Unranked Alternate

BSCAR

Member
Joined
May 17, 2015
Messages
219
How common is it for someone given an unranked or unranked alternate nomination to be eventually admitted to USMA?
 

ca2midwestmom

5-Year Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2013
Messages
1,343
My DS received a competitive alternate nomination and is now a Cow at WP. Granted, a principal nom is almost a guarantee, but you only need one nomination if WP really wants you. Good luck!
 

time2

10-Year Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2007
Messages
1,802
Terminology isn't always used the same way which tends to create confusion. If you mean he has 1 of the 10 NOM's being issued (regardless of what it is called), then if he is also 3Q would put him in the running for an appointment. Some MOC chose to rank their NOM's while others do not. Having a NOM is what really matters. You can read older posts that goes into more detail on that.
 

BSCAR

Member
Joined
May 17, 2015
Messages
219
Terminology isn't always used the same way which tends to create confusion. If you mean he has 1 of the 10 NOM's being issued (regardless of what it is called), then if he is also 3Q would put him in the running for an appointment. Some MOC chose to rank their NOM's while others do not. Having a NOM is what really matters. You can read older posts that goes into more detail on that.
I was given 1 of 10 noms from my Senator and an unranked competing alternate nomination by my congressman.
 

LongRange99

Member
Joined
Dec 5, 2016
Messages
39
I was given 1 of 10 noms from my Senator and an unranked competing alternate nomination by my congressman.
By no means an expert but sounds like you are unranked in both Congressional and Senate noms. But the bottom line is you got 2 which is fantastic...
 

BSCAR

Member
Joined
May 17, 2015
Messages
219
By no means an expert but sounds like you are unranked in both Congressional and Senate noms. But the bottom line is you got 2 which is fantastic...
Yeah I suppose that's the bright side. It just eats at me that only roughly 25% of those who get a nom get admitted. Especially when I felt that I had the primary nom in the bag.
 

BSCAR

Member
Joined
May 17, 2015
Messages
219
That's the kind of confidence that our service academies are looking for! Being humble is way down the list.
Haha. That "confidence" I have is usually perceived as arrogance by my peers, though it isn't unearned. Hey if they like it hopefully some of it bled through into my application and will help me get an appointment.
 
Last edited:

Stealth_81

Super Moderator
15-Year Member
Founding Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2006
Messages
3,664
I'm pretty sure Maplerock was using sarcasm. Your so-called "confidence" is indeed arrogance. You have absolutely no way of knowing the stats and evaluations the other people on your congressman's slate. So, to say that you would have had the primary nom wrapped up if it existed is just ridiculous.

The 25% of people who get appointments are the ones who win the competition. They are the winners of the contest. Why would it "eat at you" that there are winners and losers in a competition?

Stealth_81
 

BSCAR

Member
Joined
May 17, 2015
Messages
219
I'm pretty sure Maplerock was using sarcasm. Your so-called "confidence" is indeed arrogance. You have absolutely no way of knowing the stats and evaluations the other people on your congressman's slate. So, to say that you would have had the primary nom wrapped up if it existed is just ridiculous.

The 25% of people who get appointments are the ones who win the competition. They are the winners of the contest. Why would it "eat at you" that there are winners and losers in a competition?

Stealth_81
Sir,

With respect to your superior level of experience, I am keenly aware that there are winners and losers--such is the nature of life. I am keenly aware that I lost; hence it "eating at me". I abhor losing and I don't ever plan to become too well acquainted with defeat--particularly if I do end up serving in the armed forces. Perhaps you and I are different, but defeat leaves a horrid, putrid, and vile taste in my mouth. In the face of failure, (of which, I've experienced my fair share), I redouble my efforts so as to avoid defeat. Thus far, I have been successful, but with my inability to secure a primary nom my chances of defeat have skyrocketed. Again, this is where I become unsettled as my inadequacies have been highlighted and it is now too late to do anything about it--too late to turn my weaknesses into my strengths. The very fact that I created a thread asking about the commonality of those of us who were not able to completely succeed actually being admitted would serve as evidence that I am not as much of an arrogant, insufferable bastard as you seem to suppose.

I figured I had that nomination locked up mostly because I was one of the few candidates not escorted by their parents to their interview; that's indicative of a lack of independence and a lack intrinsic motivation to succeed. That, and I like to stay optimistic rather than die the same death twice or create a self fulfilling prophecy of defeat. Confidence is key in leadership and people can sense it. Say what you want about my immodest nature, but self confidence has almost completely evaporated with respect to my generation--a rather disconcerting trend. Particularly when the only person who will ever serve as your advocate is you.

'Whether you think you can, or you think you can't—you're right.' --Henry Ford
 

Maplerock

Proud to be an American
5-Year Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2013
Messages
1,019
BSCAR, everything about plebe year is designed to break you down, to show you that you are a part of something bigger. A very small part.

Just wondering how you think you'll fare when orders and critiques are being barked at you by people that are obviously less smart and motivated than yourself?
 

BSCAR

Member
Joined
May 17, 2015
Messages
219
BSCAR, everything about plebe year is designed to break you down, to show you that you are a part of something bigger. A very small part.

Just wondering how you think you'll fare when orders and critiques are being barked at you by people that are obviously less smart and motivated than yourself?
If I truly felt superior and that I had nothing to learn why would I bother applying? I aspire to be more than I am and the very fact that the cadets and staff at WP eclipse me in experience, aptitude, knowledge, et cetera is precisely what makes WP so appealing to me. That's why I am motivated and have dedicated a lot of time to my application at the expense of a social life.

It may not be anything close to plebe year, but I have been screamed at incessantly and criticized at every turn, particularly during my tenure as a wrestler. I welcome criticism, I feel it's an essential part of human development and progress.

If I am in a situation, such as this, where there is social equity I will also mete out criticism in response to criticism. If I am in a formal situation where there are those clearly appointed over me I eat the criticism and try my best to improve and rectify my mistakes.

I am aware that I exist in a state of imperfection, as does all of humanity; I wish to be refined and tempered into a tool that may be of some use to the nation that has treated me so well. I suppose, in a nutshell, that's my motivation for wanting to attend.

My goal in responding is to clarify my earlier remarks as I very clearly stuck my electronic foot in my mouth--I'm aware that I'm not the best around by a long shot, but that doesn't mean I'll participate in self deprecation or act timid and unconfident.

I'm not very good at perceiving sarcasm in real life let alone over the Internet.
 

DROGE456

Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2016
Messages
65
I think you still have a good chance even if you're not the primary nom if you a competitive candidate. Isn't there something about the national pool that you would get into?
 

April75

Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2016
Messages
62
BSCAR, don't look at it as being a loser. My DD attended the NASS and opened the USNA portal in early June. She completed every item by mid July. Back up for a few years... She wanted to serve as a U.S. Marine since she was 8 years old. Until today, it has always been about serving in the Marine Corps. She said to me USNA or not, I am going to be a Marine. Are you a loser if you don't get an appointment? Not in my mind and not in hers. Her back up plan is NROTC and on Dec 24, her portal indicated that she received a 4-year NROTC scholarship. Appointment or not, she found another path to her dream. Regarding the USNA, she received her LOA back in August and received a congressional nomination on Dec 21. Is it a sure thing? No. She hasn't received an appointment yet. Life goes on.

Keep at it, be humble, and remember one thing... Don't let your "confidence" crosses into the A-H line. It's all about teamwork. My 2 cents as a dad.
 

BSCAR

Member
Joined
May 17, 2015
Messages
219
I think you still have a good chance even if you're not the primary nom if you a competitive candidate. Isn't there something about the national pool that you would get into?
I just worry that the slots will be taken up by prior service, combat vets, sports stars, females, ethnic minorities, etc and the remaining will be highly competitive between the rest of us white guys as there are so many of us who apply every year. But I guess I'm unfamiliar with exactly how the nomination pool works.
 

BSCAR

Member
Joined
May 17, 2015
Messages
219
BSCAR, don't look at it as being a loser. My DD attended the NASS and opened the USNA portal in early June. She completed every item by mid July. Back up for a few years... She wanted to serve as a U.S. Marine since she was 8 years old. Until today, it has always been about serving in the Marine Corps. She said to me USNA or not, I am going to be a Marine. Are you a loser if you don't get an appointment? Not in my mind and not in hers. Her back up plan is NROTC and on Dec 24, her portal indicated that she received a 4-year NROTC scholarship. Appointment or not, she found another path to her dream. Regarding the USNA, she received her LOA back in August and received a congressional nomination on Dec 21. Is it a sure thing? No. She hasn't received an appointment yet. Life goes on.

Keep at it, be humble, and remember one thing... Don't let your "confidence" crosses into the A-H line. It's all about teamwork. My 2 cents as a dad.
I appreciate the advice. I have other alternatives mapped out (VMI for one), but an opportunity such as a SA is simply second to none. Congrats to your daughter.
 

Stealth_81

Super Moderator
15-Year Member
Founding Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2006
Messages
3,664
I figured I had that nomination locked up mostly because I was one of the few candidates not escorted by their parents to their interview; that's indicative of a lack of independence and a lack intrinsic motivation to succeed. That, and I like to stay optimistic rather than die the same death twice or create a self fulfilling prophecy of defeat. Confidence is key in leadership and people can sense it. Say what you want about my immodest nature, but self confidence has almost completely evaporated with respect to my generation--a rather disconcerting trend. Particularly when the only person who will ever serve as your advocate is you.

OK. So you think you're superior to others on the slate because they had their parents along when they came to interview? Where do you get these ideas? How can you judge another person's "intrinsic motivation to succeed" based on whether their parent drove with them to an interview? You have much to learn.

I just worry that the slots will be taken up by prior service, combat vets, sports stars, females, ethnic minorities, etc and the remaining will be highly competitive between the rest of us white guys as there are so many of us who apply every year.

I hope that many of the slots are taken up by just those candidates. Being surrounded by others who are different than yourself and being able to work together is what you will learn wherever you get to go to school.

But I guess I'm unfamiliar with exactly how the nomination pool works.

The one statement of yours that I can agree is accurate.

I am not going to continue to pound on you. I think you have potential which is why I am taking the time to reply again. Your original question is about getting a nomination from an unranked slate. My son was on three unranked slates and got nominations from all 3. (I drove with him to all of the interviews, too!). There are more congressmen who submit unranked slates that any of the other methods. Somebody wins those. It is the person who most impresses the selection committee through their resume and their interview.

Take a step back and look at the opportunities that you still have for an appointment before you get all dramatic with your posts and please stop with the chest-thumping. You said that confidence is key in leadership and people can sense it. That is very true, but people can also sense arrogance, and that is not the same as self-confidence.

Stealth_81
 
Top