West Point Graduation: Texting while Marching

scoutpilot said:
The fauxtrage in this post is amazing.
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Wait a minute...aren't you the guy who went on for a half a dozen posts excoriating and questioning the leadership qualities of a cadet for (maybe) allowing chewing gum in the ranks?

Pot meet kettle.
 
LineInTheSand said:
Bottle that rage up! That's the healthy choice.
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It's definitely a better choice as if I speak what's on my mind (regardless how rationally reasoned) I will be labeled sexist, racists, and bigot because they disagree with me. I will be more "raged" by responses I will get. How dare I think based on my personal/religious upbringing that I disagree with homosexuality, although I don't disagree with laws protecting their rights? How dare I think that the diversity is bad when in many military situations, how fast, strong, and intelligent you are more is important than being different. I tolerate folks I disagree. That doesn't mean I have to like it.

Do you think I will get "hate" responses based on this post?
 
Paraphrasing the The Public Affairs Officer: in formation, a Cadet may carry but not use a Mobile device. This type of infraction is usually an on the spot correction.
 
sean007 said:
Wait a minute...aren't you the guy who went on for a half a dozen posts excoriating and questioning the leadership qualities of a cadet for (maybe) allowing chewing gum in the ranks?

Pot meet kettle.
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Nah. I said it makes me wonder kind of basic leadership lessons have been learned if the answer to a question "I dunno but how bad could the punishment be?"

You'd better hope no one video tapes it. You'll be the poster child for the downfall of western values, just like this gal.
 
MemberLG said:
It's definitely a better choice as if I speak what's on my mind (regardless how rationally reasoned) I will be labeled sexist, racists, and bigot because they disagree with me. I will be more "raged" by responses I will get. How dare I think based on my personal/religious upbringing that I disagree with homosexuality, although I don't disagree with laws protecting their rights? How dare I think that the diversity is bad when in many military situations, how fast, strong, and intelligent you are more is important than being different. I tolerate folks I disagree. That doesn't mean I have to like it.

Do you think I will get "hate" responses based on this post?
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Some people think, based on religious upbringings, that soldiers die because God hates homosexuals. Just food for thought.
 
scoutpilot said:
Some people think, based on religious upbringings, that soldiers die because God hates homosexuals. Just food for thought.
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That is nothing - how about the Crusades?

You prove my point that I need to keep some of my thoughts myself as how dare I have my own opinion that disagree with someone else. Tolerance should go both ways.
 
How about the Crusades?
And how 'bout them Mets?

scoutpilot was probably referring to the late great Phred Phelps, founder of Westboro Baptist Church. I hope you didn't think he was talking about you.

Anyway, this talk of tolerance is making me feel like breaking out in song:

 
EDelahanty said:
How about the Crusades?
And how 'bout them Mets?

scoutpilot was probably referring to the late great Phred Phelps, founder of Westboro Baptist Church. I hope you didn't think he was talking about you.



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I knew what Scoutpilot is referring to. As much as I disagree with what Phred Phelps advocated, I serve to protect everyone's right not just the rights of people I agree with. What I don't like is how occasional some posters get "beat up" (in my opinion) for expressing their opinions.
 
MemberLG said:
That is nothing - how about the Crusades?

You prove my point that I need to keep some of my thoughts myself as how dare I have my own opinion that disagree with someone else. Tolerance should go both ways.
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I think you're confusing the right to express an opinion and be free from government retribution-which is what the First Amendment protects as regards individual speech-with a personal obligation to respect whatever opinion is offered by other people. You don't have to "tolerate" opinions you don't like. People can be a lot more keen to say "it's my opinion and you should respect that" these days in the world of social media. Well, no, I don't have to respect an opinion if I think it's dumb. I don't want the government to arrest you for saying it, but you don't get immunity from being challenged by other people. Nor, it should be added, are you prevented from vigorously defending your position and thinking that an opposing view is dumb.

If you feel that you're consistently "attacked" or "beat up" for your views, maybe it's because your position is weak and your rebuttals are unconvincing. You certainly have the right to have your views, but others have the right to tell you they suck.

.
 
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scoutpilot said:
Some people think, based on religious upbringings, that soldiers die because God hates homosexuals. Just food for thought.
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Or that the Earth is 6,000 years old and flat. Or that Halloween and birthday parties are exercises in "idol worship." Or that if you kill "infidels," you get 72 virgins when you die. Or that an ancient alien overlord flew DC-8 airplanes full of evil sprits into active volcanoes before killing them with a hydrogen bomb (and now the remnants of these guys cause all of our problems). Or that an illiterate con man in upstate New York translated magic tablets in the 19th Century.

Etcetera, etcetera, etcetera....
 
sprog said:
Or that the Earth is 6,000 years old and flat. Or that Halloween and birthday parties are exercises in "idol worship." Or that if you kill "infidels," you get 72 virgins when you die. Or that an ancient alien overlord flew DC-8 airplanes full of evil sprits into active volcanoes before killing them with a hydrogen bomb (and now the remnants of these guys cause all of our problems). Or that an illiterate con man in upstate New York translated magic tablets in the 19th Century.

Etcetera, etcetera, etcetera....
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Sometimes it's fun to look at a thread's title, West Point Graduation: Texting while Marching, then go to the last post to see how far afield the discussion has gone.
 
cb7893 said:
Sometimes it's fun to look at a thread's title, West Point Graduation: Texting while Marching, then go to the last post to see how far afield the discussion has gone.
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Keeps it interesting...
 
sprog said:
If you feel that you're consistently "attacked" or "beat up" for your views, maybe it's because your position is weak and your rebuttals are unconvincing. You certainly have the right to have your views, but others have the right to tell you they suck.
.
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Okay, based on my PERSONAL beliefs I think homosexuality is wrong. Notice I am not saying religion, scientific, or cultural beliefs. I am confining my belief to myself. The response should be I am wrong or I disagree with your personal beliefs. But likely replies are that I am a bigot. I don't problem with folks telling me my views suck, but I do have problem with getting labeled for my personal views/beliefs without any proof.

I think my forum postings should show I limit my postings to facts and my experience/knowledge (except this one :).
 
MemberLG said:
Okay, based on my PERSONAL beliefs I think homosexuality is wrong. Notice I am not saying religion, scientific, or cultural beliefs. I am confining my belief to myself. The response should be I am wrong or I disagree with your personal beliefs. But likely replies are that I am a bigot. I don't problem with folks telling me my views suck, but I do have problem with getting labeled for my personal views/beliefs without any proof.

I think my forum postings should show I limit my postings to facts and my experience/knowledge (except this one :).
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So if somebody said "My PERSONAL opinion is that black people belong as property because they're inferior to the white man" the response should just be that they're wrong or that we disagree. Not that they're a bigot. Because it's their opinion and we shouldn't label them without proof. Yes?

You cannot make a stand on the "wrongness" of homosexuality without reverting to some religious foundation. Nothing about free civil society's ethical principles makes it "wrong." So in calling it wrong you're invoking some moral basis that flows from a religious book that declared it wrong.
 
MemberLG said:
Okay, based on my PERSONAL beliefs I think homosexuality is wrong. Notice I am not saying religion, scientific, or cultural beliefs. I am confining my belief to myself. The response should be I am wrong or I disagree with your personal beliefs. But likely replies are that I am a bigot. I don't problem with folks telling me my views suck, but I do have problem with getting labeled for my personal views/beliefs without any proof.

I think my forum postings should show I limit my postings to facts and my experience/knowledge (except this one :).
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Webster's on "bigot":

a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance.


Again, you are free to be intolerant of whatever you like. Someone else might very well think that your declaration of the "wrongness" of homosexuality meets the definition listed above. Specifically, you have objectively declared that homosexuality is "wrong," and in an earlier post, attribute the basis of this belief as due to religious upbringing. As a religious faith expressed in such a way-without consideration of scientific or social arguments which express a lack of societal detriment associated with consenting adults engaging in homosexual activity-could certainly be seen as fitting into the definition of an "obstinate devotion" to one's "own opinions and prejudices," you're probably going to have to face being called a bigot at some point for expressing that viewpoint. Now, you can counter that you aren't one with your own arguments. You can say that you aren't "intolerant" to homosexuals and give us some reasoning as to why. You could tell us that you believe in some sociological foundation as to why homosexuals engage in a "wrong" type of behavior. It likely won't be convincing to a lot of folks (some will agree with you), but you can try.

If the majority of folks arguing with you are not convinced, then the merits of your arguments aren't so strong. But, you're certainly still free to believe what you want, including believing that you aren't a bigot and that others are hypocritical in their criticism. Just don't be surprised when people-rationally-don't agree with you. And, if I'm honest, if you believe in this so strongly, try not giving a **** about what people call you. If it really hits a nerve...maybe it's time for some introspection.
 
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