USNA Class of 2028 Waiting and Speculating

A1Janitor said:
Are you suggesting TDs had superior stats over their slate’s competition that won the nom?

Or superior stats over some other less competitive slate winner that they didn’t compete for?
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Not at all. I was simply expressing an opinion on why many parents whose children received TDs are understandably upset.
 
Whole candidate includes a lot of intangibles that perhaps "regular" colleges do not put as much (if any) emphasis on for the kids. Hardships? Military background? Work? School strength and overall availability of classes?

I've said it a few times, in our area (town liberty radius to the Academy), kids with 1500+ SAT, 3.9+ unweighted GPA, multi-sport varsity athletes, community service, jobs, etc. etc. are pretty much a dime a dozen. It is an incredibly stacked area because there are high quality public schools and lots of mid-high income families. What that also means, is that scrapping for one spot on one of the nom slates is brutal. We know through experience that they spread the wealth and with rare exception do not give a kid more than one nom to any specific SA between all the MoCs, and do not rank them.

Does that make any of the kids less deserving than the others that do get in? Nope. But, it is a highly competitive situation applying to an Academy and many are going to lose. These kids should know that. But, it doesn't lessen the sting. They've been the best and told they are the best their entire life.

To quote the great Captain Pete Mitchell, this can be applied to the kids trying to get into an SA:

".... they've been told that their entire career, while they've been dropping bombs from a high altitude with little to no dog fighting. The parameters of this mission call for something they have never encountered."
 
NomSeeker said:
I am going to throw this out there. If your DS/DS really wants to attend a service academy, in this case The Naval Academy, and they get turned down the first time, not reapplying sort of says they really didn’t want it bad enough, or maybe not as much as they parents wanted it…
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Not necessarily. I really want to attend a service academy and did everything I could think of to reach that goal, including stuff I would rather have not done in high school. Despite that, I got turned down and will most likely not reapply next year. This is not because I "didn't want it bad enough". It's because my goal is military service, not an academy. No matter how bad I may have wanted it ultimately USNA is a means to an end, and shouldn't (in my opinion) be viewed as an end in and of itself. I have an option to be commissioned into the Marine Corps as a 2LT in four years, why should I add a fifth just to attend a specific school?
 
Edmund said:
Not at all. I was simply expressing an opinion on why many parents whose children received TDs are understandably upset.
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I understand the frustration.

But the way it is framed is what makes it “understandably.” If viewed as a slate competition, it makes more sense.

They are comparing stats between districts. It’s the law they have a problem with.
 
Edmund said:
It's not all about stats, but they certainly play a big part. Hence the reason USNA posts them with each class profile.

All the more reason why you see so much frustration as many of the TDs had superior stats. But as you note, we don't know that secret sauce is they used to pick one kid over another.
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It’s not a fully transparent process. Never has been and never will be. Even if it was, people would still argue the validity of xxx

If you are referring to academic stats, yes that’s a part. But they ALSO post other stats: NHS, varsity captaincy, demographics, etc etc.

What they don’t post are the intangibles. That are as important a piece in the decision as others. IMO, even more so (ie: an academic superstar who has never failed, may dip out minute one. VS a tenacious, gritty person who has been through some ‘stuff’, who knows they will make it through, and be OK).

How do you measure grit, determination, and tenacity? Via stories, essays and interviews. And I would argue those things are the ‘secret sauce’ that will carry someone through the difficult time to come. It’s sure been what has kept some of my plebes there. Characteristics that we knew were within them (as did USNA), but that they had to recognize through adversity.

They also don’t post letters of recommendation, teacher evaluations, etc. Those also play an important part of decisions

Yall only see a snippet of a person. What’s presented to the world. BGO’s get a better picture through their work. And admissions has the WHOLE picture. The young men and women about to commission are fantastic, amazing leaders. Admissions did a great job.

BTW, the kids that I know of that have left? Are more so the academic superstars, but didn’t have the ‘juice’ to get through tough stuff. The ‘secret sauce’ that’s needed. Interesting.
 
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justdoit19 said:
It’s not a transparent process. Never has been and never will be. Even if it was, people would still argue the validity of xxx

If you are referring to academic stats, yes that’s a part. But they ALSO post other stats: NHS, varsity captaincy, demographics, etc etc.

What they don’t post are the intangibles. That are as important a piece in the decision as others. IMO, even more so (ie: an academic superstar who has never failed, may dip out minute one. VS a tenacious, gritty person who has been through some ‘stuff’, who knows they will make it through, and be OK).

How do you measure grit, determination, and tenacity? Via stories, essays and interviews. And I would argue those things are the ‘secret sauce’ that will carry someone through the difficult time to come. It’s sure been what has kept some of my plebes there. Characteristics that we knew were within them (as did USNA), but that they had to recognize through adversity.

They also don’t post letters of recommendation, teacher evaluations, etc. Those also play an important part of decisions

Yall only see a snippet of a person. What’s presented to the world. BGO’s get a better picture through their work. And admissions has the WHOLE picture. The young men and women about to commission are fantastic, amazing leaders. Admissions did a great job.

BTW, the kids that I know of that have left? Are more so the academic superstars, but didn’t have the ‘juice’ to get through tough stuff. The ‘secret sauce’ that’s needed. Interesting.
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Well said.
 
Eagles1221 said:
Not necessarily. I really want to attend a service academy and did everything I could think of to reach that goal, including stuff I would rather have not done in high school. Despite that, I got turned down and will most likely not reapply next year. This is not because I "didn't want it bad enough". It's because my goal is military service, not an academy. No matter how bad I may have wanted it ultimately USNA is a means to an end, and shouldn't (in my opinion) be viewed as an end in and of itself. I have an option to be commissioned into the Marine Corps as a 2LT in four years, why should I add a fifth just to attend a specific school?
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So you would have turned down NAPS or Foundation?

Either way, your desire and willingness to serve is commendable…
 
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NomSeeker said:
I am going to throw this out there. If your DS/DS really wants to attend a service academy, in this case The Naval Academy, and they get turned down the first time, not reapplying sort of says they really didn’t want it bad enough, or maybe not as much as they parents wanted it…
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I think this statement is a bit shortsighted and tries to over simplify and very complex situation. The application process is a marathon grind. it weeds out alot of hopefuls the 1st time they do it. Going a 2nd time with just alittle increase in chances of being appointed makes some consider if the ends justifies the means.

All most all of these TD'd applicants are stellar and good people. They will grow where they are planted. After a few months of college( likely NROTC) the realize they really like where they are and with a NROTC unit. The pull of the USNA just slackens.
They also end up after college in the same place as a Naval Officer.

Be careful assuming someone's motivations. Everybody is different, and things change.
 
Ihavenoidea said:
I think this statement is a bit shortsighted and tries to over simplify and very complex situation. The application process is a marathon grind. it weeds out alot of hopefuls the 1st time they do it. Going a 2nd time with just alittle increase in chances of being appointed makes some consider if the ends justifies the means.

All most all of these TD'd applicants are stellar and good people. They will grow where they are planted. After a few months of college( likely NROTC) the realize they really like where they are and with a NROTC unit. The pull of the USNA just slackens.
They also end up after college in the same place as a Naval Officer.

Be careful assuming someone's motivations. Everybody is different, and things change.
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Agree 100%. Most all of these applicants have amazing plan B's, many of which include an ROTC program. Everyone has their own path.
 
A few more random responses-

gniyji said:
We have none of these except DS has been working for two jobs since age of 15. A typical day of his -- 5:00AM -- 7:00AM swimming training, 8:00AM t0 4:00PM school (including commuting on school bus), then lifeguard shift after school and weekends. It is the best job for him because he can do a lot homework when he is on rotation off from the high chair.
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> This is actually more common than SAF may lead you to believe. Not everyone has all those things listed in the USNA Admissions Profile... Candidates have to make the best of the opportunities they have, and make sure that Admissions knows. (I will admit, I think West Point gives more points for "Grit" factor than USNA.

IronmanDaremo said:
To quote the great Captain Pete Mitchell, this can be applied to the kids trying to get into an SA:

".... they've been told that their entire career, while they've been dropping bombs from a high altitude with little to no dog fighting. The parameters of this mission call for something they have never encountered."
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LOL --good quote, and applicable.

Eagles1221 said:
I really want to attend a service academy and did everything I could think of to reach that goal, including stuff I would rather have not done in high school.
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> Curious, what did you do in HS that you rather would not have done ? I've said for years here to focus on those things things that interest you and you do well, lead in a few areas instead of trying to punch tickets on your resume. People can tell when you are trying to punch tickets.

justdoit19 said:
It’s not a transparent process. Never has been and never will be. Even if it was, people would still argue the validity of xxx
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> Frankly, I think the process is too transparent. There is a lot of angst and hand wringing and criticism when Candidates are trying to figure out details of the system they simply don't have to know, or checking portals every hour for months.

justdoit19 said:
Yall only see a snippet of a person. What’s presented to the world. BGO’s get a better picture through their work. And admissions has the WHOLE picture. The young men and women about to commission are fantastic, amazing leaders. Admissions did a great job.
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The application for Admissions is not perfect. I lead off all BGO interviews with the explanation is that I am trying to fill in the details that the Application missed, so I can paint a picture of who the Candidate is and why they want to attend USNA. I also usually end with a "So what have we missed...is there anything you want USNA to know that hasn't already been presented in the application. The truth is BGO's only see part of the picture themselves, and I've learned a lot from those questions.
 
Ihavenoidea said:
I think this statement is a bit shortsighted and tries to over simplify and very complex situation. The application process is a marathon grind. it weeds out alot of hopefuls the 1st time they do it. Going a 2nd time with just alittle increase in chances of being appointed makes some consider if the ends justifies the means.

All most all of these TD'd applicants are stellar and good people. They will grow where they are planted. After a few months of college( likely NROTC) the realize they really like where they are and with a NROTC unit. The pull of the USNA just slackens.
They also end up after college in the same place as a Naval Officer.

Be careful assuming someone's motivations. Everybody is different, and things change.
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It is that simple. You applied, didn’t get in the first time, and you don’t apply again = you really didn’t want it as bad as others.

I think we can agree the process does test your desire to attend. That desire will be tested by the process, and will be tested if you get in, etc..
 
NomSeeker said:
It is that simple. You applied, didn’t get in the first time, and you don’t apply again = you really didn’t want it as bad as others.

I think we can agree the process does test your desire to attend. That desire will be tested by the process, and will be tested if you get in, etc..
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Life is bigger than an SA. While I do admire some applicants keep trying on one particular SA but I also admire some who have much bigger picture in life and decide moving forward.
 
@Old Navy BGO I took the ACT 5 different times (along with multiple prep courses including one that took up a significant portion of my summer), am cramming college-level stats and calc 1 into my senior year, and took honors science courses all through high school specifically to prep for service academies. I think I worded my above post poorly, I was trying to express that I put everything I had into trying to get into an academy, sometimes at the expense of more fun opportunities or free time to spend with friends.
 
Eagles1221 said:
@Old Navy BGO I took the ACT 5 different times (along with multiple prep courses including one that took up a significant portion of my summer), am cramming college-level stats and calc 1 into my senior year, and took honors science courses all through high school specifically to prep for service academies. I think I worded my above post poorly, I was trying to express that I put everything I had into trying to get into an academy, sometimes at the expense of more fun opportunities or free time to spend with friends.
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Now, you should focus more on fun opportunities and free time with your friends. Enjoy your life, no one else is going to do that for you.
 
If one's goal is to serve, and they are putting in the extra work to get there, in the long run, they will (through whichever path works out for them).

This experience also prepares them for what life is like in the military. It can be a serious grind, for lots of time. It can be very stressful and a lot of pressure. It is incredibly hard on a family and it takes a special kind of person to not only make a family work on the active duty person's side, but even more so on the spouse side (in my opinion). For those that have never been exposed to it, it is an incredible shock. But, the drive and determination, and the "sacrifices" you have mentioned are part of the job that you are aspiring to have.

They don't call it "service" for nothing! ;)
 
gniyji said:
Honestly I just showed that post to my son --- he felt vindicated. His turned down email suggested him taking calculus I,II, III in case to reapply -- obviously USNA never read his transcript -- he did Calculus BC as sophomore, Multivariable Calculus Differential Equations as junior, now as a senior he is taking Complex Analysis, Linear Algebra.
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At the CVW we went to, a midshipman said:"Academics will not beat leaderships".
 
Eagles1221 said:
@Old Navy BGO I took the ACT 5 different times (along with multiple prep courses including one that took up a significant portion of my summer), am cramming college-level stats and calc 1 into my senior year, and took honors science courses all through high school specifically to prep for service academies. I think I worded my above post poorly, I was trying to express that I put everything I had into trying to get into an academy, sometimes at the expense of more fun opportunities or free time to spend with friends.
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This all will bode well, no matter where you end up.

HS is also is almost over. Hopefully you have some down time on the horizon. Your educational choices will never be for naught.

Beat wishes to you, wherever you land.
 
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