Army Job Prospects

Discussion in 'Publicly and Privately Funded Military Colleges' started by tibreaker, Jan 5, 2016.

  1. tibreaker

    tibreaker Member

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    Does going to a senior military college like Virginia Tech give you a better chance at getting your number one choice pick for jobs in the army when it comes time to commission?
     
  2. AROTC-dad

    AROTC-dad Just a dad

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  3. tibreaker

    tibreaker Member

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    Awesome thanks.

    Also am I mistaking in believe that I am guaranteed an active duty commission if I go to a SMC?
     
  4. AROTC-dad

    AROTC-dad Just a dad

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    Federal law assures you of Active duty so long as the PMS approves:

    Here is the law: (only applies to Army ROTC at a SMC)
    (e)Assignment to Active Duty.—
    (1)
    The Secretary of the Army shall ensure that a graduate of a senior military college who desires to serve as a commissioned officer on active duty upon graduation from the college, who is medically and physically qualified for active duty, and who is recommended for such duty by theprofessor of military science at the college, shall beassigned to active duty.
    (2)
    Nothing in this section shall be construed to prohibit the Secretary of the Army from requiring a member of the program who graduates from a senior military college to serve on active duty.

    Source:
    https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/2111a
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2016
  5. sheriff3

    sheriff3 Member

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    Unfortunately even those below the AD oml cutoff will be able to go AD because of this nonsense!
     
  6. AROTC-dad

    AROTC-dad Just a dad

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    It is up to the PMS to toe the line.

    Sheriff...everyone has been waiting for your rant on the other thread!
     
  7. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    We live in a imperfect world. For SA grads, they only have to graduate to go active duty.
     
  8. Jcc123

    Jcc123 Member

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    That is not strictly true. There are graduates who do not receive the PMS's recommendation and do not get active duty.
     
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  9. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    SA - Service Academy, not ROTC
     
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  10. Jcc123

    Jcc123 Member

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    My bad - thanks for the correction. My reading comprehension is suspect in the morning!
     
  11. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    Just to emphasize an earlier comment, the 'guaranteed' AD only applies to Army and NOT to the other services.
     
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  12. sheriff3

    sheriff3 Member

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    I didn't realize so many were waiting for my rant on this subject. Well here goes. First off please let me say I have nothing against the SMCs'. I'm certain they , like all commissioning sources turn out excellent, good and bad officers. That being said.....

    Here is the law: (only applies to Army ROTC at a SMC)
    (e)Assignment to Active Duty.—
    (1)
    The Secretary of the Army shall ensure that a graduate of a senior military college who desires to serve as a commissioned officer on active duty upon graduation from the college, who is medically and physically qualified for active duty, and who is recommended for such duty by the professor of military science at the college, shall be assigned to active duty.
    (2)
    Nothing in this section shall be construed to prohibit the Secretary of the Army from requiring a member of the program who graduates from a senior military college to serve on active duty.

    The above is an "out", an "exception to the rule" afforded to an SMC graduate that is not afforded to other non SMC Army ROTC cadets. Because of this provision 86 " below the line" ( substandard) SMC cadets will go AD thus displacing 86 non SMC cadets who wanted to go AD and likely had higher OML scores. ALL ROTC cadets have 4 years to prove themselves worthy of AD ( if that's the path they choose). In the end if your OML is not high enough you should be placed in the non AD group like all others . As I and many other have said in the past, "The standard is the standard, no exceptions"! There are several "non-negotiable" circumstances that happen in the military everyday Don't have a high enough SAT/ACT.... no admission into AROTC , GPA goes below a certain level for a certain period of time... disenrollment, fail APFT ....no contract, cannot maintain passing AFPT score while contracted..... disenrollment. To the best of my knowledge in none of these instances can the PMS override the standard and allow the cadet to move on, yet if one goes to an SMC the standard ( OML) is of no concern.

    At the end of the day I want the most qualified officer the Army has in its ranks leading our troops, not the one that is promoted simply because of where they went to college.
     
  13. AJC

    AJC Member

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    the 86 below the line SMC Cadets this year were in addition to the allocation, not part of it. No one was "displaced".
    I would imagine the PMSs at SMCs want qualified Officers as well. I imagine they take their responsibility seriously and do not recommend those the deem unqualified. I imagine that all the disqualifiers list above are considered when they make their recommendations.
    Perhaps a PMS from a SMC could comment.
     
  14. sheriff3

    sheriff3 Member

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    86 cadets who likely had higher OML scores had to have been displaced/bumped to make room for these SMC cadets. The Army only has X number of slots for 2nd Lts so the army had to make room somewhere or are you saying the Army created 86 additional slots to accommodate these cadets? As for not recommending those they deem unqualified... that is exactly what the PMS is doing when they recommend a cadet that is below the OML move on. The OML is the standard.
     
  15. AJC

    AJC Member

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    according to the chart posted on a similar thread it is pretty clear they were in addition to the allocation along with 24 nurses and 19 green to gold.

    edit, also I believe the recommendation is made prior to the OML being complied.

    edit, here is the link to the chart I mentioned
    http://imgur.com/7aUv91X
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2016
  16. sheriff3

    sheriff3 Member

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    At the end of the day here is what is boils down to...

    If one goes to an SMC and is below the OML and has PMS recommendation that cadet has the opportunity to go AD whereas a cadet that did not attend an SMC does not enjoy that same opportunity. Unfair..., not right...., double standard..... call it what you like. I find it difficult to believe that simply by going to a certain college one will magically be made a better officer because they received the "pass" from the PMS.

    If we want a level playing field for all and most importantly the best qualified officer possible then the SMC/PMS "pass" should be removed from the process.
     
  17. AJC

    AJC Member

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    Not sure "fair" has ever been a factor.
    Sure wasn't when I served.
    When the Service Academies mandate X% female, or Y% under represented minorities, is that "fair"?
    When stop loss is instituted and people can not leave the military, is that "fair"?
    When an Officer is separated from the service because the needs were not properly projected years earlier, is that "fair"?
     
  18. AROTC-dad

    AROTC-dad Just a dad

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    I completely "get" where Sheriff3 is coming from. Three and a half years from now, when my DS is an MS-IV, I would be sorely disappointed if he does not receive AD because of a sub standard SMC grad who is somehow given a "pass" from his PMS. But like many others here on SA forums, my DS was nominated to a SA, but did not receive an appointment. He was accepted to Plan B, an SMC, and Plan C a State University with ROTC program. He had a choice between going through AROTC at an SMC and having that "guarantee" for AD, versus going to the State University ROTC, he chose the State school route. There were several reasons for this, but I'm certain, the choice to enjoy a "college" lifestyle instead of the extreme regimentation of the SMC, played a part of it.

    My point is that most SMC's do make their cadets endure more physically, mentally, and sometimes financially for their diploma. This is the price they pay for that guarantee.

    My DS decided that he preferred a regular college life and that he will have to raise his OML and make his own guarantee. Who knows if my DS would have become a better officer as a "knob or a rat"? But there is a strong reason that SMC grads share a bond and fellowship that most "regular" schools don't.
     
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  19. AJC

    AJC Member

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    Again I have to point out, the SMC grads in question are in addition to the allocation. No one is "pushed" below the line to make room for them.
     
  20. QA1517

    QA1517 Member

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    I did not know this or if I did I have forgotten.

    I think part of Sherrif's very mild rant is that on another post his enlisted DD did not graduate from a specialty school (I cannot remember which one) for failing to achieve the required pull-ups. Nobody there was able to say "but she deserves it anyway even if she didn't meet the standard".

    But it appears that is what happens when graduates from a SMC that fall below the OML cutoff line and get AD anyways. The PMS says "well I know he/she doesn't quite make the cut but I'm gonna recommend him anyways".

    And yes they probably make the recommendations at the end of their junior year but the OML doesn't come out until the start of their senior year. Since they already have the recommendation it cannot be withdrawn.
     
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