are a number of variables along the way so for the sake of discussion lets assume:

    The cadet maintains good grades at NU, say 3.2 or higher

    Has not and does not rob a 7-11, or commit other acts of stupidity

    Actively and passionately participates in NROTC or AFROTC all 4 years

    But, has NO NROTC or AFROTC scholarship.


    I am trying to understand the likelihood of DD being able to serve as an AD officer in the Navy or AF upon earning a BS from NU without the benefit of an ROTC scholarship.


    Thanks to everyone on the site in advance, as you folks are always great at providing timely and honest feedback.
     
  2. Jarhead1775

    Jarhead1775 Member

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    I may be in the same boat come next year. (I also got the merit scholarship to NU) but if you don't have the ROTC contract out of HS or freshman year, when your junior year rolls around, you can make the obligation to serve in the branch of your choice if you are in good standing. And meet the rest of the commissioning requirements.
     
  3. Full Metal Bulldog

    Full Metal Bulldog Citadel Class of 2016

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    This is speaking on behalf of The Citadel, but I'm sure its true of all SMC's: anyone who wants a commission, who can commission, commissions.
     
  4. jnr

    jnr Member

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    Thanks Jarhead and Full Metal Bulldog.

    Do you know if being able to commission from an SMC if you want to, is true of all branches? I was led to believe (perhaps wrongly so) that Army commissions are easier to come by for qualified SMC candidates than Navy or Air Force AD commissions. Again, this info may be wrong and I am just trying to gain a better understanding of DD's chances of fulfilling her dream of serving as an active duty officer in the USN or USAF.
     
  5. Full Metal Bulldog

    Full Metal Bulldog Citadel Class of 2016

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    It is easier to commission Army. We're bigger and need more officers. Not saying it's impossible to commission as an Air Force or Naval Officer. But the often-missed point is "can commission", which, as I probably should have included separately, suggests "competitive for a commission". If your daughter wants, I have no doubt she'll be able to graduate from an SMC as an Air Force or Naval O-1. But she'll need good grades, a high PT score, and to stay out of jail. Alot of folks (a hell of alot more than people think) are missing one of those 3 key things.
    If she keeps her grades up, just as high as she can, tries her best to be a studette at PT, and is a person of steadfast character, she'll be able to fulfill that dream without too much angst. If she REALLY wants Navy or Air Force, a STEM major might give her an edge, but thats a topic for another conversation: ability to keep a high GPA or personal enjoyment vs a high-speed major.
     
  6. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    Not an expert, but getting commissioned and being able to serve on active duty are two separate matters. There some good discussions and many predicts a fewer cadets will go active duty from ROTC than before. With a larger Reserve Component, the Army will commission many, not not sure how many will go active duty. Whenever the Army end strength is determined, that will determine how many ROTC cadets to commission and what percentage will go active duty.
     
  7. nuensis

    nuensis USNA 2016

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    There is a plebe in my company who failed to obtain advanced standing at Norwich despite good grades and no honor/conduct issues. Luckily, USNA decided to give him another chance, but it does happen.

    Obtaining a contract should be taken seriously, regardless of where you attend.

    NROTC commissions active duty only (unless you become a medical student). If you achieve advanced standing, it will be an active duty contract.
     
  8. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    AFROTC is like NROTC, if selected for summer field training (SFT) than the cadet will become a POC. Upon commissioning they will go AD. There is no reserve or guard option for AFROTC grads.

    The trick is getting an SFT slot. If not selected for SFT (sophomore yr) AFROTC can did.enroll the cadet, and at that point it is over for commissioning.
     
  9. jnr

    jnr Member

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    Thanks all!

    Does Navy have anything similar to AF's SFT (i.e, something you must be selected for in sophomore or another year in order to continue with the program)?

    Before starting this thread I was under the impression that earning a N/AF ROTC scholarship was a great boost to ones chances of being commissioned AD. Unless I am misunderstanding something in these replies, it seems as though my initial impression was mistaken.

    Lastly, Pima, what does POC stand for?
     
  10. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    AFROTC is separated into overall groups. GMCs are 100/200/250s. POCs are 300 and 400s, in the NROTC terms it is advanced standing, or upperclassmen.

    Scholarships are great, but the reality is once in AFROTC the slate is wiped clean. It is what you accomplish in AFROTC that matters. SFT selection is a formula, and nowhere on there are direct points given because you have a scholarship. Indirectly, maybe. IE scholarship cadet are probably more congnizent of their GPA even as a 1st semester freshmen, whereas other cadets may pay attention to it as fall semester sophomores due to financial risk of not being selected for SFT.

    Upon completion of SFT the cadet will go from being a GMC to a POC. To commission they must be a POC for at least 3 semesters.
     
  11. glen

    glen Member

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    Commissioning and Active Duty upon graduation from SMC

    The Army ROTC program is the only ROTC program that guarantees active duty for an initial service period, upon graduating (and meeting all qualifications for commissioning) from a Senior Military College - including Norwich. The rest of the services depend on their need for 2LTs, and the Cadet's rankings among other ROTC participants. The key even for Army contracted Cadets is meeting all qualifications - GPA, rankings at Summer Camp, Physical fitness, and Medical exam. My thoughts are that Air Force, Navy are cranking down on commissions as well as active duty assignments. Army is too.
     
  12. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Just for clarification, AF and Navy only offer AD commissions, there is no Guard or Reserve option via their ROTC commissions. You commission AFROTC from an SMC or a traditional college, you will be AD either way, thus from that perspective an SMC gives no edge. It may give an edge for SFT selection.

    The rest is true for AFROTC, you must be selected to become POC, and it from a board selection that is is competed on a national level. The twist comes from the major. Tech majors get more of an edge compared to non-tech majors.

    Also it is true that for the next 5 years the AF will be cutting their AD manpower by @8% or. @25k people.

    However, that being said, the OP should not IMPO go into a ROTC program because it has a higher chance of commissioning 4 years out.
    ~ Do you think that the kids commissioning this year fore saw that their group would be offered the chance to walk away, and if enough don't walk the AF will not commission them. This is a group if memory serves correctly they had a 93% selection rate for SFT, nationally. Going back to SMC, I know VT has traditionnaly always had a higher rate than traditional colleges, but than again VT has a lot of tech majors, and the avg incoming class has a 1280 SAT. Both are part of the score/weight for selection, thus I don't know how much weight I would put on being a cadet at an SMC. Just saying that for AROTC attending an SMC may have an edge.

    The point is nobody has a crystal ball, and with sequestration in effect for 9 more years. My bet is every branch will sooner or later cut manpower to make their budget.

    ~ four years of your life AD in a branch you accepted only because it guaranteed an AD commission before you enter the SMC can be a regret. College is where you decide to go. You decide what you want to study. It is not 24/7/365 days a yr. wherever the Army decides to send you, doing what they decide should be your career field.

    There are some that just want to be in the military, and will be happy in any branch. There are others that do not want to serve in any branch, but specific branches. The person needs to decide which one they are. Trust me every branch has he!! hole assignments and all of those places need O1s. That can impact your happiness very quickly. If you are not willing to accept the worst station and in your number 3 career field choice, life maybe filled with counting down 1461 days until you can bolt.
    ~~~ You want to fly, but when you go for your flight physical you are DQ'd. For AFROTC it is done the summer of your rising SR year in college. You than get maintenance officer as your career field, and Grand Forks ND. Will you now be saying, dang I should have gone Army?

    Something to think about.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2014
  13. jnr

    jnr Member

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    Thanks Pima!

    That really helped clarify things for me and correct the misconception I had on the role scholarships play in commissioning.

    I sincerely appreciate your input. :smile:
     
  14. bob80q

    bob80q bob80q Banned

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    Keep in mind that there are also many commissioning opportunities in the National Guard and Reserves, commissioning slots on the active duty side will be decreasing with the drawdown that is underway but the best opportunities will still be at the SMCs which have significantly more slots than other colleges due to their large detachment sizes.
     
  15. runslikeajohndeere

    runslikeajohndeere Member

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    Great opening question!

    DS also had a fantastic offer from Norwich. We ended up visiting a second time, and I really though he was going to attend in the fall. I would suggest a visit since you have time as more choices materialize.

    DS ended up attending another school, but we were pleased with Norwich- was going to pay the enrollment fee in December of 2012! I agree with some posts that suggest finding the best fit. There are many fine young men and women in these programs across the country, and one just needs to find a program that will provide the best opportunity.

    Norwich has many opportunities for development and leadership. There are some good academic programs there as well- which I consider the most important- 1. interest may ensure higher GPA with student investment 2. Factors into OrderMeritList status (do well) 3. This could be their future after serving duty or career in services.

    DS liked another program for other reasons after weighing some great options.

    Good luck!
     

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