2014 profile

[Mongo]

Think again.
When Roughead speaks of making "diversity" the #1 priority of the US Navy (the #1 priority, above all else - {btw, you can read the mission of the US Navy on their own website HERE} - winning wars, deterring aggression and maintaining freedom of the seas all become secondary, because logically, nothing can be above #1) - he is not speaking about diversity in education, backgound, political thought, height, or anyting else BUT racial diversity.

Please note Admiral Roughead's comment in the context of his entire message. He mentioned things that were going well such as modernizing our fleet, quality of life, etc, and then listed diversity as something that needed to be addressed, something he saw as a problem, something he saw as our #1 problem. No mention of it's attention being in lieu of the things that were being done correctly. It was the media and anonymous blogs that managed to blow it totally out of context.

 

[Mongo]

I have done a little research. During Vietnam Edison High School in Phila had the most KIA read on:

The school with the most names on the Wall: Thomas Edison High School in Philadelphia, PA: 54 students perished.

That’s right, 54 young men between the ages of 18-24 fought in the Vietnam War between the years 1965-1974. No other school experienced so much pain and sorrow. Of those killed from Thomas Edison High School at the age of 16: five. Twelve more of those young men died at the age of 17.

You would be hard pressed to find a white face roaming the Halls of Edison High School. By contrast, I could not even find the figures for Radnor High School in an affluent suburb of Phila. But, they do have a page that honors their alumni that served our country, 22 Radnor Alums have served our country. There maybe more and there probably is, but those are the alum they identify. I attended an private upper class HS in suburban Phila. during the 70's, I can't remember anyone going to Vietnam. I am sure there was someone that went to Vietnam but, not 54 KIA.

So I guess it is alright for our minority kids to go to war and get killed, but they can't lead because the SAT and the ACT says so. I feel that is complete BS and it is a way for the old boys network to remain in place.

So true.

At the beginning of the war, AA casulties were disproportionally high to both the population at large and to those serving in the military. The Johnson administration recognized this and curtailed front line duty for AAs drastically. In the later years of the war, AA casulties were more in line with the population at large. But not so soon as not to make this one of the primary rallying cries of the racial unrest of the '70s.

USNA Minority Admissions will tell you today that this continues to be one of the primary roadblocks in minority recruiting. Very few families still do not have an influential member, usually a grandmother, who remembers Viet Nam and the 70s and refuses to endorse anyone in her family becoming a member of the officer military corps. Officers were seen as part of the establishment and part of the problem. Of course, Admirals Mullen and Roughead see these minority officers assisting in the effort for career minority enlisted. Things have to start somewhere. It is not a 300 year old problem but one that continues to this generation.

 

[MakeItHappen]

I have done a little research. During Vietnam Edison High School in Phila had the most KIA read on:

The school with the most names on the Wall: Thomas Edison High School in Philadelphia, PA: 54 students perished.

That’s right, 54 young men between the ages of 18-24 fought in the Vietnam War between the years 1965-1974. No other school experienced so much pain and sorrow. Of those killed from Thomas Edison High School at the age of 16: five. Twelve more of those young men died at the age of 17.

You would be hard pressed to find a white face roaming the Halls of Edison High School. By contrast, I could not even find the figures for Radnor High School in an affluent suburb of Phila. But, they do have a page that honors their alumni that served our country, 22 Radnor Alums have served our country. There maybe more and there probably is, but those are the alum they identify. I attended an private upper class HS in suburban Phila. during the 70's, I can't remember anyone going to Vietnam. I am sure there was someone that went to Vietnam but, not 54 KIA.

So I guess it is alright for our minority kids to go to war and get killed, but they can't lead because the SAT and the ACT says so. I feel that is complete BS and it is a way for the old boys network to remain in place.

FYI-Not a lot of deferments in this group:

"By the time the organizing committee had finished trying to locate former classmates, it had counted 10 graduates from Edgewood’s Class of 1967 who had been killed in the Vietnam War."

"Edgewood High School, which closed in 1996, lost 35 ex-students in the war. The other 19 listed on the memorial graduated from or attended the district’s two other high schools, Kennedy or Memorial, or lived in the district when they went into the service."

"The memorial honors 54 men who were killed or listed as missing in action, and graduated or attended one of three high schools in the Edgewood Independent School District."

And this:

"Fifty-one of the district’s 54 casualties were Hispanic, no surprise considering Edgewood’s demographics and the ethnic group’s proud tradition of military service."

“We honor the sacrifices of all 54, of course, but Hispanics always have been proud to serve their country in the military,” said Diaz, 63. “It’s part of our heritage.”

http://www.kens5.com/community/blog...etnam-War-dead-a-poignant-sight-95229709.html

 

[DevilDog]

FYI-Not a lot of deferments in this group:

"By the time the organizing committee had finished trying to locate former classmates, it had counted 10 graduates from Edgewood’s Class of 1967 who had been killed in the Vietnam War."

"Edgewood High School, which closed in 1996, lost 35 ex-students in the war. The other 19 listed on the memorial graduated from or attended the district’s two other high schools, Kennedy or Memorial, or lived in the district when they went into the service."

"The memorial honors 54 men who were killed or listed as missing in action, and graduated or attended one of three high schools in the Edgewood Independent School District."

And this:

"Fifty-one of the district’s 54 casualties were Hispanic, no surprise considering Edgewood’s demographics and the ethnic group’s proud tradition of military service."

“We honor the sacrifices of all 54, of course, but Hispanics always have been proud to serve their country in the military,” said Diaz, 63. “It’s part of our heritage.”

http://www.kens5.com/community/blog...etnam-War-dead-a-poignant-sight-95229709.html

Edison High School is AA and Puerto Rican. I am sure many of the 54 were Hispanic.

Aglages, no one is asking for reparations. Just level the playing field and let those that were excluded be included.

 

[ScottW]

Is there a way to find out how many people are at the academy from each state?

 

[nfugleberg]

Still new to this but felt compelled to say: AMERICANS - I believe that should say it all about who we are.

 

[ScottW]

America is a country bro. Anyway I was just wondering about the states thing. No need to be a smart@$$

 

[falconchic88]

Scott, I don' think that comment was to you, I think he was referring to the last umpteen pages devoted to dividing everyone up by their nationality, when in the end, we are all Americans.

 

[Memphis9489]

Scott, I don' think that comment was to you, I think he was referring to the last umpteen pages devoted to dividing everyone up by their nationality, when in the end, we are all Americans.

From the book Animal Farm ...

"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others."

 

[ScottW]

My apologies nfugleberg

 

[MomoftheMagik]

Geez, let's not scare away the newbies! Of course, just reading this thread is enough to do that. nfugleberg...welcome to the forum! Congrats on your Plebe!

 

[cycle1994]

From the book Animal Farm ...

"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others."

From reading a couple of these threads you really should change your quote to

"All parents are equal, but some parents are more equal then others."

 

[Mongo]

From reading a couple of these threads you really should change your quote to

"All parents are equal, but some parents are more equal then others."

No, I think what he meant to imply is:

“All midshipmen are equal, but some midshipmen are more equal then others."

If this weren’t so sad, it would be quite humorous. Two privileged midshipmen, with advantages unavailable to the vast majority of the high school students in America declare their classmates ‘unworthy’. From their resume’ which their dad so proudly posted, it is obvious they have had an education that will make any college less of an effort. I am very familiar with over 30 mostly rural local high schools which feed two congressional districts. None come close to offering the advantages of Memphis’ sons. AP English, History, and Biology are likely offered at most. Probably a third offer AP Chemistry and even less offer AP Calculus. I know two highly qualified candidates last year whose schools didn’t even offer Calculus in any form. There is a plebe at the Academy right now from one of these schools where Physics was not offered at any level. Combine this with a state that is below the national average in SATs and where all these schools except one is below the state average. Why? Colleges in the state rely more on the teachers evaluations than they do SATs. An ‘A’ in Mr Jones pre-calc class means a lot more than a 650 on the Math SAT as does an ‘A’ in Miss Smith’s English class for the Verbal SAT. Therefore, schools do not emphasize SAT scores. Most often there are three or four candidates in each of these districts who 3Q, some years the CGO has to get ‘creative’ to qualify a single candidate, and they do, and occasionally no one qualifies. And those who make it, graduate. One or two, non-athletes by the way, are or were on the 4 ½ year plan, but again, they do make it. Even a few Cat I majors. And honorably serve their country. And serve it well. But those who make it are lucky. Due to their skin color, their classmates and classmates dads do not brand them ‘unworthy’. I ask again but no one seems to be able to answer. Why are these candidates ‘worthy’ and those with exactly the same qualifications from a predominately black inner city neighborhood, ‘unworthy’?

 

[DevilDog]

No, I think what he meant to imply is:

“All midshipmen are equal, but some midshipmen are more equal then others."

If this weren’t so sad, it would be quite humorous. Two privileged midshipmen, with advantages unavailable to the vast majority of the high school students in America declare their classmates ‘unworthy’. From their resume’ which their dad so proudly posted, it is obvious they have had an education that will make any college less of an effort. I am very familiar with over 30 mostly rural local high schools which feed two congressional districts. None come close to offering the advantages of Memphis’ sons. AP English, History, and Biology are likely offered at most. Probably a third offer AP Chemistry and even less offer AP Calculus. I know two highly qualified candidates last year whose schools didn’t even offer Calculus in any form. There is a plebe at the Academy right now from one of these schools where Physics was not offered at any level. Combine this with a state that is below the national average in SATs and where all these schools except one is below the state average. Why? Colleges in the state rely more on the teachers evaluations than they do SATs. An ‘A’ in Mr Jones pre-calc class means a lot more than a 650 on the Math SAT as does an ‘A’ in Miss Smith’s English class for the Verbal SAT. Therefore, schools do not emphasize SAT scores. Most often there are three or four candidates in each of these districts who 3Q, some years the CGO has to get ‘creative’ to qualify a single candidate, and they do, and occasionally no one qualifies. And those who make it, graduate. One or two, non-athletes by the way, are or were on the 4 ½ year plan, but again, they do make it. Even a few Cat I majors. And honorably serve their country. And serve it well. But those who make it are lucky. Due to their skin color, their classmates and classmates dads do not brand them ‘unworthy’. I ask again but no one seems to be able to answer. Why are these candidates ‘worthy’ and those with exactly the same qualifications from a predominately black inner city neighborhood, ‘unworthy’?

The answer lies in the quote from Animal Farm. “All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal then others." It comes down to feeling superior to others. They feel it is their divine destiny. I call it racism.

 

[USMMA2014mom]

Here is a link from the Marine Corps Times regarding USNA's class of 2014

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/2010/07/navy_naval_academy_070310w/

 

[MIDNDAD]

Mongo and DevilDog congratulations on running out of constructive dialog and throwing down the race card. As a white male, I guess I should be cowering under the threat of being labeled a racist for believing in high standards for everyone seeking admittance to The Academy, and not understanding the" victomology" that pervades so many parts of our society.


Unfortunately for you and your ilk, times are a changing. I have broad shoulders and can tolerate labels. I am very unapologetic for being blessed with a highly intelligent and driven child that had an easy time getting into the Academy, has had a successfull 3 years at the Academy and is a lock to get her service selection as a Marine later this year. Why I even expect her to make a damn fine Marine Officer because of the high standards and drive she has exhibited ever since she was 2 years old.

 

[MomoftheMagik]

The answer lies in the quote from Animal Farm. “All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal then others."

All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal, then other animals get mad at the animals that say they are more equal...

Just kidding, sorry, I couldn't stand it another minute. What you mean to quote is "...some animals are more equal THAN others."

 

[falconchic88]

LOL, thanks for lightening up the mood Momo!

 

[Mongo]

Mongo and DevilDog congratulations on running out of constructive dialog and throwing down the race card. As a white male, I guess I should be cowering under the threat of being labeled a racist for believing in high standards for everyone seeking admittance to The Academy.

Sorry, you are going to have to point out to me where I threw down the race card.

As far as running out of constructive dialog, maybe you can answer this question the third time that I ask it. Why is a system of selecting midshipmen which has been in place nearly 150 years suddenly a problem?

DAD, the Academy has never been about selecting the best of the best. It is about selecting the best in each and every congressional district in the United States. Do you honestly think that the 1500 offers annually go to the 1500 best qualified? If so, would it not be best to stop the 3Qs at 1500 so that NAPS could be offered to 1501. This doesn’t happen because they need to qualify in excess of 2000 to capture the lesser qualified of the primary candidates from some districts. This is the way it has been ever since the end of the Civil War. Why is it that when USNA makes a conscious effort to include candidates from ALL districts that suddenly it is a problem?

The issue is not with the Navy, USNA, Admiral Fowler, and the Admissions Department. The issue is with the federal law.

DAD, why is everyone suddenly having a problem with USNA complying with federal law?

 

[DevilDog]

Mongo and DevilDog congratulations on running out of constructive dialog and throwing down the race card. As a white male, I guess I should be cowering under the threat of being labeled a racist for believing in high standards for everyone seeking admittance to The Academy, and not understanding the" victomology" that pervades so many parts of our society.


Unfortunately for you and your ilk, times are a changing. I have broad shoulders and can tolerate labels. I am very unapologetic for being blessed with a highly intelligent and driven child that had an easy time getting into the Academy, has had a successfull 3 years at the Academy and is a lock to get her service selection as a Marine later this year. Why I even expect her to make a damn fine Marine Officer because of the high standards and drive she has exhibited ever since she was 2 years old.

I have never thrown out the race card and quite frankly my ancestors came from Europe which by default makes me a white male. I just feel that kids of color should be given a chance.

Good luck to your daughter, I am sure she will make a fine Marine officer.