Under Waiver Review

Capt MJ said:
An LOA can be given at any time, for any reason, with or without conditions - but it’s not something to look for. Most cadets and midshipmen never received them.

Yes, you wait. USNA has a cap on numbers of color blind waivers it will grant each year (a handful, usually in the teens), and they probably wait for all applications to come in, then assess the color blind DQ group as a parallel competitive group to whatever competition they are facing in their nom group.

If your son does not already know this, those who go into USNA with a color blindness waiver will be informed that certain communities in the Unrestricted Line family of offficer warfare specialties will be permanently closed to them, such as aviation, submarines, surface warfare. That group is provided opportunities in Restricted Line (intel, cyber, oceanography, etc.) or Staff Corps (Civil Engineering, Supply, etc.). They can also go Marine ground (not aviation). The needs of the Navy will dictate what is available. If he wants a full clarification on this, he should call USNA Admissions and have a candid discussion. These appointees go into USNA knowing their options are limited, but go they do.

He should also have additional alternate plans. NROTC uses the same DoD military medical accession standard, and color blindness would also be a DQ. It is my impression NROTC gives few to no color blindness waivers; career opportunities would be similarly limited. Marine option, ground, would not be a problem.

it is my impression USNA, USCGA, USMMA are the most stringent on color blindness and no or few waivers. USMA and USAFA seem to be more flexible. It’s not a frivolous difference. Waiver policies differ because operating environments, missions, gear and equipment differ across the Services.
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Yep! Thanks! Got it all. I have two other DS who went through the academy with color deficient friends. The friends/mids got "caught" at the Academy. One on I-Day and one at his commissioning physical. My candidate DS is fully aware of his options. His dad was a grad too so if he gets an appointment he will be the first of our legacy NOT to be a pilot. He is quite ok with it. Thanks again for responding.
 
SweetCaroline said:
Yep! Thanks! Got it all. I have two other DS who went through the academy with color deficient friends. The friends/mids got "caught" at the Academy. One on I-Day and one at his commissioning physical. My candidate DS is fully aware of his options. His dad was a grad too so if he gets an appointment he will be the first of our legacy NOT to be a pilot. He is quite ok with it. Thanks again for responding.
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He is well-prepared then to make his decisions accordingly. Some are not aware at all or don’t absorb it well about the limitation in warfare specialties. Plenty of great options, but some of the biggies aren’t available.
 
Capt MJ said:
He is well-prepared then to make his decisions accordingly. Some are not aware at all or don’t absorb it well about the limitation in warfare specialties. Plenty of great options, but some of the biggies aren’t available.
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Know what's crazy....some wish they had a restricted line status when they are Mids so they could be up for some of those niche spots.
 
SweetCaroline said:
Also, could an LOA be given before a waiver is approved?
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An LOA is essentially a conditional offer, but the condition usually includes being fully qualified, including medical...which DS is not. There are many threads on SAF about the color deficiency, and the bottom line that I tell my candidates is that it makes an already competitive process even more competitive. Bottom line, DS will likely be waiting until Admissions see's the pool of color deficient candidates, and will make the choice then. Be prepared to wait....and wait...and if the answer comes student, consider yourself lucky !
 
SweetCaroline said:
Know what's crazy....some wish they had a restricted line status when they are Mids so they could be up for some of those niche spots.
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As you and they know, USNA and NROTC primary mission is to turn out well-prepared ensigns for the URL communities. There is opportunity later on after getting their warfare qual to compete for a spot in the smaller RL and Staff Corps communities.
 
SweetCaroline said:
My understanding is my DS does not request a waiver for color deficiency. The waiver process starts all by itself and we just wait to hear from the SA. The eye doctor told us that along with other sources. Can anybody else confirm we just sit and wait at this point.

Also, could an LOA be given before a waiver is approved? I am thinking yes that is a possibility but I also know that does not mean an Appointment is up next. I am just wondering if they would bother with an LOA if everything is submitted and the only thing they need is the waiver approved. Speaking of the waiver...who determines if a waiver is given? I have heard it is the Supe, I have heard it is the Admissions Boards, I have heard it is another waiver board. Anybody know who actually approves a waiver? Not that it matters, I am just curious.

I do know we could be waiting waiting many months for a decision. We have a Plan B with a submitted NROTC to a few awesome programs.
Thanks all!! Beat Army!
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My son was DQ'ed and the waiver process just started for USMA. Yesterday, he received an LOA from USMA. Of course, he will need to be granted the waiver before the LOA would mean anything.
 
SweetCaroline said:
My understanding is my DS does not request a waiver for color deficiency. The waiver process starts all by itself and we just wait to hear from the SA. The eye doctor told us that along with other sources. Can anybody else confirm we just sit and wait at this point.

Also, could an LOA be given before a waiver is approved? I am thinking yes that is a possibility but I also know that does not mean an Appointment is up next. I am just wondering if they would bother with an LOA if everything is submitted and the only thing they need is the waiver approved. Speaking of the waiver...who determines if a waiver is given? I have heard it is the Supe, I have heard it is the Admissions Boards, I have heard it is another waiver board. Anybody know who actually approves a waiver? Not that it matters, I am just curious.

I do know we could be waiting waiting many months for a decision. We have a Plan B with a submitted NROTC to a few awesome programs.
Thanks all!! Beat Army!
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Just to let you know, his chances for a NROTC waiver for color vision deficiency is lower than that for USNA. If he's a NROTC-MO, then a waiver could be considered I suppose.

He's better off looking at the USAF or USA commissioning sources.

Have you seen his optometry exam results? There should be a check box that says if he can distinguish vivid red/vivid green. If he can distinguish vivid red/vivid green, then he'll probably get a waiver from AROTC and USMA.

The USAF does not have color vision standards.
 
SweetCaroline said:
Yep! Thanks! Got it all. I have two other DS who went through the academy with color deficient friends. The friends/mids got "caught" at the Academy. One on I-Day and one at his commissioning physical. My candidate DS is fully aware of his options. His dad was a grad too so if he gets an appointment he will be the first of our legacy NOT to be a pilot. He is quite ok with it. Thanks again for responding.
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They got "caught"? What happened to them?
 
bethf said:
They got "caught"? What happened to them?
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Oh I just meant .... they eventually couldn't pass the color deficiency test (lot of guessing and squinting can help you pass initially) so they had to go restricted line. Nothing bad on them...they just got through some intially screening and then "get caught". Again, nothing bad on them.
 
SweetCaroline said:
Oh I just meant .... they eventually couldn't pass the color deficiency test (lot of guessing and squinting can help you pass initially) so they had to go restricted line. Nothing bad on them...they just got through some intially screening and then "get caught". Again, nothing bad on them.
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Oh, ok. My heart was going to break for 2 cadets I don't even know!!
 
Capt MJ said:
An LOA can be given at any time, for any reason, with or without conditions - but it’s not something to look for. Most cadets and midshipmen never received them.

Yes, you wait. USNA has a cap on numbers of color blind waivers it will grant each year (a handful, usually in the teens), and they probably wait for all applications to come in, then assess the color blind DQ group as a parallel competitive group to whatever competition they are facing in their nom group.

If your son does not already know this, those who go into USNA with a color blindness waiver will be informed that certain communities in the Unrestricted Line family of offficer warfare specialties will be permanently closed to them, such as aviation, submarines, surface warfare. That group is provided opportunities in Restricted Line (intel, cyber, oceanography, etc.) or Staff Corps (Civil Engineering, Supply, etc.). They can also go Marine ground (not aviation). The needs of the Navy will dictate what is available. If he wants a full clarification on this, he should call USNA Admissions and have a candid discussion. These appointees go into USNA knowing their options are limited, but go they do.

He should also have additional alternate plans. NROTC uses the same DoD military medical accession standard, and color blindness would also be a DQ. It is my impression NROTC gives few to no color blindness waivers; career opportunities would be similarly limited. Marine option, ground, would not be a problem.

it is my impression USNA, USCGA, USMMA are the most stringent on color blindness and no or few waivers. USMA and USAFA seem to be more flexible. It’s not a frivolous difference. Waiver policies differ because operating environments, missions, gear and equipment differ across the Services.
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Capt MJ....an LOA posted today in my DS portal. WOW! So, he is color deficient and the Academy most likely hasn't seen it yet. He has two noms and all his other medical is good to go. What are your thoughts on his chance for the waiver after receiving the LOA today and how long do you think it would take for the waiver? Do you think they would sit on his LOA for months and months at this point in the process? This LOA is the exact reason we encouraged our DS to get everything submitted by Labor Day and secure his noms ASAP.
 
SweetCaroline said:
Capt MJ....an LOA posted today in my DS portal. WOW! So, he is color deficient and the Academy most likely hasn't seen it yet. He has two noms and all his other medical is good to go. What are your thoughts on his chance for the waiver after receiving the LOA today and how long do you think it would take for the waiver? Do you think they would sit on his LOA for months and months at this point in the process? This LOA is the exact reason we encouraged our DS to get everything submitted by Labor Day and secure his noms ASAP.
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He is in as good a shape as he can be given he will probably be given a DQ for the color vision deficiency by DoDMERB.

If you have been scouring the forums for color blindness posts, you will have learned USNA only grants a handful of waivers to those candidates, and their career options are limited for offficer specialty communities available to them. They essentially compete in their own little group for the appointments available to those with waivers. Since all applications are not yet in, ditto DoDMERB medical reviews, a waiver, if granted, will likely not be seen until sometime after all applications are in. If the waiver is granted, and all other conditions are met, the LOA bumps the chances for an offer of appointment. Now, USNA could do a waiver and an appointment at any time, if the candidate is otherwise qualified with a nom. But - if I were in their shoes, and I only had X-to-the-tiny appointments available for the color blind group, I’d wait to see all the cards dealt.

Continue to tend alternate plans and remain hopeful.
 
SweetCaroline said:
Capt MJ....an LOA posted today in my DS portal. WOW! So, he is color deficient and the Academy most likely hasn't seen it yet. He has two noms and all his other medical is good to go. What are your thoughts on his chance for the waiver after receiving the LOA today and how long do you think it would take for the waiver? Do you think they would sit on his LOA for months and months at this point in the process? This LOA is the exact reason we encouraged our DS to get everything submitted by Labor Day and secure his noms ASAP.
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Congratulations and the best wishes.
 
Capt MJ said:
He is in as good a shape as he can be given he will probably be given a DQ for the color vision deficiency by DoDMERB.

If you have been scouring the forums for color blindness posts, you will have learned USNA only grants a handful of waivers to those candidates, and their career options are limited for offficer specialty communities available to them. They essentially compete in their own little group for the appointments available to those with waivers. Since all applications are not yet in, ditto DoDMERB medical reviews, a waiver, if granted, will likely not be seen until sometime after all applications are in. If the waiver is granted, and all other conditions are met, the LOA bumps the chances for an offer of appointment. Now, USNA could do a waiver and an appointment at any time, if the candidate is otherwise qualified with a nom. But - if I were in their shoes, and I only had X-to-the-tiny appointments available for the color blind group, I’d wait to see all the cards dealt.

Continue to tend alternate plans and remain hopeful.
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Yep...he was DQ'd last week.
 
Capt MJ said:
He is in as good a shape as he can be given he will probably be given a DQ for the color vision deficiency by DoDMERB.

If you have been scouring the forums for color blindness posts, you will have learned USNA only grants a handful of waivers to those candidates, and their career options are limited for offficer specialty communities available to them. They essentially compete in their own little group for the appointments available to those with waivers. Since all applications are not yet in, ditto DoDMERB medical reviews, a waiver, if granted, will likely not be seen until sometime after all applications are in. If the waiver is granted, and all other conditions are met, the LOA bumps the chances for an offer of appointment. Now, USNA could do a waiver and an appointment at any time, if the candidate is otherwise qualified with a nom. But - if I were in their shoes, and I only had X-to-the-tiny appointments available for the color blind group, I’d wait to see all the cards dealt.

Continue to tend alternate plans and remain hopeful.
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Oh and he has two nominations already.
 
SweetCaroline said:
Oh and he has two nominations already.
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He is in the best possible position for someone who needs a color vision waiver. He should be prudent, though, and prepare for the possibility he might not get one of the waivers. No waiver, no appointment. The LOA tells us he is a desirable candidate, so be hopeful.
 
Just a real reminder that even if you get in with no medical issue, hiccups can arise at every juncture. I just saw a parent post about their ensign who just got a medical DQ in year 2 of fight school.

DS did medical fight physical today. Has one issue requiring waiver and doc says it shouldn’t be an issue. However. I counseled him that it may always be a risk and anything not known now could derail carefully laid plans later.

At any point in their service life happens. And they may have to adjust their sails, deal with disappointment, and adjust course.

As mom, I remind him of this, worry on my own, and counsel where I can. And remind him that life often throws curve balls. Adjust your swing. And stance in the box.
 
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