Secession?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Melitzank, Nov 13, 2012.

  1. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/nov/12/petitions-to-secede-are-filed-for-23-states-since-/

    It`s now over 30 states who have petitions going as of right now. This article was written yesterday.

    I always thought secession was just a 1800`s fad. Apparently not.

    Something to think about is that if states do indeed secede, what will become of the people who don`t wish to secede from those states? I guess they`ll have to move to states that still belong to the U.S.

    Personally, I don`t wish to see this happen. I don`t think it will, but who knows.
     
  2. goaliedad

    goaliedad Parent

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    All the secessionists can self-deport themselves to the country of their choice and leave this one unified, thank you.
     
  3. GoArmyBeatNavy

    GoArmyBeatNavy Member

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    Its not 30 states supporting succession. 30 individuals in 30 states (assumption) started petitions and some people signed them, thats it.

    More people dress up like medieval warriors on the weekends and have fights with Styrofoam and "Lightning Bolts" than signed these petitions.

    I take the petitions as seriously.
     
  4. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    Yeah, that`s what I meant. Sorry for the discrepancy.
     
  5. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    Agreed. That`s what all the kids at my school say whenever someone wins an election that they don`t like :rolleyes:. Looks like people decided to take it a step further this time, but I doubt they`ll get very far. I hear it`s lovely weather in Australia this time of year, they should enjoy it there :yllol:
     
  6. BigBear

    BigBear Class of 2015

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    The Texas petition is the only one I have seen so far that has recieved enough signatures to warrant an official response according to the White House website. But all of this is pretty much meaningless until a state government formally files a request...
     
  7. Patriot95

    Patriot95 Member

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    Honestly I don't think these states would actually secede from the U.S. I think they are just trying to make a statement and show others that they are fed up with the direction our country is headed in and they want to turn it around. Not only that, but these states wouldn't be able to support themselves economically and it would just be a stupid idea.
     
  8. osdad

    osdad Member

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    With only a few exceptions...don't let the door hit you in the _ _ _ on the way out. :shake:
     
  9. Packer

    Packer Member

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    Why the exceptions?
     
  10. FlyingFuzz

    FlyingFuzz Member

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    Texas is the only state that is technically "allowed" to secede since it was its own nation before joining the union. I think that Texas could do pretty well as its own country as us Texans are pretty rough 'n' tough but I wouldn't want to see the union break up. I'd rather see the country turn around as a whole...
     
  11. BigBear

    BigBear Class of 2015

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    In related news, there is now a petition to deport everyone who signed the seccession petitions...
     
  12. bruno

    bruno Retired Staff Member

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    You know I like fantasy as much as anyone but this thread is just silly.this question was definitively settled in 1865, and there have been no clauses added to the Constitution since them allowing for a state to nullify an election by seceding. You win some elections and you lose some of them- learn to deal with it.
    Btw- don't know where FF learned history, but Hawaii was an independent nation for a lot longer than Texas until annexed by the US- an event mourned even today by a fair number of native Hawaiians who lost their Queen, their country and are now the bottom rung of society in the 50th State.
     
  13. GoArmyBeatNavy

    GoArmyBeatNavy Member

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    Don't forget Vermont and California. They were independent states for a time before joining the union. Heck, the California state flag says "California Republic."
     
  14. raimius

    raimius USAFA Alumnus

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    Texas does not have a right to secede. The provision was to make Texas into multiple states.
     
  15. goaliedad

    goaliedad Parent

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  16. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    Haha, that`s a good one! :yllol:

    Yep, no doubt about it, it`s just some folks who are getting a little riled up over the election. I took a look at the petitions just to see what they looked like, and about 50-75% of the signatures for each one weren`t residents of that state. Example: Virginia had quite a few signatures from people living in OK, TX, NY, etc. Very funny.
     
  17. Jason922

    Jason922 Future USNA Candidate '20

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    Secession is an American principle. Our rights are being deprived and I love that this is happening. It is in our declaration of Independence: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

    tl;dr If you haven't read our Declaration of Independence in full you do not get my response.

    Anyways, there is enough proof of tyranny in the current government. Obamacare, NDAA, TSA, Patriot Act. The more wealthier the populace gets, the less they care about their own rights.
     
  18. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    That what is happening? Pleas for secession? It`ll never happen.

    I don`t think a solution to problems we are facing is just to quit; it`s our duty as American citizens to work together to find a solution. Have a temper tantrum and basically "quitting" the United States is just...immature, IMPO.

    When the going gets tough, you have two choices: quit, or forge ahead and work together to find a solution.
     
  19. goaliedad

    goaliedad Parent

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    OK, great historian, please demonstrate how any of the laws/agencies mentioned in your post fit into any of the grievances listed later in the Declaration of Independence.

    I'll give you a hint... Note that the complaints listed were actions taken by the king (you can substitute POTUS for your reply) were actions taken outside of the written law of England or actions taken to disenfranchise his subjects.

    Is there a lack of legislative approval for any of the items you listed that would make implementation the solely the work of a tyrant as is the complaint in the Declaration of Independence?

    Is that Legislature that participated in creating any of the items you listed a body that was not elected by the people governed?

    I'm sorry. Just because you are not happy with the degree of personal liberty allowed by the people's elected officials doesn't make it the tyranny described in the Declaration. The people have spoken through electing a Congress and President and they have passed and enforced laws as allowed under the Constitution. There has been no action taken outside of these rules by any body of government (as adjudicated by the SCOTUS to date), thus the idea that throwing off the bonds of this government is not in order.
     
  20. goaliedad

    goaliedad Parent

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    Some of us like a good laugh...

    Others haven't figured out the joke yet...
     

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