Principal Nomination

Butcher

Butcher

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Sep 12, 2019
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My DS has completed one interview and is preparing for the senatorial interviews. On his USMA portal, the nomination box has been check green. It also lists our state and the congressional district behind it. Does this mean he has a principal nomination from the first interview?
 
It means he has a nomination from that district, not necessarily a Principal Nomination. The state and district will be listed on all congressional MOC nominations. I'm not sure if the portal will indicate that a nomination is a Principal Nomination, but if so it would have something else in addition to the state and district number.

Most MOC's do not use the Principal Nomination method. Those that do usually inform the candidate that it is a Principal Nomination.
 
For what it’s worth, DS was congressional USMA principal nominee last year. His portal showed duplicate green checks with state and district. We assumed this was their way of indicating principal nomination.
 
Candidates may never know if they ate the principle nominee. Unless someone tells them, which doesn't seem to be standard operating procedure for most MOCs.

Example: MOC called DD to tell her she was a nominee. Said a lot of nice things along with congratulations. Full stop. Few weeks later, regional admissions officer mentioned, almost as an aside, that DD was that MOC's principle nominee. No pomp and circumstance whatsoever.
 
UFDMD said:
For what it’s worth, DS was congressional USMA principal nominee last year. His portal showed duplicate green checks with state and district. We assumed this was their way of indicating principal nomination.
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This means that the MOC had two openings in the year and was able to nominate 10 candidates for each opening. He could also nominate the same individual for both openings.
 
MidCakePa said:
Candidates may never know if they ate the principle nominee. Unless someone tells them, which doesn't seem to be standard operating procedure for most MOCs.

Example: MOC called DD to tell her she was a nominee. Said a lot of nice things along with congratulations. Full stop. Few weeks later, regional admissions officer mentioned, almost as an aside, that DD was that MOC's principle nominee. No pomp and circumstance whatsoever.
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EXACT same thing happened to DS. He was inquiring of admissions, asking who to thank for his nomination appointment (since he had all three MOC nominations). Admissions counselor told him that he was XXX’s principal nominee. Oddly, another classmate parent mentioned to me that their candidate received that same MOC’s principal nomination. So someone is wrong [emoji51]. Didn’t pursue bc didn’t want to be THAT mom, and it doesn’t matter. But a curiosity for sure.
 
The principle nominee of our state last year for USAFA, was not offered an appointment (was offered Prep). So although they are valuable, you still have to have a great whole package.
 
I find myself once again wishing the whole principal nominee thing would be done away with. Let the elected officials submit a slate, ranked or unranked, and give the SA the flexibility to rack and stack using their own insights and experience, and not be tied to having to make an offer to a designated principal if deemed fully qualified, even if they are ranked lower than other fully qualified candidates by the SA.

I think the SA nom panels do an excellent job overall, and I know many of our regular posters here sit on those panels. I am not quibbling with the principle of that part of the system.

The bigger issue of pros and cons of having a nom system at all has generated some interesting discussions here.
 
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justdoit19 said:
EXACT same thing happened to DS. He was inquiring of admissions, asking who to thank for his nomination appointment (since he had all three MOC nominations). Admissions counselor told him that he was XXX’s principal nominee. Oddly, another classmate parent mentioned to me that their candidate received that same MOC’s principal nomination. So someone is wrong [emoji51]. Didn’t pursue bc didn’t want to be THAT mom, and it doesn’t matter. But a curiosity for sure.
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No one is necessarily wrong. You were both likely correct that they each received a Principal NOM
My DS received a P NOM from our Congressman, and we later found out that another kid from a nearby school in our district also received a P NOM that same year/cycle. Our Congressman had 2 slates available that year, thus allowing for 2 Principal Nominations. I confirmed this with my representative.
Congratulations to your DS!
 
Capt MJ said:
I find myself once again wishing the whole principal nominee thing would be done away with. Let the elected officials submit a slate, ranked or unranked, and give the SA the flexibility to rack and stack using their own insights and experience, and not be tied to having to make an offer to a designated principal if deemed fully qualified, even if they are ranked lower than other fully qualified candidates by the SA.

I think the SA nom panels do an excellent job overall, and I know many of our regular posters here sit on those panels. I am not quibbling with the principle of that part of the system.

The bigger issue of pros and cons of having a nom system at all has generated some interesting discussions here.
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I can see both sides regarding the principal nomination option. I asked our new MOC if he was going to continue using the principal nomination process and he replied “absolutely!”. His nomination committee has outstanding principles in their process for selecting a principal nominee. I wholeheartedly support them and my MOC, and share the same principles.
 
dah19 said:
The principle nominee of our state last year for USAFA, was not offered an appointment (was offered Prep). So although they are valuable, you still have to have a great whole package.
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Agreed, the selected Principal Nominee must have a great whole package (meaning 3Q). Receiving a Principal NOM is the golden ticket to an appointment, but the caveat is the nominee must meet or exceed the minimum qualification standards set by the SA along with the P NOM to receive an offer of appointment. In the case you described, I would guess that nominee did not meet minimum standards and was offered prep, which is also a golden ticket, just on a longer route to an appointment.
USNA has been the only SA that has had a couple of fully qualified Principal Nominees not receiving an offer of appointment being reported here. According to Federal law, the language regarding a P NOM and USNA does not require an appointment whereas the other SA’s do require by law an appointment to every 3Q Principal Nominee. Someone else can chime in with a direct reference to the language if they wish.
 
It's kind of funny...all these posts about "how to get an LOA", and not a lot about the golden ticket of a Principal Nom.
 
shock-n-awe said:
I can see both sides regarding the principal nomination option. I asked our new MOC if he was going to continue using the principal nomination process and he replied “absolutely!”. His nomination committee has outstanding principles in their process for selecting a principal nominee. I wholeheartedly support them and my MOC, and share the same principles.
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I see what you did there.

Stealth_81
 
Capt MJ said:
..... having to make an offer to a designated principal if deemed fully qualified, even if they are ranked lower than other fully qualified candidates by the SA.
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Exactly ! Appointing a lesser qualified candidate seems to run counter to the ethos of a Service Academy.
 
Objective said:
Exactly ! Appointing a lesser qualified candidate seems to run counter to the ethos of a Service Academy.
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That is correct and increasingly the norm in society. Only the 150 Qualified Alternates are required to be based on merit.

Fortunately most MOC's delegate submit an unranked slate and those are decided on merit - highest WCS score wins the slate.
 
I know it's legal, and I trust that most, if not all of the MOCs use panels which keeps it somewhat unbiased. Obviously political favoritism, racism, sexism, etc were all issues years ago. I would hope that this is not an issue these days. But the one thing that always sticks in my mind with principal nominations is, I feel that the MOCs are saying to the SA admissions panels, "We know better than you."
 
So the MOC has an interview committee made up of a mixed bag of experienced reputable people. Often including SA grads, officers. SA parents, and FFR/ALO people to name a few. They get to see the candidates, their qualifications, and interview them. If the MOC chooses to use the Principal Nomination method, why is that a negative? Sure it takes away “flexibility “ from the SA on where to “charge “ a Nomination, but it guarantees that the MOC’s designated candidate gets an appointment as long as they are deemed 3Q. It would be a stretch imo that a committee would nominate a lesser qualified candidate over another more qualified candidate on the same slate. To be clear a Principal Nominee May on occasion (only speculating that it has happened) have a lower WCS than someone else on the same slate, but is deemed to be a better suited candidate and more likely to succeed at the SA by the interview committee, therefore receiving the P NOM.
It is also well known that not all districts have the same caliber of candidates. So a Nominee from a less competitive district will become an appointee over many greater qualified candidates from other districts. That’s just the process. Then there’s the National pool etc...
Nothing is perfect or always “fair”, but I do like the Nomination process and how SA’s get “fair” representation from the entire country and districts within each state not just hyper districts being represented. Kind of like the electoral college.....

So my opinion supporting the Principal Nomination method doesn’t come without some bias, and having had conversation with my MOC, they have no intentions of changing, and it will remain the method used in our district.
 
shock-n-awe said:
It would be a stretch imo that a committee would nominate a lesser qualified candidate over another more qualified candidate on the same slate. To be clear a Principal Nominee May on occasion (only speculating that it has happened) have a lower WCS than someone else on the same slate, but is deemed to be a better suited candidate and more likely to succeed at the SA by the interview committee, therefore receiving the P NOM.
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Sit in front of an MOC committee in NY and get back to me.
 
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