Requesting Presidential Nomination Early a Mistake?

Discussion in 'Nominations' started by Dadx4, Dec 22, 2017.

  1. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    When DS submitted his packages to service academies this summer, he sent his request for Presidential Nomination early. This eliminated his chance of receiving an LOA. It seems as though alot of LOAs were given out this year. The reason for him sending in the Presidential early was to be considered for early appointments. Did we make a huge mistake? Have most of the Presidential Appointments been given out already?
     
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  2. Capt MJ

    Capt MJ 10-Year Member

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    LOAs are a flexible tool used by SAs in many ways, with no way of knowing how many are given out in any one year. They are the exception, not the norm. LOAs usually have language that essentially says an appointment will be offered if various conditions are met - could be a nom, could be something else.

    I assume your DS applied for all noms he could - VP, Senators, MOC. That is all still churning.

    I don’t think any harm was done by submitting early in the cycle. Only 100 appointments out of all eligible for the Presidential (for USNA, realize I don’t know for others) will eventually be charged to the Presidential. The Academies will rack and stack candidates against their competition as they build out the class. “Eventually” is the key word.

    I would bet there are a couple hundred in the same boat as your DS WRT Presidential.

    That’s why so many Waiting threads pop up every year.
     
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  3. Stealth_81

    Stealth_81 Super Moderator 10-Year Member Founding Member

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    A presidential nomination does not eliminate the chance for an LOA. I don’t know where you heard that. Presidential appointments will be given throughout the process and will not be finalized until the final class roster is finalized. Sometimes an appointed candidate will be slotted to a presidential nomination and also be eligible for an MOC nom. The board may or may not move them from the presidential slot to the MOC slot as they decide what other candidates they want. It’s like a big jigsaw puzzle that they put together and change around to get the picture that they want.

    Stealth_81
     
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  4. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    Thanks Capt and Stealth. It's true that a Presidential Nomination, in and of itself, does not eliminate the chance of an LOA. But when combined with a completed package, which candidates are encouraged to submit as early as possible, it does eliminate the chance of an LOA. With a complete application + nomination, only an appointment can be offered because there are no remaining conditions to be met. For those candidates who submit everything but their nomination, it provides a potential driving force to issue an LOA (with a condition of nomination) if an academy truly wants a particular individual. Then once the Presidential Nomination is submitted later, it locks the LOA holder into at least a Presidential slot, maybe not in the end if they get slotted to a MOC nomination, but it still locks them for an appointment. It seems that there is less driving force to offer full appointments to those with completed packages + Presidential Nominations early in the process, probably because of the racking/stacking and waiting on MOC slates. My DS knows that he will have to wait several months for a decision, but perhaps waiting to send in the request for Presidential Nomination would have resulted in an earlier opportunity. Perhaps not. Only admissions knows. This issue is probably more relevant for candidates from competitive districts, where they may have to rely more heavily on their Presidential.
     
  5. THParent

    THParent Member

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    I understand your logic there, and it makes perfect sense.
    If your DS's application was strong enough to generate a LOA, then (it would follow) being 3Q'd with a nomination would typically just result in an offer of appointment (because at that point, there is no reason for the LOA).
    Regardless, what Stealth_81 is saying is that it STILL doesn't eliminate the chance of the LOA. The SA can do whatever they want in that regard, even if it doesn't seem to make sense.

    It's only 2 days before Christmas, however. The cutoff for applications is still more than a month away.
    There is plenty of time to receive that offer - so all your DS and you can do at this point - is wait with a couple of thousand others.
     
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  6. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    "It's only 2 days before Christmas, however."

    True. I'm still "waiting" on Amazon packages to arrive at my house so I can finish wrapping! :)

    Thanks for your insight THParent, and Merry Christmas! Hopefully, he'll get some good news sometime next year. Still, if I could go back in time, I would recommend to him to send in the Presidential request later. No hard facts to support this, just a vague impression from seeing the generous number of LOAs that have been given so far. It seems as though academies are well into the appointment process, and LOA holders with Presidential Noms are sitting good, regardless of whether their MOC slate has been submitted.
     
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  7. NavyHoops

    NavyHoops Super Moderator 5-Year Member

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    And I wouldn’t say generous in LOAs either. Admissions doesn’t give this number out, but I wouldn’t call 100-200 (pure speculation) generous. They are even less common than a few years ago. I think sometimes on this forum the LOA number can feel skewed.
     
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  8. THParent

    THParent Member

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    I too, feel like it's around 10% LOAs (say 120 to 155 - at least for USNA) , but I have no real data to support it.
    They are few and far between, that I would bet on.
     
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  9. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    THParent, you are prior service, correct? Congratulations to your son on his appointment that I read in a previous post of yours! Did your son receive an LOA?
     
  10. milvetmom

    milvetmom New Member

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    I don't think your DS made a 'mistake' in securing a Pres nom early in the cycle. My DS secured Pres noms mid-July and finished his packages by early Oct. LOA from USNA in November. In looking at last year's appointment threads, it looks like more Pres noms come through later in the cycle. This makes some sense because if they rack and stack to pick top candidates to slate against Pres nom, they would have to wait for the deadline so they could rack and stack all the packages. Isn't the deadline for USNA end of January? And of course there are those who get appointments early but my guess is that the bulk of presidentials is yet to come.
     
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  11. DrMom

    DrMom 5-Year Member

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    Agree with all above. Both of my cadets had Presidential nominations submitted in August of the year in which each applied. Captain America received an LOA within two weeks of completing his packet, the Baby did not. Capt Am was an exceptionally qualified candidate, the Baby unceremoniously received the BFE by surprise in late April. He also did not receive an LOA to the other SA to which he was accepted.
    It just depends but clearly the Presidential nom is not the deciding factor but rather the strength of the candidate and the needs of the academy.
     
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  12. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    Thanks milvetmom, and thank you for your family's service (and to all who serve). In fact, today, my kids and I are making care packages to send to the troops.

    What did your son's LOA from USNA say? If there were no outstanding conditions, was it conditional upon?
     
  13. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    DrMom, same question. What did LOA say if no conditions remained and application and nomination were complete?
     
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  14. DrMom

    DrMom 5-Year Member

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    I don’t remember. It was in 2011. You could be right. Maybe he was waiting for his physical to clear? We struggled to find a provider who could do the eye exam in the little glamour spot of a far away place in which we lived. But it all happened really fast. I didn’t know what ‘3Q w/ a nom’ even meant in those days.
     
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  15. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    Thanks for your family's service!
     
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  16. DrMom

    DrMom 5-Year Member

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    @Dadx4 thank you for yours and Also thanks to raising a budding warrior who wants to keep America strong.
     
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  17. USMAROTCFamily

    USMAROTCFamily 5-Year Member

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    When my DS applied, he had also submitted his presidential nomination early in the process. He ended up receiving the USNA LOA that was conditional on DODMERB. The interesting thing was that he received his appointment notification before the LOA had arrived in the mail, so he found out about the LOA after he got the call from our Congressman's office. His remedial information must have arrived just after the issued the LOA. Through the process, he had gotten a nomination from a Senator and the House Representative, as well.
     
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  18. Dadx4

    Dadx4 Member

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    Interesting....sounds like most if not all LOAs are conditional.
     
  19. NavyHoops

    NavyHoops Super Moderator 5-Year Member

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    All LOAs are conditional. The reason they issue them is because there is a piece of being 3Q with a Nom missing. It is usually either DoDMERB, CFA or Nom. If a candidate is 3Q and has a Nom, there is no need to issue an LOA, it would mean an appointment would be issued. Sometimes a candidate might have completed these items and the system is still catching up and therefore LOAs and appointments can be very close to each other.
     
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  20. milvetmom

    milvetmom New Member

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    That's wonderful! Yes-the LOA is conditional (DODMERB) and so we wait...