New trend for NROTC?

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by jiller59, Apr 16, 2015.

  1. jiller59

    jiller59 Member

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    DS told me that he heard there will be fewer high school scholarships and more given to college programmers in the future (or maybe even already now?) This may just be people talking, but thought I would start a thread to find out what others know or have heard.

    What he heard (which makes sense) is that the Navy has a better chance of selecting candidates that will stick with the program and succeed if the Navy waits until the students have some college and involvement in the program. There will be fewer "free" years of tuition paid to students that decide to drop letting the Navy do more with the available funds.

    I have heard that the % of scholarship vs college program varies a lot by school. When my DS started the 4C group consisted primarily of scholarship recipients and only 3 college programmers. Interestingly there were about 6 drops during the first year, but all 3 college programmers stayed in ROTC. One moved to Army with a scholarship, the other two received Navy scholarships.
     
  2. Sampia

    Sampia Member

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    I have wondered why they would not choose to do it that way. On the one hand, it enables some potentially excellent future officers to attend college when they might not otherwise be able to afford it. On the other hand, doing it the college programer way, it would be less expensive for the gov't. The college programmer must prove beyond putting together a great application package that he or she is a serious and good candidate. If they are trying to save money, how necessary are the military academies? Do they actually produce officers of a quality that reflect the cost of their education? There are certainly many paths the government can take while trying to save money.
     
  3. Vista123

    Vista123 Member

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    ArmyROTC- last year when my son interviewed with PMS for National AROTC scholarship the PMS came out afterwards and asked if I had any questions, One thing the PMS said was that Army was moving more towards campus based scholarships and less national scholarships. The PMS said that campus based scholarships were "more successful." I didn't know what the PMS meant by "more successful" but it seems to go along with what NROTC is looking at.
     
  4. John Patrick

    John Patrick Member

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    What you heard is correct jiller59. My CO told us in the fall that NSTC was planning on taking a significantly higher percentage of college programmers starting with next years scholarship boards. The reasoning behind it is to increase the percentage of freshman that complete the program because right now only about 40% of incoming freshman with scholarships graduate and commission compared to USNA's 90%.
     
  5. Larry321

    Larry321 Member

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    Wow... I'm not about to question the stats you quoted but the schools NROTC is in usually have a +80% grad rate so 40% is way low.
     
  6. hokiesfan

    hokiesfan Member

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    They're graduating, they're just not commissioning. I know how many were at my son's NROTC orientation and I'd be very surprised if the rate was as high as 40% given the numbers at commissioning.

    In-school scholarships are an excellent idea, really. A lot of kids don't really know what they're getting into with ROTC and when faced with the reality find out it's not really for them. It's also frustrating to see deserving candidates pushed out of NROTC after two years despite working hard to get a contract while some four-year scholarship recipients are content to slide by knowing they'll commission so long as they don't do anything stupid.
     
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  7. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    And even then many do something stupid and get tossed! DS's class will only have roughly 38% commissioning of those that started. I do not know how many were on scholarship at the start, nor how many of those remain. The 38% is just the overall number.
     
  8. Larry321

    Larry321 Member

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    "They're graduating, they're just not commissioning" - Agree. I'd assume that they follow the same college drop out or graduate rates the rest of the schools population does.

    ",,,while some four-year scholarship recipients are content to slide by knowing they'll commission so long as they don't do anything stupid." - So college programmers have to get selected to continue with their last 2 NROTC years while those that got a NROTC scholarship are auto selected to continue to the end of the program (and commission)? Unless the "something stupid factor" comes into play.
     
  9. USMAROTCFamily

    USMAROTCFamily Member

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    I think these statics vary greatly by college. DD's school has an extremely high commissioning rate, as well as graduation rate school-wide. I fear if they go in this new direction, it could definitely have different impact depending on the school. DD would never have gone to her college, due to the cost of it, without having the NROTC Scholarships. I know many people here recommend you not choose a school that you cannot afford without the college, but we felt the risk was worth the reward to go to this college. Not offering 4-year scholarships, could certainly change the applicant pool. I guess the Navy has considered all of this, though, already before making any of these decisions.
     
  10. mattjr96

    mattjr96 Member

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    The idea of giving more scholarships to CP's rather than high school seniors is from my observations a good idea. The 4/c's in my Batt. that were selected out of high school were not as prepared, or enthused to be selected for an opportunity to be, in my case of observation, a Marine officer. We do however have a number of CP Marine options that out perform the high school scholarship recipients in all areas of grades, leadership and physical fitness. More scholarships given out to CP's is a financially smart idea for the DoD especially with today's budget, since they're not a financially liability, unlike the high school recipients who can drop after 1 year with no penalty so the Navy/Marine Corps just gave them a free year of college with no gain to the organization.
     
  11. terp1984

    terp1984 Member

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    I am not sure I buy that 40% commissioning rate-possibly at some schools , but overall I would like to think it is much higher. At my DS's college, I would say more like 80-90% commissioning. That certainly is an interesting question if someone can find some "hard" numbers on the comissioning rate in NROTC.
     
  12. jiller59

    jiller59 Member

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    I think the commissioning rate at University of Michigan is higher than 40% too. My son's class started with 34, 6 were college programmers. One college programmer received an Army ROTC scholarship, 2-3 of the other programmers received scholarships. There are 24 now finishing their 3rd year, so will be commissioning in a year. That's about a 73% commissioning rate (including the one Army cadet). I know this is only one class at one school.
     
  13. Michael R.

    Michael R. Member

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    Hey, you said your child went to Michigan for NROTC. What were his stats? Michigan is my first choice school. I got a 27 ACT with a 33 on the math and 3.96 GPA. Lots of extra curriculars. Varisty Cross Country and Track and captian of cross country. Also in many clubs and also top 10% of class. Some volunteer service but not much. Im also on a swim team and also have taken over 10 AP classes. What are my chances? My application is already in Florida for review.
     
  14. jiller59

    jiller59 Member

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    I apologize that it took me so long to come back here and find your question.

    DS is a senior at University of Michigan with graduation/Commissioning coming this April. Your stats look great, though you may want to take ACT again, or even take SAT. Search the forum since there has been lots of discussion for the reasons.

    Here are his stats, but stats are hard to compare and there are many factors that go into the decision of who gets a scholarship. Also, one of my son's first NROTC buddies was a college programmer who was offered a scholarship during his sophomore year. That young man recently passed his Nuke interview and is doing great. There are many paths to commissioning!

    GPA 3.9 unweighted/4.36 unweighted
    Class rank 2/240
    8 AP classes (scored 5's and 4's)
    dual enrollment - 2 classes (Physics I and Calc II)
    SAT 1250 (760 math/760 reading)
    ACT 35 superscore/34 regular score
    National Honor Society President
    National Merit Scholarship finalist
    4 years cross country - 3 years team captain
    4 years track
    served on City's Youth Advisory Council
    Quiz Bowl - 4 years/selected for All State in last year
    Forensics Extemporaneous Speaking
    math tutor

    Your stats sound similar and I wish you my best as you move forward with your post high school plans. I am sure you will do great - you have worked hard to get this far and sound motivated! Keep us posted.
     
  15. Jcc123

    Jcc123 Member

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    ^ Did you mean 1520 on his SAT?
     
  16. cb7893

    cb7893 Member

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    My DS applied exactly one year after Jiller's. As she said, much has changed. My DS had stats that were almost identical, from NMS Finalist to 4 yrs varsity sport and State Science Bowl Champ. Class Rank and actual SAT's a hair lower. Also, he had no under-represented minority points to collect.

    My DS was accepted at U Mich and received the NROTC scholarship, but was medically DQ'ed for an eye injury.

    Let me give you some valuable advice:

    Make plans B, C, and D

    Be a resident of Michigan.
    If your not, don't sweat it. Neither are 5000 other applicants.

    Apply early decision.
    It is not binding at U Mich. Do everything in your power to let them know that U Mich is your absolute #1 choice. You may have been told you're a super star. U Mich doesn't care. There are super stars from around the country and around the world who are dying to go there and are willing to pay full freight. DS's best friend had better stats than you or Jiller's or my DS...2400 SAT, #1 in class. He was admitted to Columbia University and denied at Michigan. DS's GF, with lesser stats than all of those mentioned, applied early decision to U Mich Engineering College and was accepted. Why was best friend denied? Our good friend, who is in the college application advisory racket, says it was because DS's best friend did not apply early admission and they didn't believe he would actually attend U Mich if accepted. The Holy Grail of college admissions departments is "low acceptance, high yield".

    Therefore, if you get the scholarship before your admission, let U Mich know immediately. Show them you have the $40k/yr check in hand.

    Be very careful doing anything that could cause an injury. DS was kicked in the eye with a soccer ball during gym class of all things during Thanksgiving week. There was no permanent damage, but he was DQ'ed.

    Did I mention have plans B,C, and D.

    Keep us posted.

    Best of luck! Sounds like you've earned it.
     
  17. Michael R.

    Michael R. Member

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    Dang, am I at low chances? I got a 33 on the math but low scores on everything else. 27 composite. Again have taken over 10 ap classes. Do I even have a chance?
     
  18. cb7893

    cb7893 Member

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    Is that GPA weighted or unweighted? What's your class rank? Can you take ACT again? (Look at my posts for improving standardized test scores.) Do your teachers/recommenders/coaches love you?

    For the love of G**, don't sound so self-defeating!

    Apply early decision?
     
  19. Michael R.

    Michael R. Member

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    I will be applying Early Action to Michigan. I am top 10% in class. My unweighted GPA on the college 4.0 scale is 3.92. I have a 4.5833 weighted. And yes I can. I believe I got great recommendations.
     
  20. jiller59

    jiller59 Member

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    Yep, was retyping from one of my old posts, and it was early in the morning!

    That was the total of Math and reading; his overall total was 2,230 - but I don't recall how the NROTC scholarship requires SAT to be reported. DS also took two subject tests (Math 2 and Physics) which may have been for his U of M application.

    Oh, and GO Blue!
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2015

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