Discretionary Nom Chances

S

SAProspect

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Is there anyway to increase the chances of landing a discretionary nom? My MOC’s Academy staffer (my district got a new MOC and was left one vacancy by their predecessor) either didn’t know what they were doing or was intentionally stalling more or less screwing me over in the process (I only got excuses as to why they could not open that vacancy up). I was first told by him that the 118th Congress had not authorized the nomination process and then it was that that office did not have a vacancy (I confirmed with the Academy and the Rep's predecessor who left him that vacancy that they did indeed have a vacancy but they refused to talk to either). At this point, a discretionary nomination is my only hope at an appointment to the Naval Academy, is there anything that I can do to fight the good fight and push for a discretionary nom.
 
The outgoing MOC was responsible for filling that vacancy, not the incoming MOC. That is why the process happens before their seat is turned over and the new member is in office. I don’t know what happened in your MOC’s case, but it was not your incoming MOC’s job to fill a vacancy.

Stealth_81
 
I was told that my outgoing MOC left one vacancy for my incoming MOC which enabled him to nominate to fill the vacancy
 
USNAProspect said:
I was told that my outgoing MOC left one vacancy for my incoming MOC which enabled him to nominate to fill the vacancy
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Maybe what they were saying was that one vacancy from a previous year came up, and they didnt want to double up twice to avoid a year without any.

As an example:
x for 24
xx for 25
x for 26
x (x) for 27
() for 28
Say the 24 separated this year prior to 2 for 7. If they offered a 2nd slot to 27, when 28 comes there wouldn't be any slot at all.
 
Wouldn’t they not be able to give it to a ‘27 given that ‘27 would already have vacancies established at the start of this year and prior to the separation of the ‘24?
 
USNAProspect said:
I was told that my outgoing MOC left one vacancy for my incoming MOC which enabled him to nominate to fill the vacancy
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when you say vacancy, do you mean that they submitted a slate but only submitted 9 names? or they left an entire slate unsubmitted? There are many MOCs that don't submit an entire slate of 10 names. I have no inside knowledge of how the slates work but I would think it would be pretty irregular for an incoming MOC to "add to" an already submitted slate. Is there a reason you weren't considered or awarded a nomination from the out-going MOC?

In any case, I would imagine that you are or have been considered for a SA controlled nomination given that you've made it this far without receiving a TWE and don't have a nomination. But I don't think there is anything you could (or should) do to increase your chances. Unless perhaps you are a D1 level athlete, then you should definitely reach out to the coach if you haven't already. Good luck!
 
@USNAProspect

Let’s look ahead and not back, take stock and think critically. I don’t think there is anything more to be gotten from the MOC. I assume you applied to both Senators, but had no luck. I assume you applied for the VP nom, so there is a chance there, as USNA manages those.

Every year, there are competitive candidates without noms. There are even candidates with LOAs, and no noms. There are those who live in states where the Senators and Representatives collaborate to not duplicate names across slates, even if the candidate applied to multiple SAs. Every year, USNA Admissions carefully evaluates the applicant pool and determines where to use noms it has control over. If you put in the best-quality application you could, that is your chance at one of those noms.

If your main goal is to become a Navy or Marine officer, then let’s hope you have applied to schools where there is a NROTC program. You can be on scholarship or be a college programmer. If you are not successful this cycle for a USNA appointment, then you smoothly pivot to your alternate plan and not lose a step toward commissioning. You bust your butt to be a top-performing midshipman and student, taking a USNA plebe-like schedule. You re-assess, determine you want to re-apply and go after it again. Your DoDMERB is good for 2 years; you just have to update with any changes. You can apply for a NROTC nom, as well as again for VP, Senators, Representative. Your new essays reflect maturity, new lessons learned, new insights from overcoming a disappointment. Or, you find you love your NROTC unit and school and stay happily in place.

Junior officers should be adaptive, resilient, determined, resourceful and forward-looking. Be that.
 
USNAProspect said:
Wouldn’t they not be able to give it to a ‘27 given that ‘27 would already have vacancies established at the start of this year and prior to the separation of the ‘24?
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In my example above, there would likely be one filled for 27, but the 2nd one would likely go unfilled even though it was technically eligible. If they gave that 2nd one to a 27, then there would not be one available for 28, since there would be 5 slots already used.
 
What is a "discretionary nomination?" I'm not clear on what the factual background is here. It sounds like the outgoing MOC put in a slate of nominations and you were not on it? Is that correct? If that's correct, perhaps that's your biggest problem.

Further, it sounds like you have determined that your MOC district has an open vacancy that could be filled with two appointments/charges for '27. Is that correct? If that's correct, it sounds like what you posit is that your name be submitted specially -- as a slate of one -- to fill that appointment. Essentially an uncontested, unadvertised principal nomination? If that's what your are suggesting, how would that be remotely fair to anybody else in your district?

Finally, if there is indeed an extra vacancy chargeable to your district for '27, what precludes the USNA from filling it with a second nominee from the slate that the outgoing MOC submitted? How do you know they aren't contemplating doing exactly that?
 
franknd said:
What is a "discretionary nomination?" I'm not clear on what the factual background is here. It sounds like the outgoing MOC put in a slate of nominations and you were not on it? Is that correct? If that's correct, perhaps that's your biggest problem.

Further, it sounds like you have determined that your MOC district has an open vacancy that could be filled with two appointments/charges for '27. Is that correct? If that's correct, it sounds like what you posit is that your name be submitted specially -- as a slate of one -- to fill that appointment. Essentially an uncontested, unadvertised principal nomination? If that's what your are suggesting, how would that be remotely fair to anybody else in your district?

Finally, if there is indeed an extra vacancy chargeable to your district for '27, what precludes the USNA from filling it with a second nominee from the slate that the outgoing MOC submitted? How do you know they aren't contemplating doing exactly that?
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“Discretionary noms” are the nom authorities the SAs control. See link.


I was equally 🤔 by what was being asked and deemed that water under the bridge and well on the way to the ocean, and focused on next steps.
 
franknd said:
Further, it sounds like you have determined that your MOC district has an open vacancy that could be filled with two appointments/charges for '27. Is that correct? If that's correct, it sounds like what you posit is that your name be submitted specially -- as a slate of one -- to fill that appointment. Essentially an uncontested, unadvertised principal nomination? If that's what your are suggesting, how would that be remotely fair to anybody else in your district?
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They would have multiple options for what they could possibly do with two vacancies; I am not suggesting an uncontested principal nomination or anything like that; they could have split slates, etc. Even so, it's one thing to be told told a "we can't do this because this isn't fair to everyone else" as you suggest but I was instead told "the 118th Congress has not authorized the nomination process" and "we don't have any slots" both of which I later found to be untrue.
 
USNAProspect said:
They would have multiple options for what they could possibly do with two vacancies; I am not suggesting an uncontested principal nomination or anything like that; they could have split slates, etc. Even so, it's one thing to be told told a "we can't do this because this isn't fair to everyone else" as you suggest but I was instead told "the 118th Congress has not authorized the nomination process" and "we don't have any slots" both of which I later found to be untrue.
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I suggest you let go of this line of thinking. It is not something in your control. Your new MOC took office on Jan 3rd, correct? Slates are due on Jan 31st. That is not a lot of time to organize a slate especially considering all of the other things a new MOCs staff needs to set up post-election. However, it doesn't matter what happened and why, it is over.

Honestly, I'm surprised that an Academy rep would tell a candidate any of this information.
 
USNAProspect said:
They would have multiple options for what they could possibly do with two vacancies; I am not suggesting an uncontested principal nomination or anything like that; they could have split slates, etc. Even so, it's one thing to be told told a "we can't do this because this isn't fair to everyone else" as you suggest but I was instead told "the 118th Congress has not authorized the nomination process" and "we don't have any slots" both of which I later found to be untrue.
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I'm going to sound a bit harsh here but that's my way as an ALO: I answer questions, and the candidate needs to be ready to hear the answer.

You received the answer from your MOC's office.

That's it. It's done.

A MOC has no requirement to fill ANY of their slots. No legal requirement at all. There have been MOC's in a HUGE Western state that, objecting to the military for whatever reason, chose not to nominate ANY students to ANY SA. And this was not that long ago. I remember I, and a WHOLE lot of ALOs and B&GOs, and FFRs were LIVID! However, that is the purveyance of the MOC.

As to what you were told by your MOC's office; CaptMJ and Stealth_81 gave you good and on-point answers. Whether or not Congress has to "authorize" anything, I don't know. I searched 10 U.S. Code §XXXX (meaning a LOT of sections) as well as 32CFRXXXX and found no definitive requirement for a "declaration by the Congress" that nominations are now "authorized." Per those sections, once a member is sworn in, they have the full authority to make nominations.

And I confirmed that there is NO legal/statutory requirement for a MOC (House or Senate) to make nominations. It's their choice. I imagine this is one of the reasons every MOC I've worked with has always left one open slot each year, to ensure they had the ability to nominate students each year.

You have your answer. It's done. It's not what you wanted to hear, I get that. I've been on the "other side" of the discussion...only mine was a thin envelope with a letter telling, in essence: NO.

This is a bump in the road.

Time to step back, reassess, and attack your follow-up plan!

Steve
USAFA ALO
USAFA '83
 
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