NROTC educational delay chances

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by alpha2716, Oct 10, 2015.

  1. alpha2716

    alpha2716 Member

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    I'm a pretty smart guy. I'm in high school have a 4.0 gpa and I'm #5 out of 315 students in my class. I've heard you can get educational delays from rotc to go to med school. My question is if I'm qualified will I pretty much get the delay. A hypothetical scenario: I have like a 3.8-4.0 gpa, my MCAT scores are good, ive done well in rotcand my rotc classes, and I've been accepted into a medical school. What are my chances?
     
  2. NavyHoops

    NavyHoops Moderator

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    No one can give you a percentage. There are a million threads about getting medical school out of the SAs and ROTC, recommend you use the search function. And just a heads up... Everyone who earns a scholarship is smart. And there is a huge difference between high school and college academics. If being a doctor is the only thing you want to be and being on a ship or sub or flying a plane is not something you want to do... NROTC is not the right place to be. Being selected to Branch Medical Corps is one thing and med school acceptance is another. At USNA there is usually 12-15 a year who get it. Sometimes 1-2 of those guys don't get into med school. And these guys have crazy good stats. I have had probably a dozen friends enter switch to medical corps after 3-4 years I the fleet doing other things. There are many ways to being a doctor in the Navy, but you need to understand it is indeed rare (10-20 max a year). Also you have much less control over your speciality in the Navy. Lots of the older threads address these kinds of topics and the uniqueness of being Navg doc.
     
  3. Capt MJ

    Capt MJ Member

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    Google Navy Health Professionals Scholarship Program. Most military MDs gain a commission via this route.
     
  4. bman

    bman Member

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    I don't know about the class of '15, but for the class of '14 there were no slots offered by NROTC for medical school. My DD's company commander was the top rated midshipman nationally to request medical school and was denied. All that is to say the number offered to attend medical school varies by year and some years it is zero. NROTC's purpose is to commission unrestricted line officers.
     
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  5. kp2001

    kp2001 USMMA Alumnus

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    I'll have to ask around but I can almost guarantee you the number was higher than zero.

    In fact I know it was higher than zero because I sat on scholarship selection committees with ROTC applicants (unless my years are getting mixed up as I get older)
     
  6. bman

    bman Member

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    I may be wrong as I am only passing along what I was told by my DD, but I don't believe any midshipmen from the class of '14 were offered the option of going to medical school. The midshipman in question was the top rated nationally and was told she could not go from NROTC to medical school that year as there were no slots being offered. She dis-enrolled from NROTC her final semester of college thinking she could do her minimum years of service to pay back the scholarship and then pursue medical school and reenlist in the navy. The navy ended up giving her a scholarship from another source to attend medical school so she ended up where she wanted to be, but not through the ROTC route. (I believe as she was still going into the navy they didn't require her to pay back her scholarship).
     
  7. kp2001

    kp2001 USMMA Alumnus

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    Getting second/third-hand info is always tough, but this story just doesn't make sense to someone on the inside.

    Just pure conjecture, but she may have applied for an educational delay to not include one of the military programs and may have not been allowed to do that. Or possibly applied to a little known program called HSCP and not been selected for that. There are only 2 sources for Navy Scholarships for medical school: HPSP or HSCP. To receive HPSP as a 'ROTC Drop Out' would be very unlikely. These students also know by early senior year if they are on the 'approved list' to apply for medical school as those applications must be done in the Fall of senior year.

    I'll see if I can get hold of any of my contacts to see what happened a year ago. It's possible that the numbers were very low.
     
  8. k2rider

    k2rider Member

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    One of my DD's high school classmates had a 4.5 GPA in high school and was offered scholarships AFROTC, NROTC, and all (3) academies. Her first choice was to do NROTC at MIT but didn't get into MIT so she went into the Naval Academy. She had a 4.0 GPA at the Naval Academy, graduating in 2014 and was actually given an ED slot but didn't get accepted to any medical school. For whatever reason (I never did ask her parents), she then decided to take a Marine Corps commission. She said the 10 weeks she spent at Quantico for OCC was the hardest thing she ever did. I know she survived the process but never did hear where she ended up in the Corps.
     
  9. alpha2716

    alpha2716 Member

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    Well in that case I'd definitely like to hear from you since you've sat on selection committees for rotc. If I'm well qualified and I do everything I'm suppose to will I most likely get the delay?
     
  10. kp2001

    kp2001 USMMA Alumnus

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    Just so we are clear (I think this is what you mean though). I've sat on boards for the HPSP/HCSP scholarship, not for the ROTC scholarship. All HPSP/HCSP applicants go before the same boards, no matter the source (eg ROTC/USNA/direct commission).

    Your chances will be based on the whims of the Navy. Your best shot with those scores is to not have a ROTC commitment. As you can see from the discussion above the number of those allowed to go each year can be variable and although I doubt the number was zero it is possible for that to happen at some point.
     
  11. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    This makes no sense unless she is one insanely lucky person. In all of the years I have been here I have not seen this option offered at all. Trust me there are at least 1 or 2 threads about being disenrolled as a POC and they hand them a check. Nobody has been offered the option of enlisting. One poster was handed a 146K bill to be paid back. They too were Navy

    I am just saying that I would never suggest to anyone in this current environment that this might be an option.

    It maybe that she never disenrolled, but converted out of the scholarship.

    I know for AFROTC on this site there are several posters that did indeed got an ED, but as others have said nobody here can predict 5 years out from now.

    I would say that if you were asking about getting a law ED with a guarantee going JAG than yes, I would say 0 might be right because for AFROTC because of how the system works.
     
  12. NavyHoops

    NavyHoops Moderator

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    The 10 weeks at OCC as a USNA grad makes no sense. Confused on that one as USNA grads do not attend OCS. We all do go to Quantico for 6 months of training at TBS. If she did not do Leatherneck for her summer training then TBS could sort of be a shock to someone.

    Regardless of all that, shows how competitive Med School is. 4.0 at USNA is no joke. Shows that Med School is looking for more than just grades, there is so much more to it. Was never the route I wanted to take, but have watched a lot of my friends make it through the various Med School paths. I think my class had all of our classmates who received Med Corps slots also get into Med School. The class before us I think had 2 who did not. OP, needs to really do some research and soul searching to figure out if they serving is the primary goal or being doctor. If its being a doctor, I highly recommend to look another path as there is no guarantee ROTC or a SA will get you there. OP also needs to understand if they even get there what that career looks like, the commitment, how specialties are chosen (needs of the service play a role in this).
     
  13. k2rider

    k2rider Member

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    Yeah, that's me being confused as I just guess at what that training cycle was called after Goggling it. All I know is she went to Quantico for several months after going the USMC route after graduating from the Naval Academy. It was probably the TBS deal you mentioned.
     
  14. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    The 'TBS Deal'! I like that! :D
     
  15. bman

    bman Member

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    DD (along with other midshipmen in company - I am guessing this was a national requirement) was required to sign a paper stating "I authorize the Services to require NROTC scholarship Midshipmen who are expected to graduate within 12 months of the date of their request to disenroll, to either serve on active duty for a period specified in the Service agreement or to reimburse the United States for educational costs extended to the student to fulfill the military service obligation of their scholarship service contract." The decision of which of the two options the midshipman is offered is required to be made at flag level. Apparently the option offered in the past has always been to reimburse the government?
    When DD contracted, she signed an agreement that "I will be required to enlist in the United States Naval or Marine Reserve for a period of eight years" and that if she failed to complete her NROTC coursework and commission as an officer, that "I may be ordered to active duty in an enlisted status"
     
  16. dakine

    dakine Member

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    From what I understand as a MID parent, there are no ed delay for med school in NROTC or USNA. You will have to compete for a HPSP/HCSP scholarship (see kp2001 above). You cannot delay your service after NROTC and pay your own way to med school. But, don't just believe me - get real answers from the Navy and also look at the other services. Good luck, we need more good MDs.
     
  17. terp1984

    terp1984 Member

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    If your primary goal is to become a MD and secondary goal is to be a Navy doc, here is the route with highest probability of success. Go to a good state university and get a great GPA(3.6+), kill the MCAT(30+), get good clinical experience during the summer breaks or with a part time job during school and then apply to med school. At that time apply for the HPSP or HCSP . If you get accepted into med school IMHO it is very likely you will get the scholarship. With the NROTC and SA route there are too many other variables for success. There are plenty midshipmen that are smart enough for med school, but when there are only a few spots open a year, you would need to be a true superstar to get one of those.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2015
  18. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    I am just going to be "that" Mom now.

    I think you have to decide whether you want to serve or want to be a doctor. The reality is you are 17 turning 18. Many kids in HS truly believe down to their toes that they want to be XYZ, but once in college things change. I do not have enough fingers and toes in my family of 5, plus pets nails to count on regarding how many enter college with an intended major and actually graduate in that field 4 years later.
    ~ Typically it is the kid that enters as an engineering major where they decide quickly that although they loved AP Physics and AP Calc in HS, they hate the engineering classes.

    Of my 3 kids, only 1 stayed with his major, the other two entered with an intended major and did a hook to the right or left. My DD entered as a psych major, switched to communication soph. year. Switched to English as a junior. Got a grad school fellowship(Master of Education) and is now an English teacher. My DS2 entered as a poli-sci/govt major, switched to Chem as a soph. Now as a junior he is Bio-Chem.

    The point is they used that 1st year to stay on track for graduation, but did not have tunnel vision regarding their majors. They realized that college courses, are not like AP classes in HS. College courses compared to HS is like AP classes to 8th grade curriculum. It may be hard to juggle your academics, ROTC and social life.
    ~ Goes back to do you want to serve or do you want to be a doctor?

    My kids were top 7%, magna cum laude in HS, IP/AP/Cambridge program with a higher cgpa (No VA) and their cgpas dropped a lot more than 0.2 in college. They had above 4.0 wcgpa out of a 4.5 scale. They had APs in everything from Foreign Language to Math to English to History, plus they did jump start at the local community college.
    ~ No VA is very competitive nationally from an academic standpoint. The avg SAT best sitting (not superscore) at their HS was 1350. Key word...avg.

    Not trying to be rude or mean. Just saying that HS cgp and ranking means very little to me because there are over 2K HSs in the nation. Grade inflation occurs often in HS, not so much in college. Hence, kids freak that 1st semester at college.

    I hope you can pull that 3.8, but be prepared for it to go lower, especially if you want to be successful in the ROTC program. ROTC is not just showing up for PT and LLAB. As you progress in ROTC you will be given cadet/mid leadership positions. DS was a flight commander (AFROTC) with 25 cadets in his flight. He had to write reviews on those cadets. He had to attend additional meetings with the cadre as part of his job. In essence, it was a 20 hr a week PT job just for his ROTC position. PT was 2x a week at 6:30 a.m., but he had to be there at 5:30 for the meetings. That meant when he lived off campus he was up at 4:45.
    ~ He also was in the scholars program an juggled an internship on the Hill for Sen. Burr as a ROTC cadet.

    Again, I am not trying to rain on your parade, I am trying to illustrate what you will be walking into come next fall.
    ~ OBTW, my DS AFROTC cadet went from a 4.0 to a 3.43.
    ~~ Med schools don't want just the book smart kid, they want the same thing that the military and every college is looking for...overall. They want to see you juggle both academics and ECS. ROTC can be an edge in that aspect.
     
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  19. alpha2716

    alpha2716 Member

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    OK first off I'm very very disciplined. I am MUCH more mature than all of my peers. I don't have a history of swaying. When I get into something I pretty much stick with it. I've never ever dropped a class before. Every club I've joined I'm still in it. I'm not being arrogant I'm just saying I'm not your average teenager. I actually sometimes prefer being around adults more than my own age. And not belittling your children, but I am also very disciplined in my studies. When I say that I mean it. Nothing comes before my studies: phone, tv, friends, social life, nothing at all. I'm a very independent thinker. It is very hard to influence me- ask my friends. I can definitely say no bro I can't hang out today I have to study. So I feel pretty confident that I can keep up in college. But trust me I seriously doubt that the college classes will suck that bad that I will say I completely hate this I want to switch. I have put to much work and time into my academic life to go to college lolly gagging and wasting time, because when you really look at it changing majors is nothing but a waste of time and money period. You should have made sure you enjoy your area of study and made sure you could withstand the rigor before you went of to state. And this isn't some spur of the moment thing. I'm not one of those kids that just said hey dad I want to be a doctor "It seems cool." I have put tons of time and research into the field and am pretty sure I will stay on that pathway. I've wanted to do this since 6th grade. I - Mean - Business!
     
  20. Midwest

    Midwest Member

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    OP... Sounds like ROTC might get in the way of what you really want to do - med school.
     
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