4 year participation in ROTC and starting college with 25 credits- what path do you take?

Herman_Snerd

Herman_Snerd

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Depending on the latest AP exam results, my DS will start college with, well, more than 25 credits (AP/ dual credit/ pilot licenses).

His 4 yr. ROTC scholarship states they will not pay for courses toward a minor. so then, what do young adults in this position do? You want to the 4 years of training and summer program experiences. Will ask if he can take a second major? Is it possible to take 2 years of military prep courses concurrently (is that possible) and finish college in 3 years? Is this rule of not paying for minors university specific?

I think he needs the 4 years both to serve as a CFI to bank hours toward his R-ATP, and to get the full training to be an officer. Important stuff when he'll be leading people potentially - want him to be prepared.

He will call his university cadre and discuss but first we wanted to see if anyone is or was in this position, and what do you did about it (intel gathering) before making that call. If you or your DD, DS, DW, or whatever was in this position, please let us know how you approached it.

Thanks as always.

Very respectfully,
Hermie
 
I think your are overthinking this. As long as your child will graduate on time, in 4 years, then they won't much care what courses he or she takes providing they are completing the required courses. The trick for your child is to make sure they don't complete their major and all required courses so they are forced to graduate early. In fact, sometimes this can't be helped due to the unavailability of some courses certain semesters or course prereqs that need to be completed. Proper planning can ensure a minor is squeezed in along with that major, or at least interesting electives.
 
I am in ROTC right now and there are people in my unit who have and will be graduating in 3 and a half years. It is possible but that does mean the rotc classes that are required for commissioning must be squeezed into that final semester. If DS wants to, he can but what he could do is lighten his load for later semesters as his courses become harder and for when he acquires billets in his battalion. Per the ROD, an ROTC student must take at least 15 credits every semester, but coming in with credits allows him to not have to pile up and take 18+ credits with all his ROTC classes because it can get stressful. Either option is perfectly okay and it is great he has these options in front of him.
 
I have 34 transfer credits from dual enrollment, summer school, and AP. I've still had to take 18 credit semesters, and will graduate with 164 credits for one degree.

It differs for every degree, but if your DS takes engineering just expect the 25 credits to be buffer room for him to breathe and not drown in academics.

If he only needs like 120 credits to graduate, add on 14 credits of AFROTC classes, and subtract 25. Then divide that by 8 semesters, and that gives you around 13.5 credits a semester. That's just like any civilian college student getting a degree. Add on 1-3 hours of PT a week, and 2 hours of millab, that is a pretty full schedule. This is not including everything else he'll do in college.

And that whole "need to be at 15 credit hours" is not strict. It is just to make sure a student isn't taking like 2 classes a semester. We had a senior MIDN in our unit that was taking only 9 credit hours, and he commissioned yesterday.

I thought the 15 credit hour thing was strict too, but spoke with my NROTC adviser and said what I just said above.

I'll be taking like 13 credits each semester my senior year (God Bless).
 
I think the rule on number of credit hours is that the midshipman takes enough credit hours to be matriculated. This is normally at least 12 credit hours but may vary by college. I'm sure if only a smaller number of credit hours are required to complete one's degree, then that would be fine as well (as in the example Kuz relates above).
 
When you say "His 4 yr. ROTC scholarship states they will not pay for courses toward a minor," where is this listed? I know for ROTC students, or any college student in America in general, it's relatively easy to graduate with a minor. Some colleges offer minors in Military Studies/ some variation of that because you're taking so many military related classes. As a MIDN, I'll be graduating with a double minor in addition to my major. This is just because during my time in school I am able to take classes that just regularly fit into my schedule; no summer classes or piling on more than a normal ROTC student takes. The Navy is paying for them because they're just apart of the regular 10 classes I take each academic year. Not sure if this is the same for your case, just want to clarify what you're speaking specifically about.
 
FastFood44 said:
When you say "His 4 yr. ROTC scholarship states they will not pay for courses toward a minor," where is this listed? I know for ROTC students, or any college student in America in general, it's relatively easy to graduate with a minor. Some colleges offer minors in Military Studies/ some variation of that because you're taking so many military related classes. As a MIDN, I'll be graduating with a double minor in addition to my major. This is just because during my time in school I am able to take classes that just regularly fit into my schedule; no summer classes or piling on more than a normal ROTC student takes. The Navy is paying for them because they're just apart of the regular 10 classes I take each academic year. Not sure if this is the same for your case, just want to clarify what you're speaking specifically about.
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The OP may he saying that the scholarship won't allow his DS to take "more" classes for a minor that is outside the credit limit for a degree/degrees. I will be graduating with three minors, but only because I am able to use my electives that are part of my major and concentrate them into minors. I will not be taking any more credits that are outside my degree requirements.
 
I have no idea, but it seems to me one can always ask anything. Whether they would say yes is another issue. Personally I wouldn't take that course but use those credit hours to lighten my load and take other interesting courses while making sure I don't graduate early by completing the major requirements.

BTW, unless the two schools are in-state and already have some pre-arrangement made, it's not certain that all the credits would transfer to the new school anyway. It would vary by school and on each side.
 
If i am not mistaken, my son graduated with minor in Military Science as he went through Air Force Rotc. However, he could minored in another major as there was enough required electives to have gotten enough credits to received another minor
 
My son is graduating with 60+ dual credit hours and planning on AROTC with 4 year scholarship. I think he is transferring everything but planning on retaking Calculus courses so he has a review for upper level Calculus. Mastering a foreign language or 2 is another way to put the extra hours to use.
 
FastFood44 said:
When you say "His 4 yr. ROTC scholarship states they will not pay for courses toward a minor," where is this listed? //
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Thanks for the guidance you and others shared- this is great. Just to answer your question...

In the FAQ section on DS' university ROTC website it states "What will my scholarship cover?
It will fund tuition (except flight fees), a book stipend each semester, and a monthly stipend. Again, a scholarship will NOT cover any flight costs associated with any major or minor.

Your scholarship will not pay for: minors (including flight minors), summer tuition, room and board, parking, or flight costs. If you do not complete or you retake a course while at the university, the NROTC scholarship will only cover the cost of your first attempt."

Again to share, DS will receive a minor in Military Science, and a degree in his major. they do not want to fund courses toward another minor or 2nd major per his discussion with the battalion earlier this week.
 
Pickering2019 said:
Can you ask not to transfer dual enrollment credits. I have a 3.1 GPA and 37 hours in dual enrollment. I would rather just have a fresh start.
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Thanks for sharing this perspective - I assume the 3.1 you reference was earned at college, and that the other courses just transfer in without grades. Otherwise he'd be starting with a very high GPA but I don't think that's how it works.

It's a solid point that this puts more pressure on one to perform in the 1st year at school. In his case we discussed and he'll take the credits and risk and we hope his academic performance will continue at college. Bright young man but then college is FULL of distractions - great distractions - I went to school before electricity or the automobile were invented but it was still fun as I recall ...

Thanks for sharing:)
 
kinnem said:
//

BTW, unless the two schools are in-state and already have some pre-arrangement made, it's not certain that all the credits would transfer to the new school anyway. It would vary by school and on each side.
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Thanks @kinnem. That's a good point. Agree. In his case we sent official transcripts directly from the AP folks and Rochester Institute of Technology (where he took dual enrollment courses) to the college he's going to next year. We also sent course catalog links/ descriptions of each course per the college's request.. In July when the next AP scores come out we'll have those again sent directly from AP to the school.

On the college website they list partners and courses they will accept, and what type of credit they will give both for college credit transfers and AP credits. He'll get a mix of general education credits and some credits for specific courses like Physics, Spanish, Social Sciences.

Lastly, he also received 7 credits for his FAA PPL and remote pilot licenses. In these cases I'll share here in case it helps others that we scanned his licenses, sent them to the school- they will process and give him 7 credits. Hey the remote pilot license only gets 1 credit of those but as I shared with our DS - every step on the journey counts.

Thanks again.
 
How did it end up working out?

I'm going in with 120 dual enrollment credit hours and my degree is basically half done, do I still go to college for four years under the scholarship? Think I could go for two years and still agree to the four year sign?
 
smallstroom said:
How did it end up working out?

I'm going in with 120 dual enrollment credit hours and my degree is basically half done, do I still go to college for four years under the scholarship? Think I could go for two years and still agree to the four year sign?
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If you're asking me as the OP, it all worked out well (If not just skip this reply) DS started college with I think 37 credits but by choice will take the full 4 years at school because simply he is having way too much fun, and this allows all 8 separate semesters for NROTC participation including time in various leadership ranks in his training. Even this semester his socially distanced life is till outstanding- lots of outdoor picnics, BBQing, days at the beach, parks, etc. This schedule also allows for summer cruise participation should those happen (Pandemic)

The main advantages for him were:
1 that he tackled some free electives, some degree requirements, and his flight training for PPL before arriving at college which yields a pretty significant cost savings and jump started his progress.
2 that he was technically a sophomore when he started college, so when they drew the lottery pics for on-campus apartments for his sophomore year he and his roommates got a great pick since he was grouped in with the year ahead.

You should work with each college you are interested in to confirm how many of your credits will be accepted at that school, and whether these will count toward your major or electives. Your 120 dual credits is the highest I've seen - congrats, so now the key is understanding which count and how at each college. Some colleges like RPI in NY only take APs where you scored a 5. Some colleges are selective on which they will take. Some give credit for Dual-credit courses some only for specific dual credit courses. Other colleges seem to take nearly all APs where you got at -least a 3 on the exam, Lastly some colleges offer MULTIPLE credit for AP high scores - like giving you 12 credits for Spanish AP, or 2 courses of credits for Chem. Some colleges require a specific amount of coursework there to get their degree. You can't take 116 credits at a community college, transfer and take 1 course at Harvard, and get a Harvard degree. Look into your options and if you're willing please share with the board what you find.

IF you want to finish early you likely can by doubling up on ROTC courses in specific semesters but that does provide you less time to prepare to be an officer. Good luck to you.
 
Herman_Snerd said:
If you're asking me as the OP, it all worked out well (If not just skip this reply) DS started college with I think 37 credits but by choice will take the full 4 years at school because simply he is having way too much fun, and this allows all 8 separate semesters for NROTC participation including time in various leadership ranks in his training. Even this semester his socially distanced life is till outstanding- lots of outdoor picnics, BBQing, days at the beach, parks, etc. This schedule also allows for summer cruise participation should those happen (Pandemic)

The main advantages for him were:
1 that he tackled some free electives, some degree requirements, and his flight training for PPL before arriving at college which yields a pretty significant cost savings and jump started his progress.
2 that he was technically a sophomore when he started college, so when they drew the lottery pics for on-campus apartments for his sophomore year he and his roommates got a great pick since he was grouped in with the year ahead.

You should work with each college you are interested in to confirm how many of your credits will be accepted at that school, and whether these will count toward your major or electives. Your 120 dual credits is the highest I've seen - congrats, so now the key is understanding which count and how at each college. Some colleges like RPI in NY only take APs where you scored a 5. Some colleges are selective on which they will take. Some give credit for Dual-credit courses some only for specific dual credit courses. Other colleges seem to take nearly all APs where you got at -least a 3 on the exam, Lastly some colleges offer MULTIPLE credit for AP high scores - like giving you 12 credits for Spanish AP, or 2 courses of credits for Chem. Some colleges require a specific amount of coursework there to get their degree. You can't take 116 credits at a community college, transfer and take 1 course at Harvard, and get a Harvard degree. Look into your options and if you're willing please share with the board what you find.

IF you want to finish early you likely can by doubling up on ROTC courses in specific semesters but that does provide you less time to prepare to be an officer. Good luck to you.
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Thank you very much, I truly appreciate this response. I will do as you suggested and converse with the colleges I plan on choosing between. Your thread has really helped me out.
 
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